Interesting and hot debate about damp walls. Perhaps some additional remarks out of my experience by restorating old buildings in good old Germany are making sense:
1st There is no rising damp in masonry walls because there is no capillary transport between fine pored stone and rough pored mortar. Even if the stones are standing in water for centuries:
2nd We have god experience by using clay to waterproof the exterior walls - that works through centuries until a silly man throws it out or hurts the layer by bringing in pipes/tubes in incorrect ways.
Clay is a perfect and cheap waterproof layer, if it is enough densed and solid and safed against washing out by rain. It shall not have too much sandy aggregates in it and you can waterproof artifical lakes / water basins in gardens etc. with it - the traditional method.
How to get rid with damp walls in old and historic buildings in Germany you can read here: Damp walls - what to do
Hi Richard, yes it is. I suppose, that you've been there sometimes (in army?). I live in County Lichtefels, just 50 km from Bamberg, where I as responsible architect have restorated some Borgerhauses from late gothic. Two stand above the Town Hall just near by the river Regnitz, and naturally they didn't have had any damp-proof course - and didn't get one by restoration in the 80s. And still are dry onto now.
No, I have never been to Bamberg, but I have a dear internet friend who lives in Hallstadt and works in the newer Rathaus. I recognized it from pictures she has shown me.
Best regards out of Tobyhanna, Pennsylvania USA!!
Richard
Posts: 294 | Location: Tobyhanna, PA | Registered: 24 October 2005
Vertical cracks,step cracks,horizontal cracks, 1 video there is some lateral-hydrostatic pressure pushin` wall in a bit,some Above-ground entryways,mold and possibly radon `n insects BUT no, doesnt wanna wateproof, the answer always is gutters gutters gutters,downspouts `n downspouts WRONG answer Bob!
had 1 person contact me who stated they would not be too concerned about a handful of BBB complaints agst a company and thats part of being in business etc and hey thats fine...do `n believe what ya like.
notice Bruno Building has a 'handful of complaints' against it, take a good hard look at these homeowners
if you have water on your bsmt floor coming from the bsmt wall or coming from the cold joint then 90% of the reason water is getting in is from OUTSIDE cracks `n other openings in the bsmt wall and/or openings above ground level `n you must go Outside to Stop this water from entering.
NO Inside drain tile method or baseboard dewatering system on the PLANET stops/prevents water from entering through Outside openings.
BBB lists 14 complaints last 12 mth, 26 last 36 mth with 'Satisfactory record'....so as Jodie Foster says in Contact "Yer OK ta go" i`m ok to go, i`m ok
Posts: 194 | Location: Michigan | Registered: 24 August 2005
Near end of Vid Larry says, Any seepage that comes through the wall(Da crack)will trickle down behind the Bright wall paneling into the Waterguard and diverted to the s-pump, and thats glorious...and probably will keep water off most of the floor but what about the water still entering through the Crack?
Hey, there`s a crack in the dang poured wall...Hello? Water will still enter through the crack behind their Bright wall paneling, ever hear of Mold, Radon? STOP water from entering stop/prevent Mold, of course no one will see any mold behind the Bright wall paneling but sooner or later yer gonna get a good wiff of it . If you have a plumbng or roof leak, do you 'Divert' the water or fix the leak? Come on
And what about the homeowner`s who have poured Bsmt walls pushing in, block walls bowing in...due to lateral `n hydrostatic pressure `n maybe roots that is Outside agst the walls,huh? What about block walls that will deteriorate with water running into and through them over time,huh?
Posts: 194 | Location: Michigan | Registered: 24 August 2005
Couple settles w/company over leaky waterproofing http://www.wate.com/Global/story.asp?S=1685787 please read last few parag`s, notice the owner of company Changed `n submitted Different contract to court which said "NO Warranty"
looks like they are co`s who only or rather do an inside system.he says he fixed his problem for about $600 and i`ll 'guess' he really 'only' needed a sump pump to...control the water level under his bsmt floor so the water wouldnt accumulate and rise up through any openings in Floor, good for him.
If part of his problem is-was due to outside crack(s) & other openings he 'will' begin to see/smell mold,or possibly if there was/is any pressure agst the outside of bsmt walls he will begin to see some wall movement(if he can SEE the walls,Paneling up?) `n he should get radon test.
