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Vereen arrested after fight

University of Tennessee Police Department officers were responding to a fight outside Gibbs Hall early Monday morning when freshman running back Daryl Vereen was arrested and charged with public intoxication, according to the UT police report released Tuesday.

“... at about 0304 hours this officer responded to a fight in progress consisting of an estimated 10 people outside of Gibbs Hall,” the report reads. “Upon my arrival I noticed several subjects fighting in the fire lane of Gibbs Hall. Upon getting out of my vehicle the subjects begin to break it up and return inside the dorm.”

The report goes on to state that Vereen was noticed trying to get into the driver’s side of a dark blue Jeep Cherokee that was parked in the fire lane outside Gibbs Hall. After several requests from the officer to stop were unheeded, the officer caught up with Vereen, the report states.

Vereen was ordered out of the vehicle.

“Mr. Vereen had a bloody lip and had a strong odor of alcoholic beverage coming from and about his person and breath. His speech was very slurred and he had blood shot eyes. ... Mr. Vereen was unsteady on his feet,” the report states.

Vereen was taken into custody. An unidentified friend drove his car to a legal parking spot on campus. The keys were later returned to Vereen.

A release is expected from Tennessee football head coach Phillip Fulmer this afternoon.

This is the second incident in less than two weeks concerning UT’s football program.

Freshman receivers Gerald Jones and Ahmad Paige were charged with misdemeanor possession of marijuana following a traffic stop Jan. 11 in the Fort Sanders area. Police found marijuana in a vehicle driven by Jones, 18, and registered to Paige, 18.

Freshman defensive lineman William Brimfield and Jameel Owens, a wide receiver from Muskoegee, Okla., on campus for an official recruiting visit, also were in the vehicle.

Neither Brimfield nor Owens was charged.

© 2007, Knoxville News Sentinel Co.

       130 Comments

Posted by thesavageorange on January 22, 2008 at 12:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Alcohol and a fight?Who would have thought that?

Posted by Volchaz on January 22, 2008 at 12:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This type of thing must really impress all the recruits we've been bringing in. I'm sure they are thrilled with these young men and their actions. Way to roll out the red carpet boys.....

Posted by VOLstuckINky on January 22, 2008 at 12:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)

All over some 18 yr old scank.

These guys have to realize that UTPD are out in full effect and that you will get busted. Not condoning acting a fool, but boys will be boys. They seem to think they will not get caught and that they have nothing to lose.

Posted by KingsportVol on January 22, 2008 at 12:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

He wasn't fighting Herschel Walker #3 or he would have more than a busted lip and hurt feelings.Get it together man.Everybody makes mistakes.Stay inside next time.
Go Big Orange!!!

Posted by raleighncvolfan on January 22, 2008 at 12:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Where is Brent Schaeffer and his baseball bat when you need them?

Posted by goeltzd on January 22, 2008 at 12:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Where's Finch when she's needed?

Posted by DennisVols on January 22, 2008 at 12:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)

This kind of publicity can and will be used by other coaching staffs recruiting against UT to try and convince the parents to not allow their kids to attend UT. "Lack of discipline". "dangerous situations", “illegal drugs" are just some of the terms they will use. These players need to realize that poor decision making has far reaching consequences beyond just their personal life. Being a part of a team means just that and everything you do effects everybody and everything about that team.
According to the story he was about to add DUI to it. If he had started and drove away it also could be considered avoiding, evading arrest.

Posted by rodneyadms on January 22, 2008 at 12:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I can't understand why these kids don't learn from previous players mistakes....idiots...

Posted by VolinSippi on January 22, 2008 at 12:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Sounds like UT is on the verge of imploding due to lack of discipline. I hope Fulmer can get this under control. Punt him off the team and hopefully the rest will take notice.

Posted by bolton on January 22, 2008 at 12:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"the officer caught up with Vereen". Does the officer have any eligibility left?

Posted by volmattna on January 22, 2008 at 12:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

utpd give these players a break

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 12:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Bolton: good one

Posted by thesavageorange on January 22, 2008 at 1:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bolton, agree w/ TJ very good.

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 1:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I can't believe we live in a world where kids on their own for the first time in their lives could possibly come across alcohol, get rowdy and fight. This is just awful and I'm sure it doesn't go on anywhere else in the country.

Posted by ctownvol on January 22, 2008 at 1:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Bolton- I did some research. The officer is 5'11" 205lbs. He runs a 4.6 40. Out of eligibility. Played at Furman 99-02. From what I hear he was a pretty good safety back in the day. I see you were wanting to know, so I figured I would ease your mind.

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 1:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bolton.

I third that. That guy must be fast as blazes!

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 1:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Any other surprises on this one?

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 1:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Instead of "stay the course" we should say, "Return to course."

Posted by vols10623 on January 22, 2008 at 1:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

dennis it said drivers side not drivers seat, lets hope he wasn't about to drive. i don't get it, what is this a cop trying to make a name for himself? what about the other 9 men? Vereen had a bloody lip, he was obviously assaulted?! find the person who beat up our player (was he wearing a florida jersey? ha ha) do cops not remember the days of college? some things are so small yet blown way out of proportion. and now ESPN will have a field day with this. great

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 1:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Had great hopes for Vereen but this sounds alot like what Schaeffer got the boot for...

