Skip navigation

 Login or Register | Member Centre

Bloc part of secret coalition plot in 2000 with Canadian Alliance

DANIEL LEBLANC

Globe and Mail Update

Latest comment posted at 2:08 PM EST 03/12/08

A document obtained by The Globe and Mail shows that the scheme would have propelled then Alliance leader Stockwell Day to power in the coalition. The Alliance lawyer involved in the talks says he acted alone ...Read the full article

This conversation is semi-moderated What is moderation? | How do I report a comment?

  1. Spencer C from Canada writes: Woulda, coulda, shoulda...DIDN'T!

    Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?

    Secondly, I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.
  2. Walker fromtheevilempireofAB from Canada writes: This is getting beyond ridiculous
  3. dale spinx from Canada writes: Like sand through an hourglass....these are the days of our lives.
  4. Brian Van Ezel from Ottawa, Canada writes: Harper lied....that's a shock.
  5. John Northey from Georgetown, Canada writes: Well, given we know Harper has made deals with the Bloc to stay in power (see budgets the past few years) and that he tried to make a deal with them in 2005 so he could become PM I figure this is just an extension of that.

    The Bloc is evil, unless they are on our side. :)
  6. Martha K. from Canada writes: G&M; - you're trying way to hard.
  7. Louis Riel from Canada writes: Who signed this agreement?
  8. Western Independence Movement: Gathering Speed from Edmonton, Canada writes:

    You can't trust any of them.

    It's time to convert Canada into a more manageable group of autonomous states better known as a confederation. The Scots believe in this, Quebecers believe in this and growing numbers of westerners are embracing the concept.

    I do feel sorry for Ontario as it will be stuck with David Miller, Bob Rae, and the trade unions.
  9. Martha K. from Canada writes: Excuse me - way TOO hard. We know you are trying to bury Mr. Harper by assuring an historical association but I think this attempt is way past its due date.
  10. C R from Canada writes:
    Again, the precident was set then, and in 2004 by the GG. This is a poor idea and should not go forward. There are no bragging points on either side.
  11. Louise Volitans from Toronto, Canada writes: Who cares - we are in the year 2008 and the Alliance party doesn't even exist. The media in Canada are so biased it is sickening.
  12. Michael Longfield from Toronto, Canada writes: 'Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?'

    Please explain it to us... because given the PM's rhetoric of late you'd think even passing a Bloc MP in the hall is tantamount to high treason.
  13. Steve I'm Not an Alberta Redneck from Calgary, Canada writes: What this highlights is that the Block and the Reform/Alliance portion (probably a significant majority) are both similar in that they represent their regions first. The reason that there is currently such a hullaballoo here in Calgary about the coalition is that they see the CONs for what they are - a Calgary oil sector/western rural based party that will do things the way these two groups want them done. They can rationalize all they want, but this is not in the interest of the vast majority of Canadians.
  14. gary wilson from Calgary, writes: Harper as PM is like naming Sean Avery as captain of your hockey team. No doubt he has a few skills, but do you really want that kind of behaviour representing your team? Your party? Your country?

    Conservatives please just tell Harper to resign, then you can go on governing and all this goes away.
  15. sam themacman from waterloo, Canada writes: What else is in the closet?
  16. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: People - the Bloc is a legitimate party. Like any party, they have different goals and objectives - but they're ELECTED by Canadians. There's nothing illegal about the Bloc, and nothing sinister about working with them. Both the Harper 'conservatives' and the liberals have and will continue to deal with the Bloc - whether it's as a formal coalition or informally in confidence votes.

    Harper's whining, and over the top rhetoric about this coalition is just a pathetic excuse for his own mistakes. What part of MINORITY gov't did Harper NOT understand?

    Harper's stupidity is a fireable offense.
  17. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Harper has a secret agenda and now he is doing everything he can to hold on to power like a corrupt despot. The game's up.
  18. Desmond Whitton from Canada writes: The Bloc is the devil!... unless they're on the Conservative's side. The hypocrisy is staggering.
  19. Neidi Teidi from Toronto, Canada writes: Hee hee! I am getting such a kick out of this whole thing. The past few days have been a lot of fun.
  20. globefan Eh from Canada writes: Wasn't Stock parachuted into his riding..who did the parachuting and supporting..Does Ezra know? Power matters to those who would make us in their own image. I could of course be entirely wrong. Thanks Globe and Mail, I always enjoy your sleuthing for the people. Good information.
  21. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes:
    The 'Cheap Trick Party'

    Now led by the cheapest trick

    Harper.
  22. Moe Unting from Calgary, Canada writes: Its pretty thin reporting; Harper later united the alliance and progressive conservatives and then went into elections with the new beast. Whatever may have been discussed over tea has long since passed.
  23. D. Clearwater from Lethbridge, AB, Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: 'Secondly, I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.'