Estimates from all inside co`s would only give anyone a 1 sided view as to how to go about fixing the problem, lets see...in Pennsylvania-according to BBB
-Basement Doctor 83 complaints last 36 mth
-Desert Dry 11 complaints last 36 mth
-Vulcan 9 complaints last 12 mth
-Mid Atlantic 34 complaints last 36 mth
-Springfield???
..as always, these are my own views,opinions `n common sense. and as always,these companies & any others noted in my shtt may be the very best in the world and maybe not, you decide
If your asking me if its possible to get brick & block deterioration, mold,efflorescence from above ground and below ground cracks & openings, i`ve answered this often, yes.
Is it then also possible for a 'wicking' effect....certainly, we see it occur quite often. And it also occurs when homes are built with cheap/porous bricks.
What i did find a tad interesting with that link is that, as soon as i click it the first things i see are advertisements from Basement waterproofing/diverting co.`s. Those include Mid Atlantic,Basement Doctor,Atlantis,Value dry etc. And hey, thats fine, nothing wrong w/ advertising right?
What is it your trying to say Konrad? Do you disagree with what i`m stating? You don`t like me, ya think i`m a fool,thats it right?
Nobody is making you read my posts, if you dont like the merry-go-round then don`t get on
BG`s....Walking back to Waterloo again, where do i begin? In the brand new street you can get a good seat at the end
1st Many Thanks for your post, thought sometimes, its automated text, but now I know, you're real ;-) By reading your post I have to commit: I feel very fine today because I think it's worthful to change out thoughts and experience just with you. I never found such a hard text against wrong practise in your country ever before, and believe me, I have looked for. Congratulations! and I hope, you've a fine day also!
2nd I like your comments, even if their mass is seeming to build a tower like in old Babylon so high. Shall it perhaps become a lexicon? So let me please contribute another topic or point of view of damp in the walls.
3rd As I have read all (!) your posts (without learning them by heart, sorry) I thought, why not continue this thread with a debate under 'experts' so as I estimate you (no joke at all!!!)
Even if my english comes from school and not so huge practise
4rd You don't like the commercial attitude of my site by advertising? So I have to explain, that Google gives in the business links in the advertising blocks by own responsibiltiy (= none). And my opinion is, that everybody of my visitors is free in decision, wether to follow the advertising links or my often/mostly/everytime completely opposite advice (what I suppose as really funny).
Didn't you notice this and won't you agree with this point of view? Otherwise I have an additional remark - did you ever notice all the advertising in the forums you use as platform? Don't bother?
5th What do you mean by 'wicking effect'? Do you think, that a masonry wall can be compared with a wick only because it looks like rising damp and salts on the wall and if you analyze the material, there is water and salt in? Here I want to contradict. But first, will you do me (and the audience) the favor to describe, how 'wicking effect' should work in your opinion? It would be great and we could discuss this - but only if you want to discuss with a strange german like me ;-)
Yours sincerely, and please forgive me, if I made you some bad thoughts. Maybe my slightly ironically tune is not good in my english or at all. Perhaps I thought, you like such stuff as you take use of it by yourself. I promise to stop it.
Konrad - This a wicking effect? What do you mean by looking to it?
- Damp weather in good old (or perhaps filled with bad guys?) Germany too
No advertising here, as w/yours i did notice Tim @ da builder who also doesnt care for inside system/methods, pretty much the same companies advertise there which fine, its just there is such a barrage of the same shtt, on Tv,radio,internet etc.
IMO.... people w/plenty of cash trying to twist `n turn things for self interest `n gain, and to me its like trying to control the publics perception & minds about what exactly is best for their basement leak/wall/mold/radon/efflorescence etc, know what i mean? Check that, its not like, it IS! Its an awful lot of advertising which costs LOT`s of cash `n where is that cash coming from.......thats right!
wicking equals capillary action is word that stuck w/me from my earlier days
What I read in the Aussies text: 'Capillary suction becomes stronger as the pore size gets smaller.' Thats correct. And therefore it will be a capillary rising of 0,00 if the next pore size is bigger than the first. What means, that the rest of the text you can forget, what belongs sayings about 'Rising damp'.