Posted by GerryOP on January 22, 2008 at 1:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

And the beat goes on ... it's only January!

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 1:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

vols10623, Nope. The kid is on scholarship and has been told that he must promote the image of UT football (not necessarily in those terms).

He should be expected to conduct himself much better than this.

I think this has gone beyond some standard misbehavior. They've thrown guys off the team for this type of thing.

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 1:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The KNS does seem to have outscooped all other news sources for this tid bit! Return to course!

Posted by orangebloodgmc on January 22, 2008 at 1:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hopefully this would be first time Vereen has been in any trouble?

Posted by pms151 on January 22, 2008 at 1:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yea looks like the KNS finally outscooped someone. Wonder who they were drinking with last night. Buddy Holly scooped it too. OH BOY...here we go again.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 1:29 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Just curious. How does an event like this actually get to the press?

Posted by Volalumnus on January 22, 2008 at 1:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Wonder why most mature adults don't have these problems?
Because most learn that this type of stupidity has consequences.
A long suspension should be a remedy that will help him in the long run.

Others who indicate, its just boys or just let it go..no harm done. Will be more concerned if continued actions like this and the academic issues end up bring on the wrath of the NCAA for lack of control of the program over its athletes.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 1:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Suspend him for the Ga Southern game..

Posted by newtonrail on January 22, 2008 at 1:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I am confused. I thought Vereen was arrested for underage consumption just 3 or 4 days ago? Is this the second occurrence?

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 1:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)

the only surprise is how long it took you to comment negatively, geoff.

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 1:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

TommyJack, exactly. Drinking problems happen at UGA every year. Their guys wind up driving, too. Sjt the differences between this and Schaeffer are the following: there was no bat involved (at least that we know about) and Schaeffer had been in trouble previously due to attendance and academic issues (problems he still had at Ole Miss, sadly.)

Posted by ATLVOL1 on January 22, 2008 at 1:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

CHECK OUT VEREENS BIO:

http://recruiting.scout.com/a.z?s=73&...

FASTEST RECRUIT SIGNED LAST YEAR

Posted by newtonrail on January 22, 2008 at 1:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I think I answered my own question. KNS ran a story yesterday with almost no detail. After rereading it, this is the same story. They should have updated first story as they usually do. They could have put it in the Headlines to make the "Splash".

Posted by ATLVOL1 on January 22, 2008 at 1:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

FASTEST RECRUIT AFTER BERRY =)

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 1:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bigbluevol.

Sorry. It's a serious problem and with recruiting tanking, we should be a little more concerned for this continuing parade. Just my opinion though. Just like everybody else has an opinion.

Posted by pms151 on January 22, 2008 at 1:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Yes tngeof, and being read by every recruit, their families, and HS coaches right now in real time. Can't wait to hear something original this time from Fulmer. I don't know how he can get any harder on the kid now that he seems to have set a precedent last week.

Posted by thesavageorange on January 22, 2008 at 1:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

vols10623 ,The problem is the other 9 walked back inside.Vereen went to his vehicle while ignoring the officers direct order.Just like McNeil.If these guys had just done what the officers had asked them to do , they probably get a warning, a call to coach, and the media never gets hold of it.By the way did anyone hear about the OK ST player elbowing a cop in the face?Hold her in the road Vereen , or you will never pound the fritter.

Posted by Pullingguard on January 22, 2008 at 1:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It happens every week-end. The thing that alarms everyone is when someone gets caught... You that were old enough, Where were your kids Saturday Night? Ah, how things have changed since Knoxville was dry and you could get drive up service outside Burlington (11W) with cops directing traffic... No one was drunk because no one every got caught and cops did not care... But Neyland was coach and all was well...

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 1:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

It appears to be the same story...KNS apparently was in such a rush to break this important story that they didn't have all the info yet, so this is a very helpful article to fill in all the missing pieces. Good grief. There should be consequences for behavior but it also should be balanced against giving these kids, yes they're kids, a chance to learn from their mistake and demonstrate positive behavior change. Where I draw the line is anti-social behavior where a weapon such as a bat is involved or public displays of thuggery or abusing women. That type of behavior is different than boys being boys drinking and fighting over a girl. I hope the pennance is painful and difficult and that he grows from this experience.

Posted by joebomb on January 22, 2008 at 1:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Gibs Hall:
"Yo everybody, Cut ain't here no more. You know what that means....puff puff give and lets get our sway on tonight. What about coach PF? What about him?"

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 1:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Geoff, you're entitled to your opinion, but "the sky is falling" because a KID got drunk and in a fight is not really appropriate, in my opinion.

Posted by thesavageorange on January 22, 2008 at 1:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ATLVOL1 ,I hope this is an isolated incident w/ this kid.He is a bigger stronger version of Coker.With Creer already showing flashes, him and Vereen could be the best backfield in the conference in 2yrs.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 1:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I like Cut but Coker didn't seem deterred by his presense.

