October 16, 2007
Doug Pinnick interview from March 1999
I've just been listening to King's X, which reminded me I've yet to re-post my interview with Doug Pinnick. Doug has been one of my biggest bass heroes since I first heard Out Of The Silent Planet back in the late 80s - I was and still am a massive King's X fan, so interviewing him was a bit of a dream come true. And it was made all the more enjoyable and memorable by the kind of conversation we had - he'd just come out as gay, which had massively upset the conservative end of their christian fanbase in the US, but on the upside had inspired an amazing album in Dogman... So we talked about all kinds of stuff - american culture, theology, bigotry, etc. etc. for hours. And with about half an hour to go i remembered that i was supposed to be getting a load of information for bass geeks, and that's what this bit is! I've probably got the tape somewhere with the rest of it on, and maybe one day I'll get round to typing it up, will run it by Doug and put it up somewhere if he's OK with it... But for now, here's the bassy bit of the interview, which is still pretty interesting! :o)
At the tail end of the 80s, the rock world underwent a bit of a shake up, as a handful of groups arrived on the scene, combining hard rocking guitars with such disparate elements as soulful vocal harmonies, funky bass lines and a sharp line in observational lyrics that were a far cry from the sword 'n' sorcery stuff that most of the HM fraternity were prone to churning out.
Bands such as Red Hot Chilli Peppers, Living Colour, Faith No More and, of course, Kings X, took over the pages of both the metal mags and the 'serious' music weeklies, hailed as the saviours of hard rock, and, for the most part, made a sizeable dent in the charts.
However, despite combining crushingly heavy guitar riffs with radio-friendly three-part harmony vocals, and enjoying some very favourable reviews, Kings X have so far managed to skirt round the edge of the mainstream without yet finding that elusive crossover hit.
Now, with a new King's X album, 'Tape Head', in the shops and 'Massive Grooves'' by Doug's solo project, Poundhound available, Kings X are finally coming back to the UK.
'I always wanted to play bass, for as long as I can remember,' begins Doug. 'Eventually, I got lucky - a friend of mine gave me a bass. I grew up in the ghetto, and we were pretty poor. I never even thought I'd be able to play but this friend of mine loaned it to me and I wouldn't give it back to him! I started playing and I was so happy! I mean, just one note made me ecstatic, and from that day on I've just played and I love it! I don't remember learning how or really working at it because, even though I did, it was so much fun. Every new lick, every new note, was like "yeah!"'
Thus begins the tale. But what kind of things were you playing along to back then?
'It was the early 70s when I started playing bass, so I jammed along with records by Led Zeppelin, Sly And The Family Stone, Deep Purple, Yes, Kansas - that kind of stuff. I was a music-aholic! Anything I bought I would put on and play along and try to learn the licks. I did that for about two years and then started playing in bands. After that I never tried to copy anybody else - I was too busy having fun, writing music and stuff.'
What were those first bands like?
'They were all pretty much garage bands. I wanted to just play bass but ended up singing in all of them. I thought each band was going to make it, but they all sucked! It was a good learning experience!'
How did you make the jump from garage band to Kings X?
'I moved to Springfield, Missouri, to look for work and I met Jerry (Gaskill: KX drummer), and Ty (Tabor: KX guitarist). We formed a four piece with another guitarist for a couple of years, but it soon became evident that we were meant to be a trio!
'After that, we played cover tunes for about five years, and then moved to Texas. We had dealings with a couple of small Christian labels before signing to MegaForce/Atlantic and releasing the first Kings X album. Since then we've been making records, doing gigs and going through everything everybody else goes through.'
That is, if "everything everybody else goes through" is releasing seven critically acclaimed albums, and doing regular arena tours both as headline act and as support act to some of the biggest names in rock!
There was a big change in the Kings X sound with 1994's "Dogman" album. What happened?
'Sam Taylor, who produced our first four albums, had a big influence on our sound, but he never managed to capture on record how heavy we are live. When he left us after "Kings X", we got Brendan O'Brien in to do "Dogman". He's one of my favourite producers. He gets a really dry mix, and that's what I wanted to go for. There's one song on "Dogman" called Black The Sky, that is now my standard to mix to. That's the sound on the Poundhound album - big and fat - more like our live sound'huge!'
