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Rumsfeld's Ray Gun

By Kelly Hearn, AlterNet. Posted August 19, 2005.

A non-lethal -- but potentially harmful -- crowd control weapon that heats human skin is bound for Iraq, and possibly to a police department near you.

A tough-talking Texan named Edward Hammond has to be a key element of any accurate study of the spooky history of what the military calls the "Active Denial System."

The head of The Sunshine Project, a Texas-based group opposing biological weapons, Hammond shows his disdain for military excesses through swear words and federal disclosure suits that seek to lift a window on military science projects. Two times now, he says, Marine Corp staff handling his Freedom of Information Act claims have mailed him the wrong envelope, mistakenly sending him materials meant for another military office, envelopes that contained classified information.

One of those times, he says, was in May when he received 112 pages of files on the Active Denial System, or ADS, a crowd control weapon built by Raytheon Corporation and slated for military deployment in Iraq in 2006. The documents included descriptions of tests conducted on volunteer subjects at Kirtland Air Force Base in New Mexico. Hammond, who had requested the documents, noticed something odd. "I saw some of the documents that were marked classified should have been redacted," he said in a telephone interview.

The Secrets of 'Active Denial'

The Active Denial System is a Pentagon-funded, $51 million crowd control device that rides atop a Humvee, looks like a TV dish, and shoots energy waves 1/64 of an inch deep into human skin. It dispenses brief but intolerable bursts of pain, sending bad guys fleeing but supposedly leaving no lasting damage. (During a Pentagon press briefing in 2001, this reporter felt a zap from an ADS prototype on his fingertip and can attest to the brief but fleeting sensation that a hot light bulb was pressing against the skin). ADS works outside the range of small arms fire.

After a decade-long development cycle, the ADS is field ready but not free of controversy. Military leaders, as noted in a recent USA Today article, say it will save lives by helping U.S. troops avoid bombs and bullets in urban zones where insurgents mix with civilians. Temporary pain beats bullets and bombs, but Edward Hammond's files have rekindled scientific questions about how the classified system works, what it does to the body and how it will be used in the streets of Basra or Baghdad or, one day, Boston.

As key scientific questions go unanswered, a version of the Active Denial System is being developed by the Justice Department for use by U.S. police departments. The National Institute of Justice, the research arm of the Department of Justice, has issued a half-million dollar grant to Raytheon Corporation for a "Solid-State Active Denial System Demonstration Program," according to the NIJ website. Alan Fischer, a Raytheon spokesperson, said the company is "working on a number of active denial projects, with various ranges. ADS may some day be miniaturized down to a hand-held device that could be carried in a purse or pocket and used for personal protection instead of something like Mace. The potential for this technology is huge."

The DOJ isn't the only one excited. The Department of Energy is experimenting with ADS as a security device that would "deny access" to nuclear facilities.

For most Americans, zapping Iraqi insurgents in Baghdad with a potentially unsafe weapon is one thing; cooking political protestors in Boston or Biloxi will surely be another. Against this backdrop, observers say, Hammond's files become particularly important. "Right now the press really isn't on this," says Hammond. "But that will change when the first videos are released showing this thing being used on people."

Far from a national security breach, Hammond's documents do offer a small but worrisome glimpse inside a weapon that appears to be slipping beneath the scrutiny of a lethal world with bigger priorities. In July, New Scientist magazine reported on the files, citing red flags that troubled some scientists. Though the ADS, for example, will be facing chaotic, unruly situations, the reports said volunteers were banned from wearing glasses and contact lenses to prevent possible eye damage. In other tests, volunteers were told to remove metallic objects such as keys to avoid "hot spots" that might burn skin.

Neil Davison, an expert in non-lethal weapons at Bradford University in England, reviewed the files and questions how ADS would perform in live conditions. In email interviews with AlterNet, Davison, a social researcher with biology training, pointed out that one section on medical risk analysis states that "exposure levels [of energy waves] may exceed permissible exposure limits specified by the relevant safety standard by as much as 20-fold."

What millimeter waves (MMW) do to the body depends on the dose. And about that, Davison and other experts have questions, lots of them. How do operators control the dose that an individual receives? What is the safety margin, rather, the difference in exposure time between it being an effective weapon and it being harmful? Does the weapon cut out after a certain time to prevent overexposure? What about people targeted at different distances? How do operators avoid unintentionally overexposing people at short ranges when aiming at long range? And what of individual differences in health, age, and sensitivity to MMW?