Posted by BallantyneVol on January 22, 2008 at 1:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Dear posters:

Just FYI you do not want to know what really goes on with the team. I've recently become privy to "inside" info and let's just say the football team is "off the chains". This aint your daddies Volunteers.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 1:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Here's what you do. You bring him in to meet with the coaches AND Demetrius Morely. Everyone take a vote and let Morely's vote be the deciding factor for punishment. If Morely says he stay's, give him have 1 more chance to right the ship.

Otherwise, kick his @ss off the team and let him learn how to work himself back into school by hard work and sacrifice like Morely did.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 1:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

A word on discipline. Discipline is NOT just about punishment being handed out. It includes policies that should PREVENT these occurrences. We seem to dwell more on the former.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ATLVOL1, I can't remember what Scout listed his speed at but do remember that it was very different from Rivals. Rivals had him over 4.5, maybe even 4.6.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 2:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

What makes you folks this this sort of thing will hurt recruiting? On the contrary, come to a place where you can smoke, skip class and get in fights and STILL get multiple chances? Thats a draw to most recruits.

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 2:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)

These are very young, very high testosterone boys/men many from some pretty tough backgrounds, this ain't an abbey or the ivy league.

I have a good friend who graduated from the elite University of the South and the story's he tells of drunken debauchery from top tier kids from the highest economic class is amazing...much of it worse than what Geoff posted.

Like I said earlier, if he's basically a good kid and did not assualt someone with a weapon or intent to injure and he's not assulting a female or acting like a thug in public, then turn it into a hard learning experience and give him a chance. If he's a jerk like Shaeffer apparently was, then get rid of him.

Everyone else should give it a rest already...sheesh

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 2:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

oops that should have been 'stories'...just in case VOLCR was reading.

Posted by BallantyneVol on January 22, 2008 at 2:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Luckily for D.V. I heard he took a pretty good whippin so I'm sure he's learned his lesson.

Posted by tenndave on January 22, 2008 at 2:06 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I do not condone underage drinking by anyone.
The excuse everyone else is doing it is not acceptable, even if a large number are at age 14. I attended a private Christian College and these incidents were all too common there 40 years ago. The difference is now we have adopted the hate Bush philosophy and want every UT Athlete executed for the offense. 40 years ago, the offense got alot of physical discipline in the order of stadiums, line drills, laps, loss of privilges etc. and you were given the chance to atone for your mistakes. We suddenly want a different case for athletes because too many of us are more interested in tearing down than building up. Recruits turned off by this. Give me a break.

Vereen's life should have just taken the turn to really learn discipline. Kicking him off the team would be ridiculous unless he won't endure the price of the mistake.

Thank goodness no one kicked me out of college when I made a fool out of myself. Zell Miller in his book calls it "the trip over fool's hill" we all have to make. "We just hope we survive it and turn into responsible men." Amen.

Now kick his ???? Phil but let him learn. He will be better for it in the end.

Posted by orangebloodgmc on January 22, 2008 at 2:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Scout.com link above has him at 4.38! But I didn't recall other press about him touting that kind of speed.

Posted by DennisVols on January 22, 2008 at 2:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)

He didn't go inside because his car was illegaly parked " that was parked in the fire lane outside Gibbs Hall" which is why I believe he got into the drivers seat and not just any seat on the drivers side.
This is a problem, not just a right of passage. It should be a concern that at 3am he was ouside, involved in a fight, drunk and then got into a car even though he was ordered not to by the police.
It damages not only the player, but the image of the team and university and the recruiting process. It does not matter that many before him have done it or that many others will. We should be concerned that not only college football players are making these kind of decisions but it is going on at a higher rate amoung teens today than ever. Ask yourself, if this was my son would I be alright with it?

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 2:10 p.m. (Suggest removal)

TJ,
Other than locking the kids up or providing 24/7 supervision, not sure what type of 'POLICY' will stop all bad behavior given the age of these kids, that this is probably the first experience of independence that most of these kids have experienced. Part of learning and growing is being given the space to actually display maturity and good decision making...that also means space to do stupid things. Hopefully his pennance is painful and will leave an impression.

I got caught doing some of this same stuff in my hometown and luckily I was not famous, though my dad was well known and the cop let me go after a good tongue lashing...it left an impression and spared me and my parents unnecessary additional grief.

Apparently a bunch of you all are perfect...congratulations!

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 2:12 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bigbluevol, first off he isn't a KID. He is an adult. This attitude that people are still children in this country until they are out of college is insane. I would bet that if you took a poll of all college students they wouldn't want to be seen or treated as a "KID".If we are producing "kids" in our society by the time they are 18-21, then there is someething wrong with our society.

Secondly, the sky isn't falling. But every time you have a person that violates a rule, a law, a policy, etc you continue to foster that behavior over time. Not only does it hinder the person's development by showing them that it's ok to continually do dumb things with no consequence, but it also sets a standard for everyone else.

Punish him by the rules that are in place and move on. But don't give them an out just because they are "kids". If folks want to treat them like kids when they do something wrong, treat them like kids across the board when they do right too. Fair is fair.

Posted by bossvol351 on January 22, 2008 at 2:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash, I LIKE IT!