So there can not be a 'wicking equals capillary action' from stone with normally small pores and mortars with bigger ones. Thats the reason why the building standing in water like Bamberg Town Hall and every harbour wall will not show any rising damp, besides the tide and flood levels.
maybe i was a lil generous to what-how some may view my wicking equals capillary action.
sure,imo there can be rising damp as a few may call it...but i also view wicking as kind of a 'falling damp', with water entry through mortar joints,porous/cracked bricks etc the water which enters will work its way....'down' through inside of bricks,blocks where efflorescence/mold will be visble on inside of basement.
When you say cannot be wicking from stone and 'mortars', i say why not? Whose to say what 'size' the openings between stone are? Some can be big as you say but other openings in the mortar certainly can be small,depends.We`ve seen small openings in large mortar joints,know what i mean? Salts may be carried up and down. How much up, i couldnt say w/certainty, as for wicking downward...quite a bit!
If you look to the pore-systems of stones and mortars very detailed by SEM (scanning electron microskope), you'll find out that mortars have everytime bigger pores than stone. German scientific research has proven this, I do quote it in my website Pore system and rising damp.
So the capillar resistance of mortars is always too high to suck up water from stone pores by capillarity. Another cause is taking water by pressure or by capillarity in cracks between cementous mortar and stone in the joints. But thats not the topic here.
Please try out by yourself - everybody can test it by this way:
Otherwise the gravity will hinder capillary transport in mortars more than a few centimeters high. That also everybody can try out in his own home.
In looking at most of those pics there are problems above ground and below ground, water/moisture has been `n will continue to enter until these problems are fixed,several different things going on,obvious. More efflorescence mold etc will occur....just going to get worse. what would you say...what would you do to solve? Efflorescence can be present from several factors, its 'Not always' because of openings etc that shoud be fixed regardless.
Sure, if water is allowed to repeatedly beat against an area of bricks coming off a roof, out of a downspout etc then this is one way for efflorescence to appear.
Same thing say if water from a sprinkler system is allowed to soak-wet an area of bricks every other day, week after week....ya know, Keep the dang water from repeatedly hitting the house! But that water from the sprinkler, or water on a wind blown rain can`n will enter through porous-cheap bricks,open mortar joints,around windows and certainly through cracks `n other openings in basement walls and cause efflorescence/mold/dampness/water etc to occur, happens all the time my good man
Are you saying this isnt possible?
I`m just saying what i`ve seen with my own eyes over many years. When a homeowners ONLY problem was say...some open mortar joints or loose bricks on the outside and Directly on the inside of bsmt one could see efflorescence `n some dampness on longer-heavier rains, that by fixing the bricks or joints was all they needed.
Have many homeowners who got estimates `n were almost bs`d into inside baseboard or drain tile method w/sump when their ONLY problem was a few Above ground openings on the Outside through which Water/Moisture was entering and causing water on floor-wall/dampness/mold/efflorescence/paint peeling etc etc on the Inside of basement. Unfortunately...Many HAVE been BS`d out of thousands.
My specialty is stopping water from entering basements through cracks & relieving lateral-hydrostatic pressure agst outside of bsmt walls etc...Waterproofing. To honestly define then solve a homeowners leak/seepage problem & NOT to BS them into more than they need or into a method/system that would be much easier for me `n my guys to install AND make more money on each job.
Sure, if the problem isnt the bsmt wall or other outside openings i`ll be the first to let them know they need to snake through the storm trap and/or have a sump pump or 2+ installed to control the water level under the bsmt floor.
They, like others do waterproofing and mold-mildew removal/remediation
Just below their diagram they say "this is our signature solution to most basement water problems" and that it...Stops...ALL...the Ways and directions by which water can enter your foundation....right???
Their signature solution is...Their Unique sub-floor water management system!
Well, i got news for them...NO sub-floor management system on this earth can STOP Water from Entering through Cracks & Other openings in basement walls or above ground openings in mortar joints windows etc! It`s IMPOSSIBLE! You MUST go Outside to seal-fix ALL outside entryways which is....Most people`s problem.
Why don`t they just simply say these inside drain tile and baseboard dewatering systems 'divert' the water that Will Still Enter through Outside cracks `n other openings....UNDER-ALONG the floor into a sump, cuz thats Exactly what they do. And if one doesn`t STOP water entry then one will NOT stop/prevent Mold,radon,termites etc from Entering. And lateral & hydrostatic pressure that is Outside agst Bsmt walls is.....still There! C`mon baby....get real, be 100% truthful to the homeowner for krist sake.