"What public information will be required before it is deployed to control riots on the streets of Seattle or Boston?" Davison asked.

Military spokespeople are silent about the weapon's specifications but dismiss claims that glasses and other everyday objects present dangers. Rich Garcia, press officer at Air Force Research Laboratory's Directed Energy Directorate at Kirtland Air Force Base, said he was safely zapped by the weapon while wearing contact lenses and clothes with zippers. When asked about the weapon's safety margin, Garcia said he could not give specific times or exposure levels but added that "the safety margin is determined by a variety of factors, including the power of the system and the amount of time for each exposure. The operator is key to ensuring that a person is not over exposed."

But what about the eyes? The military's fact sheet for ADS cites a low risk for blindness. Experts such as Dr. Henry Lai, a bioengineer at The University of Washington in Seattle, agree the possibility exists. "Hitting the eyes of a subject and causing corneal damage could be a concern," he said. "I doubt very much a subject once hit can close his or her eyes fast enough to prevent extensive damage, since the reflex is triggered by pain. That means the response would be too late."

Long Term Problems

Aside from thermal injuries like blindness or burns, could a protestor who got zapped by an overzealous ADS controller eventually wind up with disease such as cancer? Another way of stating it: Do millimeter waves at the frequency of 95 gigahertz cause long term biological changes unrelated to heat?

The military says no. Others aren't so sure. And these things are often hard, if not near impossible, to prove.

In 2004, a North Atlantic Treaty Organization report on non-lethal weapons raised warnings. "The long-term physiological effects of the microwaves received by an individual are still being studied (maximum acceptable dose, cumulative effect of successive exposures)," the report states. "The absence of definitive results is the main obstacle to the use of radio frequencies." The report goes on to note that "excessive power levels can have serious consequences for human targets."

These concerns were already being voiced in 2001. Days after ADS was unveiled, Professor Ross Adey, one of the world's leading bio-electromagnetic researchers, told UPI (in an article written by this reporter) that he believed the device could lead to cancer or cataracts, especially if the subject already carried an illness made worse by the beams. Adey, who died last year, was a professor of physiology at Loma Linda University Medical Center in Loma Linda, Calif, a fellow of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences and a former professor of the Royal Society of Medicine. He said Russian studies in 1980s, as well as his own research, showed that millimeter waves at some frequencies have a non-heat-related impact on white blood cells.

Adey noted that Soviet researchers have used millimeter waves in experiments designed to treat diseases including skin disorders, heart disease and cancer, suggesting that therapeutic benefits raises the specter of potential hazards if a subject is overexposed. Specifically, Adey said his work showed that radio frequency and the lower microwave range effected enzyme systems that regulate growth and division of white blood cells. He added that while the ADS does not employ those specific wavelengths, no scientific evidence exists to prove that millimeter waves could not cause similar damage.

Marvin Ziskin, a medical doctor and researcher at Temple University who studies the bio-effects of millimeter waves of different frequency said the weapon's 94 GHz "could affect enzyme systems within the skin on a short term basis," adding, however, that there are no known long term effects. Ziskin said the military can't say for certain that the device has no long term bioeffects, adding, however, that "this could be said about anything. Science can not rule our the possibility of future harm from any environmental stress. Nothing can be claimed to be absolutely 'safe.'" Ziskin also said it is "probably true" that the vast majority of the scientific literature on bioeffects research on 94 GHz comes from researchers associated with the Pentagon's weapon development program.

He says, she says. Who can know? Can the Pentagon's claims be verified?

Davison, for one, says not likely. That's because the majority if not all literature detailing research on the bioeffects of the weapons' specific wavelength (95 gigahertz) appears to have been conducted by researchers linked to the Pentagon's weapon development program. In an ADS fact sheet, the Air Force says a panel of non-governmental scientists and medical experts reviewed bio-effects tests on humans. When asked for the names of those experts, a press official at the Air Force Research Laboratory's Human Effectiveness Directorate at Brooks City Base, Texas, said experts were not immediately available to answer. The Air Force's Garcia said he knows of no independent research. A Marine Corp spokesman said the Joint Non-Lethal Weapons Directorate, the military organization in charge of ADS, is "unaware of any release of classified documents or information relating to Active Denial System."

Kelly Hearn is a former UPI staff writer who lives in Washington DC and Latin America. His work has appeared in the Christian Science Monitor, American Prospect, and other publications.