Impose "Morley Law" on this knuclehead!

Posted by volcutie1998 on January 22, 2008 at 2:14 p.m. (Suggest removal)

ballantyne the football team has been "off the chain" much longer than a few years. i was very privy to some inside info and if you guys only knew what was going on during the nc years.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 2:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)

TommyJack, what is your background? Do you have experience in education?

You cannot be more correct in your 1:59pm post. It's called Applied Behavior Analysis and Replacement Behavior. Thats the way to go...you are right.

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 2:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash,
A Freshman in his first extended time away from home may not be a 'kid' but he's not yet fully a man. By the time he's a junior or senior, I'd expect him to be a man. I'm not justifying bad behavior, but just saying we need to have realistic expectations. If the kid is basically a decent kid, then punish the heck out of him and hope he learns. If he doesn't then dismiss him like Coker.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 2:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

VOLinDawgland, I personally think significant restrictions and supervision should be part of the punishment. This "kid" has proven that he isn't "adult" enough to make and keep a curfew that keeps him out of trouble.

Your story points up part of the problem. Alot of these guys weren't raised like you were. All you needed was a tongue lashing... If that was all it took for these young men then he wouldn't be in this situation. Like tngeoff has been preaching, the kid would have been extra careful out of respect for the team, coach, program, school, self, etc after seeing the other problem blow up like it did.

Posted by DennisVols on January 22, 2008 at 2:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Make these players spend some time down at the hospital at the ICU looking at some dumb decision makers who got drunk or high behind the wheel or their victims. Take em to the rehab centers so they can watch alcoholics and drug addicts going through their withdrawals because they never thought they could become addicted. Even spend some time researching the many stupid decision makers who now are serving time in jails, how they lost their jobs, families.
Excusing this type of behavior will only lead to a reoccurrence not only by the offender but other who feel the punishment is not sever enough compared to the high they get.

Posted by 10ACVOL on January 22, 2008 at 2:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey, at least no drugs or guns were involved...see how he responds to his punishment b4 you bash him. He had a DD too

Posted by ATLVOL1 on January 22, 2008 at 2:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)

YEAH MORLEY NEEDS TO WEAR THAT "C" ON HIS CHEST, ASSUMING ALL WE HEAR ABOUT HIM IS TRUE...

Posted by ATLVOL1 on January 22, 2008 at 2:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

VEREEN IS A 4.53 40 YD ON RIVALS

THATS QUITE A DIFFERENCE

http://tennessee.rivals.com/viewprospect...

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 2:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Last post on this for me...I have many, many more links about players since 2004 that I did not post as I think those are eye opening enough and can be concluded by anybody as not normal or okay. What is so annoying is the continued act like its all normal. Its not. Its a symptom of a program that is out of control. Sure, you can find other schools that have some issues. What is the standard? According to the University of Tennessee, "EXCELLENCE." Yes, Florida State is worse. They are known as "Thug U." After our debacles a few years back people started calling us that. Is it to much to expect "EXCELLENCE" when that is the vanguard of our program? The end.

Posted by ggriggs939 on January 22, 2008 at 2:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The dogs were out in full force. How much does the reporter pay the cop the scoop?

Posted by RockyTop1 on January 22, 2008 at 2:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I really get tired of hearing about all this EVERY day! Get a clue and do right Team!? It's hard enough being a VOL fan in Alabama without having this type of thing thrown at me constantly! Get some discipline at UT!! or GET OUT!!

I had to confront this while in the Air Force and discipline a young airman that was a drunk! One real slap on the wrist did the trick. It involved hitting him in the wallet through holding a promotion for 6 months while he got his act together. Which HE DID and we reinstated the promotion with back pay! Discipline is to be used to deter bad behaviour and sometimes change a young man for the better! It worked for Randy I just wish those that had him in Tech School had addressed it before he got to me.

The TEAM should be ashamed every time we give the KNS and ESPN anything to print like this story. Get some PRIDE and do right!! GO VOLS!!

Posted by tngeoff on January 22, 2008 at 2:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Like I said after my last Johhny Majors post months ago. No more. I for the most part have lived up to that. Now...no more about discipline. Just like with Majors...it was clear how I felt. And with this issue. There can be no doubt where I stand. Other stuff? I'll post away. Not this achilles heel. Time will tell where these things take us.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 2:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

VOLinDAWGland, I'm not preaching fire and brimstone but to call these young men kids would be a slap in the face to them. As I stated earlier, go to a majority of male college students and call them kids. You want to talk about getting a reaction.

Like I've said, they want to be men when it suits them, and not when it comes time for accountability. Look at Morely...he's a man. He messed up. He stumbled and fell. And he picked himself up and worked hard to obtain his goal. For that, I'm proud.

Do many of them have the mentality of children-YES...I will agree 100% with you. BUT, if this is the case, then treat them with childlike standards. Can't have it both ways. Either they want to be adults or Kids. Which one is it?

