As Taldren continues to polish the SFC series, I was wondering......

What do you think will be Taldren's next great game?!?!

SFT-richmlow

quote:

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Originally posted by hobbesmaster:
We all know its tribble academy (god(s?) that was hilarious!)

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If it where that simple why didn't you think of It?

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They should correct the in service date of the 2X ships until AFTER the andy war is completed, and phase out all Non-X combat ships by that time. 2X ships were NEVER meant to fight Non-X ships or even 1X ships. (Except the odd-andy that was late to the party)

Balance the X weapons.

Add the Tholians and Neo-Tholians for crying out loud, they are original TOS and actually had more of an on screen presence than the Orions did, rofl. We saw not one, but 2 Tholian ships, AND a speaking Tholian commander. All we saw of the Orions on "Journey to Babel" was an Orion made up to look like an Andorian, and the generic "glowing disco ball" starship for the orion pirate ship, lmao. Well, we did see a simulated green Orion slave girl, but that was just a human made to look like one.

Lyran LDR.

Wyn cluster.

REAL mines and minefields.

Bigger fleets that you have 100% positive control over.

RETROGRADE. RE-VER-SE. BACK-UP.

Narrow salvos for all races. (ONLY for weapons that are SUPPOSED to be able to fire in a narrow salvo, no PPD's, etc.)

Partial overloads for photons.

Crew quality. Legendary officers.

Ability to see ALL friendly ships/bases on the map (online Dynaverse) and the ability to know if they are human or ai. This IS the 23/24th century, right? We dont have to send out copies of maps and news via pony express do we?

Shock damage from heavy weapons fire on ships that are supposed to have it. KHK, BCJ, etc.

Real G racks with selective load-out, even as a proclaimed "Fed for Life" I must admit that free amd AND G rack that can fire at the same time is over the top, rofl. Or make Fed ships pay for the extra amd, probably easiest.

Require power for automatic shield regen.

Reserve power needs to be implemented.

Real cloak.

Shuttle launch rates.

I could go on forever here, and already have, but this has taken about 2 mins to type, hehe. These are in my head.

Real CVA fighter load outs. P/F's and fighters for ALL races.

Hmmm, Make it Real time SFB, nuff said.

LIMIT "SUPER SHIPS" for Kirk's sake. EVERYONE can NOT have a BB, or KHK, or BCF, etc. Put it into the code so that it can be set by server admins to only make a ship type come up every 5,10,20, etc times the spacedock cycles. THEN we will see the "Bidding wars" Taldren THOUGHT we would have, lmao.

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Also for online game it could work as it would grenerate missions and battles that had to be fought. Although I think that it would require so sort of imput of results.

Somehow I knew AJTK would be in here, plugging reverse.

My short list would be:

-Tholians (neo- and old)
-Fighters & PF's for all races. I think this would add a HUGE dimension to the game. Think of all the options all races would have to choose from at any given BPV. Plus, SCS's are extremely cool. Heavy fighters while we're at it.
-Working scouts! Scout functions = extremely cool. 3v3's would be changed forever. Don't forget EW fighters.
-An F&E-style; campaign would almost be too much to ask for.
-Andros would be nice but probably really hard to code. If I had to CHOOSE I would vote for Tholians first.

This may be all pie-in-the sky, but it's fun to talk about.

You make excellent points as well, heavy fighters, ahhh. Keep your P/F, give me an F-SCS with a full load of A-20's, F-14's and F-18's. Plus my MRS shuttles and holy of holies, SWAC shuttles. ohooohohoh, heheh.

Scouts would rock, it would give the F-GSC cruiser a REASON to be bpv 157 with less weapons than a CC.

Implement ALL drone types. Phaser drones, armored drones, ecm drones, probe drones, dogfight drones. (not fighter launched dogfight drones, but E racks with 8 DF drones, sweet.)

And of course, shall I dare to mention it, SINGLE FREAKIN INTERNALS, and Fed P/F's. Wait till a squad of P/F's with FFB firepower run you over with O/L's, rockin!

I want to see ALL the suggestions in the previous posts.

But I'd like to see it in this order:

SFC3 Andro Invasion (with Tholians)
SFC3 expansion: early years (odd, I know)
SFC4 Next Generation
SFC5-8 Omega 1-4

Notes:

Early Years - very easy to do. Not too many new models needed. Not too much new coding, mostly restricting things like overloads, or variations on a theme. Disruptor cannons and nova cannons are almost disruptors and fuzion beans, for example.

For Next Gen, I'd still like to see an "v.early/early/mid/late/adv" sort of era scheme. I tend to think of distinct technology eras in Star Trek:
- pre-TOS (new "Enterprise" series era)
- TOS era (Early to Mid era)
- movie era (Mid to Late)
- Enterprise-B (Captain Sulu) (Late to Adv)
- Enterprise-C (Yesterday's Enterprise) (X2 era)
- Enterprise-D (X3 era)
- Enterprise-E (X4??)

Everything from Star Trek 6 forward could be covered in 1 game.