Anyone doubting just how huge the Kings X live sound is should take a quick look at Doug's live rig. Any queries will soon be laid to rest:
'I use 6 Ampeg SVT 8x10 cabinets and I've got two double stereo Ampeg power amps - you can hook eight speakers up to each amp. They're split in half with two electrical plugs on each amp, to cope with the power! I use an SVT pre-amp for my low end and a Fender Dual Showman for the high end, then run them both into a little mixer, through an EQ and into the power amps. Then I turn it up!!
'People ask why I use so many cabs. It's mainly because I like to get 40Hz and lower, to get that church organ kind of sound, so that when I hit a low note there's that rumble that just shakes the building!'
You've been long associated with Hamer basses, and particularly with their 12-strings. I guess you were a Cheap Trick fan?
'Yes, Cheap Trick was one of my favourite bands, and Tom Pederson is still one of my favourite bassists. We opened for them when "Out Of The Silent Planet" came out, and he let me play one of his 12-strings. Even though it was right-handed, it felt and sounded amazing, and he said, 'just call Hamer up and get one.'
'Hamer wanted to work with (King's X guitarist) Ty' and I said 'What about me?!'. They replied, 'We'll make you some basses too, Doug!', so I started using the 12-strings. The company started getting calls from people saying they'd see us play and were interested in them, so Hamer were quite happy to keep the thing going.
'Ever since then, I've been using Hamers. They've made me about 12 basses, all of which have been custom-built for me. I have really long hands so I go for wide but shallow necks. I also have Seymour Duncan pickups with a power booster inside, so anything I plug into distorts. It's my sound. The bass, the amp, the strings - which are DRs - and my hands'that's my sound.'
Recently though, you've reverted to four stings'
'On the last two Kings X albums, and even the Poundhound album, I've used predominantly a four-string. The 12-string is a weird animal to play, it didn't quite fit with some of the Kings X stuff. Ty felt that it weakened the sound of his guitar, and I finally got tired of the power struggle and gave in for the sake of the overall sound. If I write a song on the 12-string then I can work the rest of the sound around it. Like Jeff Ament did on Jeremy with Pearl Jam - the 12-string carries the whole song. Human Behaviour on "Dogman" and Faith Hope Love were both written and recorded on the 12-string. I can actually play the whole of Faith Hope Love with the harmonics and arpeggios and everything on the 12-string, I don't even need the guitar!!'
Kings X have always been known as a musicians' band, and have been more influential than your record sales might suggest. Is that frustrating?
'Not really. It's great to be recognised by other musicians and we'll always go down as the musicians' band. It's amazing how our name comes up in the strangest places. All across the board - jazz musicians, pop musicians and everything. But we've still never sold that many records. I think that was down to bad promotion. When 'Dogman' was released, New York radio stations were playing the title track all the time and we sold more records there than anywhere, but there still wasn't a major single release of any of the tracks.
'Jeff Ament from Pearl Jam was quoted on MTV as saying that as far as he's concerned, King's X invented grunge! When "Out Of The Silent Planet" came out, no-one else seemed to be doing D-tuned riffing like that. Then we went away for 18 months touring, got home and everyone was D-tuning, which was weird. We're just one of those quirky weird bands, like Jane's Addiction, Red Hot Chilli Peppers and Faith No More that were around in the late 80s, so I feel we were inspirational somewhere along the line.
'As far as influencing bassists is concerned, I think my tone is what I'm known for, which is fine by me. Chris Squire from Yes is my hero, and he had such a great tone. Roundabout and America were two of the first tunes I ever really sat down to work out all the way through.
'I'm not really impressed by fast players any more. I don't cut them down, because that takes a lot of work. I admire someone like Yngwie Malmsteen who can sit and play like that, but I've stopped writing to be clever, the gigs were ending up too much like hard work!'
With Kings X signed to a new label and things looking rosy for the band, why choose now to start a solo project?
'I've written about 100 songs in the last two years, and when I write for Kings X there are usually a few songs that don't work in that format, so as an outlet I decided to do my own record. The album is out on Metal Blade, with me playing bass and guitar and do all the vocals with a few different drummers. It's the dark side of King's X.
'Most of the material is real heavy but melodic as well. I've gone for something between Sly Stone and Hendrix, using the C-tuned/B-tuned Kings X style riffs, but with a kind of Neil Young approach too, sometimes. I'm making it real rootsy. I've got all the guitars tuned down to C, so it's real low but with my usual Gospel-y vocals. It's completely me, this is my record. I'm a control freak and this is my way of doing everything.'Posted by steve at October 16, 2007 1:41 AM | Tags -
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