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Sci-Fi Horrors Becoming Reality
Posted by: Merchant_Of_Menace on Aug 19, 2005 2:14 AM   
Just like invading Martians with heat rays, this new development, if true, could possibly spell the end of the ballistics age, ushering in yet another step in humankind's race to find more devious ways to destroy itself.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

Most of you won't agree, but...
Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net on Aug 19, 2005 2:23 AM   
I believe it is more important now than ever that we establish our absolut rights given in the Second Ammendement. The "king" has, and will, unleash his weapons against the people! Peace, Tom

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: Most of you won't agree, but... Posted by: Samantha Vimes
» RE: Most of you won't agree, but... Posted by: montana freeman
» RE: Most of you won't agree, but... Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
» live by the sword.... Posted by: Michiganman
» RE: live by the sword.... Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
something like that can not be safe.
Posted by: Samantha Vimes on Aug 19, 2005 2:48 AM   
It will heat metals causing hot spots? So people with shrapnel, prosthetics, and jewelry will face potentially dangerous burns.

What about people with pacemakers?

People with chronic pain problems know the effect of a 'minor' injury can cause their overall levels of pain to flare up for days.

Will there be any way of proving this weapon has been used? Or will their be covert deployments every time a few people get together to try to keep a tree from being cut down? Or maybe they will just aim it down the road a bit from Crawford.

I don't like the notion of *secret* attacks. A groupd of Canadians have recently found out officially that the US tested Agent Orange on them.

There are practical benefits to a non-damaging weapon, but the dangers to freedom are frightening.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

Active Denial?
Posted by: Tom Degan on Aug 19, 2005 3:28 AM   
I'll make any of you a little wager: When this thing is finally available domestically, they'll only send it to police departments in the blue states. Any takers?
Tom Degan
Goshen, NY

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: Active Denial? Posted by: cyclone
» RE: Active Denial? Posted by: heatherj
» RE: Active Denial? Posted by: Tom Degan
» RE: Active Denial? Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
» RE: Active Denial? Posted by: doctordee
Posted by: adp3d on Aug 19, 2005 4:12 AM   
I guess I'll have to make sure I'll never be in a place where this weapon will be used...like a war protest or a post victory celebration for my schools basketball team!

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Making it More Powerful Already?
Posted by: andercitizen on Aug 19, 2005 4:37 AM   
This "new" weapon sounds like a beefed-up version of a weapon already in production by a company in Anderson, Indiana. That one, "The Dazzler," uses directed energy to "temporarily" blind a subject. This one will produce burns and God only knows what else.

It looks as though the age of the Jetsons has arrived. "ZAP 'EM" - "BURN 'EM" - what the hell, "they're only Iraqis. Or now, Americans who happen to have located themselves on the "wrong side" of the political spectrum.

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Posted by: Barbara on Aug 19, 2005 5:28 AM   
What is wrong with you Americans ? Get off your butts, petition your local people in power, demonstrate, ...just get the heck away from your TV's and hit the streets in protest that these weapons can/will be used on ANYONE! Regardless of whether it's an Iraq, an Afican, and Black American, a white American.

It's all so crazy, and all I hear is complaining and moaning about your liberties being taken away from you. If you want freedom and liberty, then you have to fight to maintain it. Don't expect anyone else to do it for you. It's your country !! Stand up for it against your politicians and corporations !!

If you sit around complaining for too much longer, you won't even have the luxury of doing that either.

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» RE: Barbara Posted by: Bernie
» RE: Barbara Posted by: Samantha Vimes
» RE: Barbara Posted by: Scott
Another likely use
Posted by: cyclone on Aug 19, 2005 5:48 AM   
How long do you think it will be before they have some low ranking soldier in a court martial for using one of these things on a prisoner in Gitmo or Abu? Genius technology in the hands of the vile will always produce unwanted results. I suggest they should first try it on White House staffers and residents, Without allowing them to take off glasses, remove contacts or anything else from their persons. After they wake up, and if they are still able to see, they'll probably all say, "Cool. Let's use this in the War on Terror!" Why not save all the R & D money and just build one giant microwave oven to march people into? Something similar to the "Orgasmitron" in the Woody Allen movie, What You Always Wanted to Know About Sex but Were Afraid to Ask? Oh, I guess it's too late now. Money is already gone. Sounds to me like they are building a non-lethal weapon that will keep terrorists alive. Does that mean that they are doing what they have always falsely accused us of, like "giving the Terrorists some Psych courses and release them on the world at large, like some black plague?"