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 2:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Marc -

Just because you are 18 doesn't mean you're an adult. Maturity and growth define adulthood, not age. Some guys take longer. This guy has likely never been away from home or on his own. What he did was wrong, but kicking him off the team isn't the answer. Nowhere in what I've said have I implied that punishment isn't deserved. What's undeserved is the notion that this guy is worthless and should be cut loose for the sake of the team or image. The "let's make an example of him" attitude is ridiculous. Someone pointed out what would you do if it were your kid? Well, would you want your kid's future inexorably damaged because he made a mistake and is being severly punished because of the timing of that mistake?

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 2:52 p.m. (Suggest removal)

They want to be adults, but that doesn't mean they are. I want to be a millionaire, all-star quarterback. Will you treat me that way? Morley had to mess up to pick himself up. For all we know, Vereen could do the same.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 2:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)

volinDawgland: re your 2:10 post. Not sure I understand your post. My point was that discipline is not just reactive; it can be proactive. Policies? Meetings, discussions, warnings, etc....I'm not saying kids are not gonna screw up. They will. I personally think CPF should let Vereen skate with only running steps, etc (if it's his first offense). Not perfect here..never said I was. Why are you so agitated?

Posted by FWBVol on January 22, 2008 at 2:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

10ACVOL, most experts consider alcohol a drug. The difference is it isn't an illegal drug. But that's not the point; the charge was public intoxication. I don't want to suggest anything that isn't indicated, but he could have been intoxicated on something other than alcohol.

Whatever it was, the kid was out at 3 a.m. That in itself seems to indicate problems.

I don't know what the solution to the growing problem in society is...well I do have my ideas, but I don't want to start preaching on this forum.

Maybe if grad assistants were required to live in Gibbs with the younger athletes and have some sort of room check. There's no reason a kid should be out of his room that late at night/early in the morning. Even with bedcheck though a kid can get up and break curfew.

Posted by Volalumnus on January 22, 2008 at 2:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Maybe a draw for the recruits but not the parents

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Rockytop, just remind them about selling textbooks to their buddies, paying means and simeon castille drunkenly challenging people in T town. Mention UGA's yearly underage drinking incidents, or Florida's players selling drugs to undercover officers. Talk about FSU's cheating scandal or Oklahoma's players getting paid for jobs they didn't do at astronomical rates. Remind them about all the Texas players who have been arrested of late or USC's possible blind eye towards Reggie Bush. These problems are everywhere because they involve 18-22 year old prima donnas who have been kissed up to for years. It's not just at UT. That doesn't make it ok, but it's not only our program or coach struggling with this generation's student athletes.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 2:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash: No. I was schooled to be an educator, but didn't have the patience. Still don't. :)
But I greatly admire those that do.

Posted by VolsorCat on January 22, 2008 at 2:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)

How many out there tossed back a few and jumped behind the wheel after the bowl game or after a dinner out with clients or customers? Come on guys, unless you are perfect, quit throwing the stones. This kid messed up, but most kids mess up. God knows I messed up more than a few times in college. Who hasn't had a couple and gotten in a fight. When it got out of line, coaches, fraternity brothers or alumni stepped in. The coaches and team need to address it, not a bunch of professional posters on a second rate newspaper web site! I don't think the KNS has the best interest of the university in a lot that they report. The same goes for about half of the people bashing away on every article day in and day out.

Posted by pdhuff on January 22, 2008 at 2:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

TommyJack, are you keeping the official Vol "surprise" log? Do we need to get more pages or are the surprises dying down? Keep the fritter out of the litter.

Posted by CatScratchFever on January 22, 2008 at 2:59 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash. You have made some excellent posts. These kinds of problems are not going to go away until the staff at UT (and all other schools too) start holding these young men accountable for the things they do wrong.

Giving multiple chances for breaking the rules lends the rules to be completely useless to begin with. I bet if UT implemented a zero tolerance policy for drug/alcohol offenses, much of the problems would go away. The only difficulty is, no one wants to sacrifice losing a good player....so they just turn their head to it.

I think in a lot of ways, this is a reflection of society. Hence we have drug abuse/manufacturing issues so bad that robbing banks has become a new occupation. Pretty sad statement I think.

Posted by UT_Tim on January 22, 2008 at 3 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Nothing to see here please move along. He’s just young and away from his parents acting out to get the attention he so desperately needs. I’m sure this was his fist fight (they jumped on him) and his first experience with alcohol (he only drank because everyone else in collage was doing it). Look on the bright side, no pot was found in the Jeep as I’m sure the police took this opportunity to search the vehicle needlessly trying to escalate the situation.
Sorry had to do it

This kind of thing does go on all over the country and I’m sure some schools close ranks and prevent this kind of news from getting out. The issue I have is a few bad apples making the program look bad. No matter your opinion on underage drinking or smoking pot, it’s still a black eye on the University of Tennessee and all of its supporters when these problems keep coming up. Is it too much to ask for the football team to stay out of the police blotter? Have we gotten to a point where no one has that voice in their head that says “bad bucking idea”?

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 3:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I agree, maturity and growth do define maturity for most. Maturity is supposed to be learned, and it doesn't come without consequences. However, if you are wanting to be treated as an adult, then you are to adhere to adult responsibilities. I'm sure there have been many men and women not "mature" enough to fight for their country, yet that hasn't seemed to stop the armed forces from letting 18 year olds in and treating them to adult standards.