Damn, why didnt anyone think of that when they made SFC from scratch, with NO outside source material that could be applied to "ANY ASPECT of SFC"?

Hehe, I agree 100% Cap'n, individual fighters would be nice, and pretty obvious when you think about it.

F+E is great, having an F+E companion to an SFC3 game would be killer.

Good riddance to magic photons. Just give me back my expert crew and legendary weapons officer so I can get a +2 to hit, no matter WHAT the range or EW levels, MWA HA HA HA! THEN see them cry and cower as I RETROGRADE before them, firing photons that DO HIT past range, um, zero? (Not even always at zero, even with o/l's, however THAT is possible!)

But we wont get anything that is close to SFB based. It will move FURTHER away from its SFB roots, and Taldren WILL be hurt by that fact.

I saw another thread where Bruno said that there have been more ppls to buy SFC than EVERY bought SFB, combined. I should like to see numbers on that, very much so. What was it SVC said to us earlier this year, in response to Harl about SFB's sales? Something like 500K plus copies of SFB have been sold? Now that ADB has their own website, AND SFC has Cadets SFB on the cd, I wonder how many MORE peeples have gone out and taken the SFB plunge?

Hmm. I would guess that all 3 SFC have combined sales over 500K, I can buy that. But how many of THOSE sales were peeples who bought it ONLY because it was based on SFB, thereby making it an SFB sale, and not a Trek sale?

REVERSE, its not just for sport coats anymore!

You have to rememebr the people you see on this board are not representitive of the average customer...the % of SFBers here is much higher.

You have to remember that board games do not sell anywhere near computer games. They have a low cost to make and a very low profit margin. It a really tough business.

However, if they have sold 10,000 copies of the core books every year since, um 1980???, thats only just over 200,000 copies EVER sold. Many of those players are die-hards that buy multiple editions over the years. I myself have bought the Designers Edition, and then the Commanders Editions, and then the Captains Editions, and lately, the Y2K revised printings.

I can believe that 500K have been sold over all time, but I still would not put the total population of SFB players over the 30k mark. Thats 6% of the 500K figure.

We're very elite, I guess. Or very crazy. We are five ten-thousandths of 1% of the population.

Jinxx, HOW MANY copies of all SFC products have sold, and do you have estimates of the number of total players and total online players that play these games?

W.

You have to remember that board games do not sell anywhere near computer games. They have a low cost to make and a very low profit margin. It a really tough business.

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Joshua Morris
Senior Designer/ Producer
www.Taldren.com
The Art and Science of Gaming

Jinxx;
So what your saying, is that of the ppls who buy, play, love and care enough to plague these boards with complaints, the majority of them are SFB players, is that it?

Now just from my TOTALLY uninformed opinion, would it not be better for a company to make a game that slants TOWARDS what the majority of their biggest fans (the ones who come on here EVERY day and post constantly till you guys are ready to shoot them)since you know they are going to be repeat sales and the lics will get you more sales?

Im not trying to get into a pissing contest with anyone, you guys have the keys, and can ban my ass right now, I realise this.

But certain Taldren employees have made statements concerning the interaction between SFB and SFC that are well, to put it bluntly, non-intelligent. To say that NO part of SFB can be applied to ANY factor in SFC is so obviously incorrect as to make me laugh, but I know the person meant it.

What are all the bickers and gripes mainly about here? "ESG should be this way, because it was that way in SFB."

When you balance things, what do you guys try to do? Make it work more like SFB. (Hellbore costs, higher plasma hold costs, even now, as compared to SFC1 and early SFC2)

When you move away, what happens?

MAGIC PHOTONS.
The rise and fall of the plasma torpedo:An Analysis.

Things of this nature.

Of course PC games sell better than board games, to an exponential level, and well they should! Wargaming was a relatively small crowd, even back in the day before the pc. But how many ppls DONT have a PC now? And how many kids dont play games on the PC? There are entire companies that design systems (Falcon~Northwest) just to PLAY games, and entire industries that deveop hardward to PLAY games (3D cards, Thrustmaster, etc)

Isnt starting up a game, building upon, (Modifying really, SFC uses so much SFB as to be obviously nearly identical to a Non-SFB/SFC player off the street)a game that has been in production and actively sold for 20+ years a HUGE boost to your market and assured sales?

Lets be honest, Trek is NOT the main reason ppls buy games. If that were so, every Trek game that came down the pike would be a huge smash hit and break sales records, for we KNOW Trek fans are Legion.

But the VAST majority of Trek games, virtually all in fact, EXCEPT the SFC series and Voyager:Elite force (and thats the quake crowd mixed with all 12 fans voyager had) have SUCKED, HARD.

I hope SOMEONE at Taldren DOES "give a rats ass" about SFB as I wish to see you keep putting out the game I love, SFB on the pc. But if it were to head the way it appears SOME at Taldren wish it to, it would no longer be SFB based and there would be no reason for the SFB fans to keep buying it. Imagine these forums without SFB fans crying, pleading, flaming, trolling, etc. Yeah, that way it sounds good, doesnt it? Quiet, peaceful... Uninhabited by the helpful SFB fans who are happy to do YOUR job and instruct newbies to the series in how to play the game, why this works like it does, etc. Not quite as good as it sounded at first, eh?