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» RE: Already in preparation Posted by: Swatopluk
» RE: Another likely use Posted by: lamy_chop
» RE: Another likely use Posted by: Shehova
» RE: Another likely use Posted by: heatherj
» RE: Another likely use Posted by: montana freeman
mad as hell
Posted by: sanitysojourner on Aug 19, 2005 5:59 AM   
Barbara's point should be heeded, although this isn't necessarily the group of folks who need to get off their duffs. A great lethargy and disinterest about the immoral acts of this country are simply slipping by most Americans. We need to wake the dead. Until we do -- and get a dem majority somewhere in Congress -- the hands of politicians who would agree that this weapon is stupid, irresponsible and immoral are tied. It's been well demonstrated that they can't even get a hearing.

These administration clowns don't know and never plan for the consequences of their actions. There are a myriad of medical conditions that could render someone critically or fatally injured. Example: Lupus is a connective tissue (that means skin, among other major organs) inflammatory auto-immune illness. Cook that skin (stateside of course) that is already cooking, and you've got a very badly injured person with a risk of dying. Just one example.

And wait until the NRA lobbies for the right of ordinary citizens to bear yet another arm . . .

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Have some Perspective
Posted by: FCAlive on Aug 19, 2005 7:35 AM   
These are alternatives to guns.

I do not want weapons being use more often because they are non-lethal, but as an alternative to bullets, this seems like a step in the right direction.

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» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: lamy_chop
» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: Robespierre
» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: Habaro
» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: heatherj
» RE: Have some Perspective Posted by: Roverton
In Boston
Posted by: nanobubble on Aug 19, 2005 8:07 AM   
In Boston they can't even use pepper-spray and rubber-bullet projectile weapons considered 'less lethal' without killing people.

Therefore, there will be many deaths unless this is outlawed before responsible testing and regulations are applied can be developed. Historically speaking, it's more plausible the responsible bit won't happen.

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These weapons have been in development since the 80s
Posted by: battzedek on Aug 19, 2005 8:30 AM   
Hey all -- a story about a new Pentagon "non lethal weapon" you should know about, since the likelihood of this system being used on protest marches within the next two years is very high. This microwave-based "crowd control" system is part of a series of weapons that were clearly being developed in the 80s using various protestors as guinea pigs, including women at Seneca Women's Peace Encampment and Greenham Common, as well as folks camped by the nuclear testing grounds in the west. After years of taking surveys of personal experiences with these, the peace groups studying the weapons, which we called "zapping" for lack of a better name ("active denial" never occured to us!), a pretty clear list of symptons arose, which varied widely by individual and length and intensity of exposure, including:

burning or hot sensation on skin

ringing or pain in ears (the dogs would whine and scratch at their ears even if we "heard" nothing)
dizziness or disorientation

interrupted menstruation, including resumption of bleeding in post-menopausal women

from Greenham, reports of miscarriages

violent and terrifying dreams, including dreams of doing explicit violence to others in the immediate area

nervous and immune systems disorders

mood swings (we all joked about "happy stoned zapping" and "hostile paranoid zapping," but the effects were real, and would stop as soon as one left the field of attack, such as walking or driving a short distance from the land, unlike the grumpy moods brought on by collective meetings, which lasted for hours and could be carried away with one....)

severe headaches which would also cease upon leaving the active field

increased and lasting sensitivity to certain things, such as florescent lights (Peace Camp women had a tendancy to become disoriented when shopping for food in the mega-stores with acres of these lights, and it wasn't just from the culture shock after being on the land), certain chemical smells, etc

After leaving the Peace Camp, I never spoke much about these experiences, because people generally treated such comments as the thinking of conspiracy-freaks. But the group who did the study worked hard on it for several years, and had a lot of documentation which they had to work very hard to get. Now, 15 years later, the stuff is finally public.

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Posted by: Coleman on Aug 19, 2005 8:32 AM   
How much money did we spend on this? I wonder how much better our (peaceful, USEFUL) public infrastructure would be if the federal gov't didn't spend its billions on these horrible toys.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

Posted by: nakis on Aug 19, 2005 8:55 AM   
What's the problem? This is from the Pentagon. Haven't they proven themselves time and time again to be honest, trustworthy and wholely supportive of humanity?

