Carol Off
This season counterSpin welcomes the return of Carol Off as the host of CBC Newsworld's flagship debate show.
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Carol Off

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Adrian Harewood

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Colman Jones

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Program Archive
Wednesday, May 5, 2004.
Federal Health Minister Pierre Pettigrew caused a ruckus by saying private health care delivery is not incompatible with the Canada Health Act. While Pettigrew later tried to backpedal, claiming he had been misunderstood, his comments have left many wondering just what the government's policy really is. Are public-private partnerships, two-tier health care and other such initiatives threatening the public health system? With an election call expected any time, a special town-hall edition of counterSpin debates the future of Canada’s Health Care System.

Watch this episode Online! Part One, Two, Three, Four, in rm format.


Wednesday, May 5, 2004.
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These dicussions are moderated: Abusive, racist, sexist, or otherwise inflammatory language will be removed without warning.
Typical Canadian Apathy
by CitizenXYZ on Monday May 03, @04:16PM (#6045)
User #1902 Info
Post a topic that provides even the glimmer of a hint that US bashing might be a sub-sub-sub-topic and the floodgates open up. Even before the show is aired.

Post a topic that provides the slightest notion that truth can be gleaned from the Middle East crisis and posts as long as many university thesis' are soon to follow. Most undefended and really only probing at "Versions" of the the poster sees it.

Post a topic of central importance to Canada...all I see is white space.

Thank goodness Counterspin is cancelled. It's not a Canadian show anyway.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
How can private health care cost less?
by bahram on Tuesday May 04, @10:38AM (#6052)
User #1925 Info
I keep hearing that private health care will give us better service and cost less?

So i decided to add things up.
In order to give better and faster service, private sector has to buy more equipment and hire more doctors and nurses. All of which will cost money, lots of it.

There are CEO's who are expected to make tens of millions of dollar per year.
Then there are owners or share holders expecting great return on their investment.
Don't forget insurence companies, we know them. They won't be happy with less than couple of billions per year.

May be i need to take math101, but i cann't see how private health care be better and will cost us less.

It is amazing, we have problem paying couple of dollars extra on our taxes to get better public health care but we are ok with pating hundreds of dollars to insurance companies for private health care.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
Previous post
by H-Bomb on Tuesday May 04, @12:44PM (#6058)
User #1705 Info
You don't need math 101 you need Econ 101 & 102. It's a basic concept though. Public institutions spending public money with no accountability for moneys spent, or inefficiencies, are the breeding ground for bloated, useless, money sinkholes.

That's why communism failed. It's a fundamental lack of incentive to continually achieve efficience due to a lack of market competition that causes this public healthcare problem.

Two questions:
1) how long has it been since some sort of nurses/healthcare workers strike in your province? A year or two? Do you know the wages and benefits these people earn and are unsatisfied with?

2) you ALWAYS hear about how underfunded healthcare is. Do you think it will ever be funded enough to shut these people up? No amount of money will ever be enough.

The problem is inefficiency not inadaquate funding. It's ridiculous how much money is spent and wasted that would not be wasted had these instituitions had some form of accountability and competition.

It's the eternal drive for profits that will cure this hemmorage of cash. If there is no incentive to cut the fat why should they? If you knew you could keep your fat gov't pension, guaranteed wage hikes, sick days, holidays, overtime pay,job security all without having any motivator to work harder would you work harder?

Solution: Make public health employees compete for jobs in an open competitive market. If the public health employees are always bitching about how the gov't isn't paying them what their worth why do they so strongly object to healthcare going private and letting market forces truely pay them what they are worth?????????
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
Direction and Funding for health care
by Pat on Wednesday May 05, @08:00PM (#6086)
User #1995 Info
The root cause of the health care decline in Canada is funding, pure and simple. The reason for that decline is free trade.

Something no media outlet ever talks about is the distribution of tax revenue. In 1980, before free trade came in, Federal revenues were basically 50/50 between personal and business taxes. In 2000, that had drastically changed. Personal income tax made up 85% and business only accounted for 15%. The trend still continues today as free trade pressures force governments at all levels to reduce corporate tax or risk having businesses leave the country.

The race to the bottom, that so many (business) pundits said could never happen, HAS already happened.

One must also remember that Mr. Paul Martin is a trilateralist. His goals are one and the same as the trilateral commission and its relatives, the Builderberg group and the council on foriegn relations.

Take a GOOD look at the history of health care funding and legeslative changes since free trade started and you'll see the real direction of federal and provincial governments. To make public health care so unpaletable that Canadians will beg private enterprise to take over.

NAFTA permitted Canada to keep public health care under one condition - that no "For Profit" health care is to be allowed. If we allow it then public health care instantly becomes an illegal subsidy.

Now take a look at your provincial politicians that want "for profit" clinics to open and allow people to pay for surgeries. They give lots of excuses but the real reason is to abrogate the NAFTA conditions and allow HMOs to take over under NAFTA rules with WTO and world bank backing.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
US spends 300% more on health services
by jrm on Thursday May 06, @12:51PM (#6098)
User #1880 Info
"A new study published by the New England Journal of Medicine says Americans spend an astonishing 300% more on administrative costs to run their private health care system than Canadians spend to administer the public medicare system the government has operated since the 1960s."

This study really should put this debate to rest. I'm really starting to think there's a conspiracy to privatize every public service society has to offer. Pat in the post above mine made some really good points.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
When did we bocome so selfish?
by bahram on Thursday May 06, @01:48PM (#6099)
User #1925 Info
I am reading reponses and all I see is, why Should pay for some one elses health care cost? How awfull our nurses are for asking for 2 to 3% pay raise and beeter job condition?

Wake up people. Where is your sense of community.
We are suppose to help each other to make the whole socity better.
I, my self do not have a kid but have no problem to pay and improve our education. I am very healthy but i have no problem to pay and make our health care system the best in the world.
And last not least I prefer to see 10,000 hard working nurses get extra 2000 per year rather than seeing a Lazy CEO make 20,000,000 per year.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
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