Another problem is that our laws don't dictate that maturity and growth define adulthood. That is why we have laws that set the standard for "right and wrong". Do I agree with that standard completely, no. But that is what is set forth nonetheless.

I don't know that kicking him off the team is the way to go but at what point does the focus shift to the ones that have been working hard?

What would I do if it were my son? If I am lucky enough for my son to play sports, I may find out. I could only guess that he would have had chances to make mistakes growing up and that I would have taught him that he has the right to make his own decisions. And with that, comes consequences.

The flip side seemed to work for Morely...I would hope it would work with my son too.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 3:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)

bigbluevol,

"They want to be adults, but that doesn't mean they are. I want to be a millionaire, all-star quarterback. Will you treat me that way? Morley had to mess up to pick himself up. For all we know, Vereen could do the same."

100% correct. They do want to be treated like adults, but they may not be. But if you are going to have adult behavior, treat folks like children? That makes sense...

Maybe Vereen can pick himself up. Hope he can do like Morely did. Nobody will know unless he falls on his face.

Will I treat you like an all star QB? If you prove through your actions that you deserve to be treated like one, yes.

Posted by anthony on January 22, 2008 at 3:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Gentlemen, you act as if their is not evil in the world. Do you want your football players to wear skirts and courtsey?? Do you also hold your public officials accountable?? Or do you care more for your football than your country. Everyone has an opinion, but these men need your support , not your opinions!!

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 3:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

The culture is in decline, IMO. But that's no reason Vereen can't atone. No heinous crime here. What IS especially critcal now is LEADERSHIP. Can you hear me now (coach)?

Posted by bigbluevol on January 22, 2008 at 3:11 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Exactly. Vereen hasn't, in this instance, proven through his actions that he should be treated as an adult. Therefore, he should be running steps, subjected to a curfew perhaps, and spending the weekends of the next few months in his room. Ground him like a child until he proves that he can be treated the way he wants to be treated.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 3:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I guess I take a different spin on things and sometimes have to view things from a different perspective. I work as a Behavior Analyst and have done so for many-many years. I view behavior much differently that most as I have done countless hours of research, observation, Functional Assessment and Functional Behavior Plans.

Behavior generally has a function, and doesn't happen randomly (typically). The issue with most models of treatment (as parents, educators, football coaches) is they focus on Punishment as the key. Punishment will not generally work if the behavior (drinking, skipping class, etc)is more reinforcing than the consequence.

I have plugged in the human aspect of indivdiual circumstance since I have become a father, but the general rule of behavior still stands consistent....if you don't determine the reason a person is doing what they are doing, you can not successfully treat the issue. Because the behavior will always be more reinforcing than the consequence.

Forgive me for my opinions...I hope there is a 12 step program somewhere that can help me.

Posted by maholt49 on January 22, 2008 at 3:18 p.m. (Suggest removal)

A "BAD SEED"!!!!!!

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 3:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash: Makes sense to me.

PD: No log updates. The Jomarcus Savage yoot could be good addition. But I would prefer to see more heft added toward the middle of the line.

Posted by VolsorCat on January 22, 2008 at 3:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Anthony: I agree 100%. I like the catholic girls, but just don't want them playing football at UT.

Posted by OCT171972 on January 22, 2008 at 3:41 p.m. (Suggest removal)

If all you whining fools think for one minute that your constant whining is going to change anything then you are all sadly mistaken.

Come on guys if you are going to drink please, please............keep good company aroud you when you are doing this.

Go Vols!

Posted by LazhilUTDelt on January 22, 2008 at 4:01 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Can anyone spell I-D-I-O-T?
The moron sees the cops and completely hammered walks to his car and tries to drive away when he's drunk out of his @ss and for the blood shot eyes to be brough up probably stoned too...oh gotta love the quality guys that we bring to our university...

Posted by VOLinDAWGland on January 22, 2008 at 4:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Agre with your point SJT...extra supervision has now been earned by Vareen...my point was regarding supervision prior to the incident.

I'd like to see some leaders emerge from the players that enforces some peer pressure from within.

Posted by TommyJack on January 22, 2008 at 4:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)

LazzieFrat: You never fail to show your azz. The article said Vereen tried to get in the passenger side door. Passenger side, dude. Get it?

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:25 p.m. (Suggest removal)

You guys who think you are royalty in here, and you know who you are, who is getting more national attention about these matters than UT? You don't think that CFP is to blame? Then who is?

Posted by mparker12 on January 22, 2008 at 4:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash, you've made much, much to much sense for a chat board. c'mon, it's gotta be phil's 'lack of discipline' or other such crap.

Lemme add a little something: most male athletes are muscalar and athletic for several reasons. They also happen to be at an age when their idea of fun is raising hell and breaking rules they think are 'square'.