I can just hear the right wing justifiers. 'Hey, we just used some heat on the protesters. We didn't kill them'.

You know they are going to use this crap on peaceful protesters that are being too effective. And then they try to portray themselves as nice guys for using something like this.

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"The Press Has Already Been 'Nuked' "
Posted by: monkeywrench on Aug 19, 2005 9:13 AM   
"Right now the press really isn't on this," says Hammond. "But that will change when the first videos are released showing this thing being used on people."

No –– it won't.

Do we see the carnage in Iraq? No. Do we even see the flag-draped coffins returning from there, or the amputees? No. Are we told the truth about the REAL numbers of dead and wounded from Iraq? No. Did we get the truth about our draft-dodging, deserting President? No. Did we get the real story behind the lies that got us into the death-spiraling quagmire in Iraq? No. So, what makes anyone think that the bought-and-paid-for press will do its job in the future?

If the recent past is any indicator – and there is no reason to believe that it won't be – the only citizens who will find out about this weapon will be the ones cooked by it.

And what makes anyone think that those who would use this weapon to microwave their fellow citizens will give a crap about "safe dosages?"

Keep your eyes peeled (if this weapon doesn't do it for you) for the first signs of a Pentagon version of Skynet, possibly heading our way in the decades to come. High-altitude, remotely-piloted weapons delivery systems are already in the Pentagon's pipeline. . . .

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

Posted by: Jimbo on Aug 19, 2005 9:18 AM   
I say quit with all of the doomsday, oppressive, big brother talk. Does any body here really know enough about the potential pros and cons of this technology to form staunch opinions?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: Jimbo/been there, done that Posted by: sanitysojourner
» RE: Jimbo Posted by: MT512
» RE: Jimbo Posted by: Bernie
Sublte bio-electrochemical energy
Posted by: claw on Aug 19, 2005 9:26 AM   
Western science, including its medicine, knows little about the operation of subtle bio-electrochemical energy, including how it works in humans. That's why Western medicine, reductionist and materialistic, still does not understand how homeopathy works. These so-called "non-lethal" weapons have the potential to be hugely dangerous and slowly or maybe not-so slowly kill. We're talking quantum physics here, sub-atomic energy.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: Sublte bio-electrochemical energy Posted by: montana freeman
non-lethal weapons in Iraq
Posted by: LoisC on Aug 19, 2005 9:30 AM   
The U.S. has been using various weapons for mind control to have people freak out and kill others or in the case of Bagdad to riot and destroy hositals, etc.

American Mind Control in Baghdad
Spooks use technology "proved" on one-million dead Africans

I remember when I was a kid and living in NJ there were riots with the blacks in a nearby town. It never made sense to me that these people were burning down their own businesses during the riots. Now that I am much older and have learned about our gov't dirty weapons and the use of mind control techniques, I'm pretty sure it was tested back then in areas of New York and N.J. on those black communities.

There is no doubt these and more of the same type weapons will be used against us as more and more people wake up and understand what this new one world gov't is all about.

And the more people are convinced there are people to hate the more effective their mind control will work. We have to stop hating people and not become desensitized to having anyone killed for any reason.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» BWAHAHAHA! Posted by: memerot
» RE: BWAHAHAHA! Posted by: Habaro
Ray Guns
Posted by: biff777 on Aug 19, 2005 9:47 AM   
This ray gun has already been introduced to the people of Seattle. After WTO the police indocrinated the public on local news that this device will be used against us. Remember WTO where 2 city council members were attacked by the authorities.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

Cortex Bombs: A Safe Alternative!
Posted by: MT512 on Aug 19, 2005 11:07 AM   
At birth, put a teeny-weeny remote-controlled bomb in the cerebral cortex of everyone born in the US and its occupied territories (Iraq, for one) and in all allied nations we can bend to our will. Each bomb transmits its unique identity so our honorable public safety officers and brave troops can target specific evildoers. Of course, they could also be activated en masse when groups of America-hating, terrorist-supporting, God-loathing, baby-eating, left-leaning evildoers act together for misdeeds such as peaceful protests. Push a button and the bad people just fall dead to the ground, never again to poison the righteous with their differing opinions.