The SFB ppls keep coming here and bitching, those that bought it because it said Trek on the box come here, leave a nasty message and delete your product. Your publisher got their money this time, but will they the next? The magazines are hard on the SFC series, due to the bugs, but here we sit and wait patiently (for the most part) for patches, news, etc.

Is there a point to this? Somewhere, I will leave you to take make what you will of it, its just the crap that falls out of my pie-hole.

Bottom line, we are Loyal fans, please dont crap on us. (that is not directed at you, J, as I am sure you know.)

Forget I said anything, J, if you even read it.

quote:

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Originally posted by AJTK:
a bunch of insults

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My oh my.

You know, what I actually said was "Just because it was that way in SFB" isn't a good enough answer for any part of SFC. Which is true.

But really, what does that matter to you? I've got nothing against you. I haven't said anything negative about you. I tried to discuss the subject with you. And yet you respond with insults. Obviously you're not looking for discussion. You're looking for a fight.

Well, I have no interest in arguing with you. And to be honest, since you're apparently incapable of talking about something without insulting me, I've no interest in discussing anything with you, either.

So, ok. Flame away if it helps with whatever's bothering you. But don't expect any rational reader to interpret insults as anything like an informed opinion or clever discussion. So by all means, flame away.

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Scott Bruno

Never underestimate the power of a dark clown.

The Andros would add spectrum of tactics. Plus non-SFB people would have a hard learning curve trying to figure out what to DO with 'em.

Priority Two: Tholians. Web caster interface might be a little difficult, but if you just had a selector for length, direction, and strenth, it could work. Plus options to use it as web fist and snare. Tholians are good because they tacticly different, AND they were in TOS. This is a good thing for non-SFB people.

Priority Three: Real option mounts. As in, you can change the weapons on Orion ships. Maybe call the nose and wings mounts heavy and light, to avoid confusion. This could be an option in a redone spacedock.

Priority four: That redone spacedock. Have options like more stuff like extra deck crews added to the misc section. Redo the missile screen so we can have stuff like ECM drones, phaser drones, armored drones...maybe set it up so the player can chose three different misile types, plus normal explosive, so the player can switch between the different kinds he bought. Nad while we're at it, reduce greater missile speed costs back to standard so they won't be a huge waste of BPV like now. Add a seperate ship selaction screen in from space dock for PFs and Andro satellite ships. This way player would know more exactly what they're picking. Hmm...maybe put fighters on this, too, again so people know what they're getting.

Priority Five: Fighters and PFs for everyone expect the Feds, who get heavy fighters instead of PFs. And casual mech-links. Who wants a pair of PFs on thier C7!

Priority SiX: Real fleets! With real fleet control! How cool would it be to let people play out an 800 BPV battle, with REAL fleets instead of two battleships or something? Firing fourty proximity photons at something, and watching it go BOOM at range 30 is nice. Stuff like a 'do as I do' button that has the AI tail you precisely,, and fire the kinds of weapons you do, when you do, would really help fleet control.

Priority Seven: I'm geting kinda pie-in-the sky here, (I have been since about three or four, too. ) but an F&E; game would be much fun. Also, an AI run F&E; engine could make for a MUCH more realistic Dynaverse.

Priority Seven: This one is is scarily less pie-in-the-sky, but I do think Taldren should consider it *after* the stuff above is dove, except maybe for seven. TNG-TYPE ships, but BALANCED, with VARIETY. If you do this, stick in a preferably in an entirely seperate game, and be sure that the numbersof ships are compareable to the numbers in SFC now. This will be VERY difficult to do right.

quote:

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Originally posted by What's_in_a_name:
I thought that with the recent experiences here that Taldren could make a totally new genre of games; the first person whiner or FPW. It would be sorta like the FPS games but instead of actually running around in the game you character would sit in a room at a computer and try to out-whine other characters about the game they were trying to play in the game. Scoring would be based on how annoying and non-constructive the whine. There could be an online version, call it the Whiniverse, where everyone goes online in the game and tries to out-whine everyone else. Of course there would need to be some system of balancing so that the photon whining factions don't just steamroll every reset of the Whiniverse.

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Do you get extra points for cheese?

Great game, despite the unnessecary moves away from SFB that have caused problems.

But if I understood you right, you still say that no part of SFB can be applied to any part of SFC. I have to disagree with you, and obviously we should leave it at that.

Sorry for poppin off, I really do love the game, obviously for differing reasons than you.

As this is an apology, I wont use my sig this time, but I will in the future, just didnt want to give the impression that I was waffling on my opinions.

Excuse me, I have to go take a cold shower now...

What they should do (barring the above): Stop screwing around with rules just because they CAN. That is the bar none WORST reason to change anything in ANY game. Stop making changes just because Race A has more players and can whine louder then Race B (Read as Feds not wanting to learn power management).

Stop saying that one of their most vocal and experianced groups of players doesn;t mean anything (SFB players).