Before you guys go off on Phil, or race, or football players, or wahtever else you wish to rant on, a little thing to think about:

I live in an upper-crust, almost entirely white, kind of snobby suburb. All the parents try hard to raise their kids 'right', they are invovlved, they lay down the discipline...yet, the following incidents in our sports program over the last 18 months:
-5 minors cited for beer in a parking lot
-3 minors for cigareetes
-4 separate incidents of kids suspended from sports for fighting
-2 kids suspended for possession of pocket knives

I know a lot of these kids, they are regular boyus. If they were at UT, they'd have caused a national stink. As it is, that's pretty much normal for any HS around here....

To sum up, teen boys will always be dumber than dirt, and jocks more than most.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 4:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Petrino has established a mandatory breakfast for Ark. Maybe it is time that UT have a mandatory breakfast and study hall every Sat and Sun morning at 7 am?

Kid shows up drunk or high... bust 'em.

Can you have mandatory work outs at 6 am during the offseason? That sounds like a decent control too.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

And I for one would like to know who the other 8 or 9 guys who scattered into their dorm rooms like ants are. If whomever was at the front desk (RA) can't point them out he should be fired.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 4:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

mparker12, good points. I think it has something to do with the on-going belief that they can get away with things because the pay off is worth the potential consequence. I am not going to get into what I've already said, but you hit it on the head....if a behavior is seen as a norm or is accepted, it will more than likely continue.

Again, sorry for making sense. But can I at least blame Ainge? I'm sure somehow he must be at fault too? Maybe he didn't hand the ball off to him enough in spring practice.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 4:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

texan, CPF is responsible for leading the team and enforcing the rules. Those young men, their parents, and in some cases their team mates bear at least as much blame as a coach. CPF is simultaneously (according to all of us here) supposed to prevent all misconduct by all players while traveling 24X7 to bring the next crop of great, perfectly behaved athletes to UT.

I agree he has to set the standard and that there is alot that can be done to curb these things... but to lay the blame at CPF's feet alone is not reasonable.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:35 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Petrino, give me a break. This guy has never coached a game in the SEC, and furthermore has ever tried to control this type of talent.

Posted by cnalumni on January 22, 2008 at 4:36 p.m. (Suggest removal)

No biggie. These are all isolated incidents. Its foolish to think that every young man on the team is going to stay out of trouble. These things happen everywhere on every collegiate level.

Posted by marc_ash on January 22, 2008 at 4:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Texan,

Not sure how familiar you are with the Gibbs front desk, but any RA or RD working in Gibbs would not have been able to see what was going on if they were behind the desk. The parking lot is not in clear sight from where the incident took place.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

That maybe true sjt18, but someone under his control has to be in charge while he is away. If you were away on business wouldn't you rely on your trusted assistant to keep the ship on course?

Posted by rootin4volz on January 22, 2008 at 4:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Couple of great ideas:

1--Let's get in a fight at 3:00am in front of a dorm, out in the wide open, where all passing UTPD cars can see us fighting.

2--Lets get in our car and drive around burning a spleef during a time when KPD is patrolling Fort Sanders full force due to the surge in robberies in that area.

Come on, you idiots, USE YOUR HEADS!

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 4:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

texan, Ark was a program out of control. A good friend of mine is a Hog fan and Petrino is definitely rattling the cage. May not be what the players want... they may even lay down on him. But HE IS trying to get a handle on discipline within that program.

One thing he established was that players don't talk during team meetings... sounds off to me but I guess the inmates were running the asylum under Nutt.

I'm not a real big fan of the guy and agree that coaching L'ville in the BE isn't exactly the same as the SEC... but discipline is discipline.

Posted by Malcolm_Tent on January 22, 2008 at 4:40 p.m. (Suggest removal)

We wouldn't have this sort of incident if the players hand-selected by Warden Fulmer were actually intelligent enough to get into college without the aid of impressive 40 speeds or bench-press max's. I guess when you grant scholarships based on those numbers instead of SAT scores and GPA's you wind up with alot of thugs with the social IQ of a twelve year old playground bully and the decision making skills of a lab rat. Fly your flags proudly Vol nation, perhaps one day our players will soon be refering to their alma mater as "The other U" during Monday Night Football introductions.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash, But didn't the artilel say bus lane. When I was a student it was in front of the main door. And if it isn't today, given what has happenned in the past, some kind of security should be in place. By the way has CPF made a statement yet?

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 4:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

texan, Yes, you do leave someone in charge... but rules are seldom obeyed just because a group is well supervised. Well led people will become self-supervising if they know what is expected and believe in the "cause".

tngeoff is dead on about it being at least to some extent a matter of respect and leadership. I'm not sure it all belongs at CPF's feet... but what happens certainly after the fact does.

I've defended CPF when I thought it was right and criticized him as well... but he has to take a real lead on this or else it will get out of control again.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Malcolm_Tent, You, sir are certainly not a student of big time college football.

Posted by mparker12 on January 22, 2008 at 4:48 p.m. (Suggest removal)

marc_ash...pretty funny!!!

rootin4volz....you nailed it!!! just gotta remember, to them, it makes sense (sigh).

I gotta stick with one thing, tho. Instead of suspensions and all that garbage, I think extra running and extra studying are about the best...
JMHO.