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What's all this talk about Rumsfields Gay Run...
Posted by: kelly.nickell on Aug 19, 2005 11:23 AM   
I have a friend that spent his formative years living in Mountain View, California, in the glide path for C-5's at Moffett Field. He worked for a company that was developing radar technology for the military and which happened to be in a testing phase at Moffett. One of the things that he and his partners in crime did on a regular basis, ostensibly to further the development of said radar, was to float Mylar balloons out of the fire vent in the roof of their lab, then they would time the controllers response via phone calls to see how well it was all working. Unfortunately, they never bothered to tell anyone at Moffett what they were doing. The phone calls were placed to other parties in the military chain trying to figure out just what the hell they had all over their radar screens.

While my friend tells me this as if it were fact, it all sounds a little dubious to me. I think he even wore Jiffy Pop pan popcorn attached to strategic parts of his body on various occasions as a kind of radiation detector when working on microwave antenna projects.

Forgive me; I am just having fun thinking about how we can protect ourselves with Jiffy Pop when the jack-booted thugs of this administration start leveling these things at all of us heretics. Not to mention, since this administration seems to hold no real affinity for science, or its tenants, I am laughing even harder at the looks on their faces as the peer over this magical thing that may look just like the picture in the article and go for a price tag of, say, $10 million a unit, courtesy of Raytheon.

I would buy one to see that look on Dubya’s Alfred E. Newman mug.

Price of 1 ea ADS unit - $10,000,000
Price of 1 ea ADS mind control option - $1,000,000
Price of watching Karl Rove trying to use it – You guessed it.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

That one movie...
Posted by: Michiganman on Aug 19, 2005 12:16 PM   
That does it. Remeber that movie where the family in the 50's mistakenly thought the nuclear holocost had began and spent the next 30 years in an underground bunker under their house. That's what I'm gonna' do, it's coming to that. C ya' in 30 years! Just kidding of course,that's what Bush wants us to do, bury our heads in the sand...what was the name of that movie?Anyone remember?

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: That one movie... Posted by: Robespierre
» RE: That one movie... Posted by: Bernie
» THANK YOU Posted by: Michiganman
No Lasting Effects? Come on.
Posted by: haystack1317 on Aug 19, 2005 12:23 PM   
When they began testing radioactive materials they vastly underestimated the longterm effects on those exposed. This is cleary the same type of situation. If your nerves are affected to the point of causing such severe pain, they're trying to tell your brain something. What they're trying to tell your brain is, "Whatever's happening right now, it is really, really bad for you." If they need proof that damage is being done, they only have to look at how the weapon works. It is undoubtedly harmful to cells that send such strong panic signals to the brain. Does anyone actually believe you can heat cells up to that point without affecting them?

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Just what we (don't) need....
Posted by: hotlipsin61 on Aug 19, 2005 12:52 PM   
Leave it up to the United States to be at the forefront of weapons technology. A new toy to hurt people. I guess bullets and bombs aren't enough to do its job.
This is another gadget we don't need, but then again, it's a defense company, and they're not out to make baby strollers.
When it comes to hurting people, the Unites States has no equal. This toy Raytheon has developed reminds me of an old song line by Chicago: "...New ways to kill us, and tell us dirty lies...."
Although this weapon PROMISES no fatal wounds, it could lead to an onslaught of lawsuits should this gizmo severly injure someone and if the weapon falls into the wrong hands.
Oh, well. Give me the U.S. flag and I'll shut up.

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

pearl in co
Posted by: Pearl in Colo on Aug 19, 2005 12:59 PM   
The very worst part of all this is that no one seems the least surprised. I have read nothing that indicates that anyone doesn't believe it. In just a few years (at most) we will be hearing about the thugs (non-government type) assaulting people on the street or in their homes. The makers will nod and say, "what can you do?'. and the gun activists will tell us that all have the "right' to own this new and improved weapon.

The fact that the government will be after anyone in a crowd, what ever the side of the spectrum, since the government will eventually change, is too awful to contemplate. no authority ever gave up a new toy/weapon to my recollection and never refrained from using it.

Good luck to us all; even the "righties" will feel the sting one day. Too bad we can't find the $$$$$ to fund No Child...( some of us call it NC Left With a Dime)!!