....says permanent solution, a permanent solution to what? Diverting water that is still entering? It`s not a permanent solution for mold,radon etc either dang it
....approved method by VA,HUD etc? Approved to do what? Keep water OFF the Floor! NOT to STOP Water from entering through cracks etc.
....is substantially cheaper? Compared to who? Compared to what? I`ve repeatedly seen from many homeowners the Estimates from Many Inside co`s......its very often as much if not MORE!!! Yeah, if an Inside co gives a homeowner an estimate for an inside method AND what THEY would charge for an Outside method, sure.....i`d bet they pop the outside method UP dramatically cuz they really don`t or rather NOT do the Outside method. Don`t BS me guys, been around a looooong time
.....disturbing landscaping other shtt? What EXACTLY do they consider disturbing? Taking a bush+ out `n replacing it? Cutting 18-24"...thats INCHES, off the driveway? And hey...if the homeowner wants to STOP Water from entering `n stop mold,radon and relieve any pressure some have agst outside of walls then....so what if they lose a bush or 3! Its WORTH it don`t ya think? krist, wake up.
BBB shows 5 listings that i can find, 2 (same address) have 0 complaints another says 4 complaints in last 12 months,another says 7 complaints last 36 mth and yet another says 14 complaints in last 36 mth
Maybe all these complaints here all are bogus, maybe NOT! Same with all other companies i`ve posted.
So when they say...outstanding reputation or total focus is customer service-quality workmanship and member of whatever supposedly orginization Claims to have High Ethics and Standards can they prove it instead of print it-claim it? and note that in...
2. Quality workmanship heading "We have 100% success rate-no job we have ever done has failed".....what da crap are they talkin` about?
Sure its failed, thats why 'some-NOT enough' Homeowners make Complaints!
#5. Lifetime guarantee...on Exactly what? Does ANY company who does an inside system guarantee that NO water will enter the basement walls? That Mold will not begin to grow/get worse behind any sheeting some of these companies place agst inside of bsmt walls? Or behind paneling-drywall? And what abour Radon etc? And they say waterproofing companies come `n go which sure is true,`n they are a stable company & maybe they are but it sure looks like their busniess start dates listed on BBB in NJ and MD were in 1999 and 1998. So....being in business 6-7 years IMO doesnt define stability, especially wondering about amount of complaints in that period of time.
I have yet to hear from 1 homeowner who had, NO water coming from bsmt wall,no mold etc BUT ONLY had water coming up through cracks in floor etc that ANY Inside company who was called over for estimate recommended to... FIRST have a plumber come over and snake through the storm trap etc to see if that would solve the problem, this is quite often where blockages Under the floor are which if not solved can allow water to accumulate and back up and rise Under the bsmt floor and come UP through floor cracks & other openings in bsmt floor, NOT 1. Why do you think that is....yup, thats right.
-why are there cracks in my basement walls and floors?
-should i have my walls excavated and treated from the exterior? Ha...."in MOST situations we DON`T recommend it....very expensive.....Most Exterior treatments FAIL!....walls were probably treated when home was built (hey , if walls were treated its called Damprrofing NOT Waterproofing and 99% of the time walls are NOT backfilled with peastone/gravel from footing to within few inches from grade) and....."Wall treatment cannot stop water entry from hydrostatic pressure" ?????????????????????? What kind of hydrostatic pressure and lateral pressure might MOST folks experience? And What EXACTLY can HELP? read on....
I have been researching this subject quite a bit, and everything so far I totally agree with. I just wanted to say that I very much appreciate everything you have typed so far. and also appreciate the links provided concerning efflourescence (hope i spelt that right) and radon gas.
Thanks again.
Posts: 1 | Location: North Dakota | Registered: 17 December 2005
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water=mold
STOP water from entering stop/prevent Mold, of course no one will see any mold behind the Bright wall paneling but sooner or later yer gonna get a good wiff of it 
. If you have a plumbng or roof leak, do you 'Divert' the water or fix the leak? Come on
- This a wicking effect? What do you mean by looking to it?
- Damp weather in good old (or perhaps filled with bad guys?) Germany too
, if walls were treated its called Damprrofing NOT Waterproofing and 99% of the time walls are NOT backfilled with peastone/gravel from footing to within few inches from grade) 