Posted by Malcolm_Tent on January 22, 2008 at 4:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

"Big time college football" = Skrew student/athelete, I'm here for my NFL tryout

Posted by invisiblekid on January 22, 2008 at 4:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Give Vereen the Lindsay Lohan treatment and make him spend some time at a morgue. Doubt it will work for her but maybe it would for Vereen. These players need to realize there can be serious consequences to their actions and that they will not only be held responsible, but also held to a higher standard as representatives of the University.

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 4:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

sjt18, I kneel before you on that response. However it was just too soon after the last incident and still in the recruiting season for someone not to have been looking after these guys. I bet my last confederate dolar that the guys who scattered when the cops showed up were supposed to be in charge,

Posted by pdhuff on January 22, 2008 at 5:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)

malcom tent - 4:40 p.m. Welcome back, liked that "decision making skills of a lab rat".

sjt18 4:45 Do I detect a slight hint of dislike toward big Phil's organizing skills lately? As in delegating oversight. Control the situation or it will control you. After the regimen of a football season young lads find time on their hands. This results in articles in SEC city newspapers. Sometimes respect fades when away from the respected.

Its not right, but things happen. My friend and I flipped a 440 Fury over into the local cemetary once. That brought on more talk. Whew!

As usual it is choices and consequences. Has anyone seen any DTs?

Posted by texan on January 22, 2008 at 5:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Malcolm_Tent
Just proved my point.

Posted by AlpharettaVol on January 22, 2008 at 5:07 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Remember when there were athletic dorms? Coaches could keep an eye on these guys and head off potential problems before they got this far. Since the feds decided that athletic dorms kept the athletes from assimilating into the general student population, the coaches have no way of knowing who is doing what anymore.

Posted by Malcolm_Tent on January 22, 2008 at 5:20 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I'm guessing Cutcliffe is smoking a cigar somewhere with a glass of Scotch thinking "Damn it's nice to coach kids who are here for the free education" after reading all the latest stories from "Oz"....er.....I mean UTAD. He gets 500k a year less than Phil, but his biggest problem is team members with overdue library books and figuring out how he's gonna win 3 games.

Any news on whether or not we're gonna land Adam Sandler to quarterback the team?

Posted by invisiblekid on January 22, 2008 at 5:34 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Malcolm_Tent, I am sure a glass of scotch and a cigar is EXACTLY what Cutcliffe, a coach who resigned from the OC position at ND due to triple bypass surgery a few years ago, is doing right now.

Posted by sjt18 on January 22, 2008 at 5:39 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Not really pd... I never believed the guy could do no wrong nor did I believe he couldn't do anything right. These incidents could be an aberration or an indication of a lack of control like geoff apparently believes. Either way, what he does now matters most.

Posted by invisiblekid on January 22, 2008 at 5:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)

pdhuff, I have seen plnety of defensive tackles, they are committing to the likes of Miami, OK, and ND.

Posted by Malcolm_Tent on January 22, 2008 at 5:50 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Invisible-
LOL. touche.

Perhaps he's enjoying a ban muffin and doing needlepoint, the point is I'd say it's a little more relaxing in Durham, NC

Posted by invisiblekid on January 22, 2008 at 5:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)

I caught your point Malcolm_Tent, just having a little fun.

Posted by Malcolm_Tent on January 22, 2008 at 5:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Huff-

There are other types of DT's at UT though. Delirium tremens and drug tests are two that come to mind the fastest when thinking UT football.

Posted by mparker12 on January 22, 2008 at 6:31 p.m. (Suggest removal)

malcolm_tent???

I'm not even going to read your posts, your screen name is one of the best I've ever seen.

Great job!@!!! :)

Posted by pdhuff on January 22, 2008 at 6:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)

malcom tent- true, but something always comes to mind whenever I see trouble and Fulmer in the same sentence - Teflon. Got to give him credit!

I remember when the wildest accusation about control was glazed.......

Posted by bcdvol on January 22, 2008 at 8:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)

AlpharettaVol I remember athletic dorms. Though I'm not familiar with the UT ones, at another Tennessee school which I attended it was the nicest dorm on campus. Mainly because it was newer and maintenance people spent a great deal of their time fixing everything that got broken. It also had about the same amount of drugs as your local pharmacy.

For the other posters. I don't disagree with some of the posts on here, but I don't know what type of life you people led as college age students. I remember a lot of non-athlete students pushing the envelope, myself included. I learned from my mistakes and grew up. Lets remember these are young kids away from home with only a small fraction of the supervision that many had at home. How many non athletes make the rap sheet every week?

Don't get me wrong, those that screw up need to pay a price. But lets keep it in perspective. To those of you who've never made an idiotic decision in your life, I bow to you because I'm not worthy.

Posted by vol1994 on January 23, 2008 at 7:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Posted by BallantyneVol on January 22, 2008 at 1:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)

Dear posters:

Just FYI you do not want to know what really goes on with the team. I've recently become privy to "inside" info and let's just say the football team is "off the chains". This aint your daddies Volunteers.

----------------------
BallantyneVol- Please give examples and details
of the team being "off the chains".
Who or what is your inside information within the program? a coach? maanger?

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