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» RE: pearl in co Posted by: Samantha Vimes
this weapon doesnt scare me
Posted by: flatulence on Aug 19, 2005 4:04 PM   
this weapon is a nonlethal weapon. if its used on criminals and terrorists, so what. police have a right to go home to dinner at night with the wife and kids. the police rights trump criminal rights

[« Reply to this comment] [Post a new comment »]

» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: flatulence
» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: tkd82arty@netscape.net
» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: Samantha Vimes
» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: flatulence
» RE: this weapon doesnt scare me Posted by: hotlipsin61
How very funny (odd) this is ...
Posted by: Lindie on Aug 19, 2005 4:26 PM   
You know, I subscribe to "New Scientist", and also got notification on this weapon back in early April from some scientific colleagues of mine from my former DOE employer in New Mexico. I immediately sent what I had along to the ACLU, several newspapers, a couple of peace groups, and a couple of other civil rights organizations, voicing my concerns and asking them to look into it. This is the FIRST comment on it I've seen since. Now I'm REALLY worried: this weapon will be put in place in every law enforcement agency in the country, before the public is aware.

And, since several new laws are being snuck through congress right now, which are placing serious restrictions on the public's right to assemble (especially if the participants are young and non-white), I rather expect to see some serious incidents involving the ADS by Christmas in DC, Philly, and possibly NYC. Sooner, depending upon how much crowd control someone might believe is needed at - a concert, say ...

Be afraid, people - the original deployments were expected to not occur until next June ...

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All the non-lethals kill - this one looks worse
Posted by: dancerkc on Aug 19, 2005 4:58 PM   
All the so-called non-lethal weapons kill. These have been under development for years. Nothing new, but very seldom talked about. Tasers kill. Even sticky strings to bind up people can cause other problems which can lead to death, such as by asphyxiation. Generally less than bullets.

However, this microwave weapon opens a whole new range of cooked up lies. Dosage is a massive problem here. There are any number of problems from specific individual medical conditions, to items on or in the person, to size, to gender, to current condition to how deeply grouped the persons are and how long the people in front stand before falling, etc.

Then there are the changes in the skin caused by the application of microwaves which may allow further usage to cause deeper penetration - since these specs may be relevant for initial application rather than repeated or extended application.

Dosages will be hugely variant. Which means we will have permanent damage and deaths, especially because the troops and local cops (never trust either) will use this more because the claims say "non-lethal." That reason for indiscriminant use of Tasers is why Tasers have caused so many needless deaths.

And from here, it is only a short step from "Pain" setting to "kill" setting. Same gizmo and ramp the power. Much harder to run out of that kind of ammo.

We need to go back to the days when London's Bobbies were started. Deliberately going out into the violent streets without weapons other than their brains and persuasion. Criminals respected that. Bobbies took pride in that. And until recent events, I was very impressed with London Bobbies after living there for a while when I was in the Air Force years ago. When I got back to the US I was amazed at how overbearing and thuggish our cops suddenly seemed compared to the bobbies.

In the late 50's a HAM friend of my uncle's showed me the inside of a transceiver to explain the (then) new microwave ovens. Radio operators had noticed flies, etcetera, getting zapped, he said, as they flew in the area of certain components.

What killed flies yesterday will kill people tomorrow. Just a matter of when

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another issue
Posted by: Samantha Vimes on Aug 19, 2005 11:26 PM   
When this *is* used on protesters, the news footage will show people suddenly running wild (to get away from the pain), stampeding, possibly breaking windows (because the exits are covered) and writhing (in agony). The police will declare the footage to prove the people were on drugs, dangerous, violent and reckless.

Those who know better will be a minority, and considered lefty wingnuts for giving the "crazy mob" the benefit of the doubt.

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» RE: another issue Posted by: Jarnsaxa
» RE: another issue Posted by: scsmith
Zap'm Back
Posted by: brisa on Aug 20, 2005 7:14 AM   
It is my understanding that the microwave rays cannot penetrate aluminum. The thickness doesn't matter. If one were to wrap aluminum foil around a corrugated cardboard sheild and held this sheild with aluminum impregnated gloves, one would be totally protected and indeed reflect the waves back to their source.

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» RE: Zap'm Back Posted by: Roverton
Dangerous Weapon
Posted by: worksg on Aug 20, 2005 9:04 AM   
I'm a retired electronic engineer who worked for Raytheon for 15 years.

I believe that the main danger from mm-wave exposure is developing cataracts, much like looking at the sun. The cataracts may not develop for a year or so after exposure. Metalized sunglasses might offer some protection.

Metals don't absorb mm-waves and get hot, they reflect them like a mirror and may create hot spots in nearby tissue. Clothing made of aluminum window screen, metallized plastic, metallized threads, or carbon fiber thread might offer inexpensive protection against the weapon.

A corner reflector, like an inside corner of a cube, is used to reflect microwaves back in the direction from which they came. A good one can be made from three square aluminum window screens. It may discourage anyone using such a weapon.

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» RE: Dangerous Weapon Posted by: ascot
» RE: Dangerous Weapon Posted by: worksg
» RE: Dangerous Weapon Posted by: Jarnsaxa
In existence..
Posted by: optic.ghost on Aug 20, 2005 12:37 PM   
This technological development shouldn't be a surprise to anyone seeing how it was already in existence. The only problem with this scenario is that it's now being proactively used by our government.

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a NATIONAL POLICE FORCE is the goal and this will be a tool of it
Posted by: ChrisBieber on Aug 21, 2005 4:27 PM   
A National Police Force...like the Federales in Mexico and the GESTAPO of Nazi Germany...this is the almost completed goal...Dept of Fatherland Security...

This tool WILL BE USED...of course it will...all the malcontents and antisocial misfits and TRAITORS need to be controlled... just think...with NATIONAL IDENTITY CARDS and GPS Chips and RFID readers and THIS WEAPON..no more protests...

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Posted by: Epiphany on Aug 22, 2005 11:56 AM   
I live in Louisiana and have known that the military was developing some type of heat system. I know this because during the course of four months I noticed some very strange occurances within a four mile stretch on the interstate. There were several car fires and three eighteen wheelers including an auto transport truck all burned to the ground. One of these eighteen wheelers had a burn directly in the middle all the way to the ground as if it was burned with a laser. This was strange enough, but when I questioned several state highway patrolmen that patrolled that particular area of the interstate, they all said that they had not heard anything about this. Strange....One of the cars burst into flames right in front of me and burned up completely within a matter of minutes. And when you drove through this area the hairs on the back of your neck and arms tingled. And they say this is harmless?

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These weapons now available for hate crimes and "revenge"
Posted by: debs99 on Aug 24, 2005 2:43 PM   
This is from a real ad on the internet:

"24. HOW TO MAKE A STUN GUN     $5.00

So you want to zaaaaap the $hit out of someone? Well, we have just the thing. It delivers a nice little shock of 75,000 volts. And also causes wicked, muscle spasms! sounds like fun, huh? Also included, plans to make a modification that disguises it as a flashlight. How to test your new toy on an unwilling subject—if he goes into a convulsion, twitching, muscle-lock, and starts foaming at the mouth, you might want to tune it UP just a little bit, until you hear your subject go 'BOOM'!"~  (copied word for word from http://www.theinformationcenter.com/ )

These weapons are available now. They are being used by hate groups, criminals, intolerant neighbors, stalkers, connoisseurs of "revenge", and various other sick and twisted types. The fact that they are so easily available on the Internet says there are customers for them, and at least some of those customers can be assumed to be using them. Yet only a couple of states--like Michigan and Massachusetts--have passed laws against them. The discharges can go right through the walls of a person's home--just like a cell phone.

Anybody can get these weapons (or plans for making them) off the internet (from companies with such innocent-sounding names as Plans & Kits Unlimited, Brandon Enterprises, The Information Center, Information Unlimited, and Consumertronics). In the US, it is almost certain that they are also "available" at gun shows and right wing meet-ups.

Why is there so little known about hate and revenge crimes committed with these weapons? I have tried to find statistics from the FBI/DoJ, and they are not to be found.

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Already being used
Posted by: deeptea on Oct 1, 2005 8:07 PM   
A person at UAB Birmingham was attacked with this in May 2000. When he sent an email to his friends, people including his doctor thought he had gone crazy. He was picked up by police on phony charges and sent to mental ward. Now police stalks his car with impunity. Welcome to police state.

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Posted by: TKO on Mar 19, 2006 2:55 PM   
If keys and metal objects heat up, they are using microwave energy. Close exposure to microwave transmitters can cause leukemia and cancer. Sounds like there is no consideration for long term health risks to people they use this device on. Why not go ahead and hit them with a dirty bomb or X-rays if you are indifferent to the health of your target. This device sounds like its exactly what the Shrub administration would support and promote.

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The trouble...
Posted by: jwgauld on Mar 20, 2006 9:15 AM   
with nonlethal weapons is that the goverment can slap down any protest wihtout faceing the outrage that a lethal responce would provoke.

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