    I guess its relevance lies in the fact that people in the current Conservative party tried on more than one occasion to align with the Bloc when it was politically advantageous to do so. It is relevant because the Conservative are now trying to argue that the coalition is dangerous because it includes the Bloc.
  24. Alan S from Calgary, Canada writes: CBC and Globe keep you archeology skills honed, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, I am sure you can come up with more juicy dirt on the Conservatives. For example when short term cooperation, with BLOC, NDP to bring down the Liberals for an ELECTION, a few years back, is equated to a coalition created to take over power WITHOUT an election.
  25. Bad Bob from Montreal, Canada writes: Harper - just go away
  26. elle ryker lychkova from montreal, Canada writes: seems like the bloc party makes deals with everyone...if you were the runt of the litter, wouldn't you too? either way, for right now, a coalition government is the best, most balanced choice...i'd much rather have a socialist canadian system of government than a fascist american system of government any day!!! at least here we can fix pur mistakes instead of being forced to live with them and suffer their consequences.

    god bless canada!!!
  27. A B from Calgary Area, Canada writes: More proof of CON-BORG lies and BS
  28. Alistair McLaughlin from Ottawa, Canada writes: Neither Stock Nor Harper ever put their plans into action. In Day's case, he was facing a majority Liberal Parliament, so such a plan would have been completely off the table. Unless of course the plan included killing some Liberal MPs first. Maybe that will be the next 'secret' document to see light.
  29. Derek Holtom from Swan River, Canada writes: The bloc are playing the the country off one another. This is their dream! They are destroying this country.
    Also word from Liberal caucus that says seven MPs are thinking of breaking ranks.
  30. Patrick Kirk from Canada writes: This is completely IRRELEVANT. The story has to do with the Alliance Party and not the Conservatives, which are completely distinct from one another... not to mention it was under a different leader! It was WRONG then and it is WRONG today.

    Nice reporting Globe and Mail..trying to get everybody to support the coalition. The Globe is so biased in favour of the Lib/NDP it is unbelievable!
  31. Mystery Shopper from Canada writes: Lets face it they have all dealt with the devil at some point but now Harper wants to play God and send parliament to purgatory for an undisclosed amount of time
  32. Erik Richards from Winnipeg, MB, writes: This is sleazy politics and borderline sleazy journalism, and I use the word 'journalism' lightly. It's obvious the timing of this release is to embarrass at least one of the concerned political parties.

    However reading the article it appears that:

    a) none of the MPs involved appear to have been contacted;
    b) Harper was not involved;
    c) the Conservative party as it exists today was not involved; and
    d) the agreement was never signed by anyone.

    But other than that it's a fascinating document which obviously means... NOTHING!
  33. Alistair McLaughlin from Ottawa, Canada writes: With up-to-the-minute reporting like this, it's hard to understand how adscam went so long without detection.
  34. hugh grant from Canada writes:

    Yeah, and if you hold the words 'Globe and Mail' up to a mirror it reads 'National Enquirer'.........Come on, get back to some form of reality - print news, don't fabricate it.
  35. King Fisher from Canada writes: The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
  36. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Louise Volitans from Toronto, Canada writes: 'Who cares - we are in the year 2008 and the Alliance party doesn't even exist. The media in Canada are so biased it is sickening.'

    I CARE AS A CANADIAN ABOUT WHAT SECRET DEALS WERE COOKED UP AND CONSIDERED.

    TRUE, THE ALLIANCE PARTY DOESN'T EXIST ANYMORE, BUT WHERE DO YOU THINK THE CONSERVATIVES OF TODAY COME FROM? THE ALLIANCE PARTY, EXTREME RIGHT-WING AND ALBERTA-CENTRIC, IS THE BASIS OF THE CURRENT CONSERVATIVE PARTY. THEY RE-BRANDED THE ALLIANCE PARTY AND CALLED IT THE CONSERVATIVE PARTY. THEY DIDN'T THINK THEY WOULD HAVE A CHANCE AT A MAJORITY GOVERNMENT CALLING THEMSELVES THE ALLIANCE PARTY, SO THEY RE-MARKETED THEMSELVES. WELL, AFTER TWO ATTEMPTS, THE CONSERVATIVES STILL CAN'T GET A MAJORITY AND MOST CANADIANS DID NOT VOTE FOR THEM. WHEN ARE THEY GOING TO GET THE MESSAGE?
  37. Dorina Grossu from Norval, Canada writes: Where is the economic plan? Or there is no recession because Mr. Harper is saying so! How many people can live on less than $1500 while on EI since there are no jobs! What measures his party took? Has anything been communicated to us?
  38. Ray Luft from Mississauga, Canada writes: John Northey from Georgetown, Canada writes: Well, given we know Harper has made deals with the Bloc to stay in power (see budgets the past few years) and that he tried to make a deal with them in 2005 so he could become PM I figure this is just an extension of that.

    The Bloc is evil, unless they are on our side. :)

    It's not a question of good or evil. The Bloc is always for sale. It's a question of integrity. They have none.
  39. An Observer from Canada writes: What other information that the Globe have and when will it be released?
    What could have, what should of, and what is.
    How can we substantiate anything given?
  40. Lawrence Garvin from Canada writes: By the G&M;'s proposed narrative completing an action - any action - is exactly equivalent to thinking about it, or hearing about it, or something.

    Should make for a real boon in the criminal defence business.
  41. Barry Johnstone from Canada writes: I can hardly wait to read the Conservative blather about this one. I'm sure there will be hundreds of true believers following Mr. Harper's instructions to put their spin in here. We'll hear lots of stories about how its not really the same thing for some lame brain reason. Then there will be the ones who think this is okay but a deal with those 'socialists' in the NDP is the end of the world. We might get challenged to 'have an election' because that's more democratic! Well if Mr. Strong Leader had any intestinal fortitude he would face parliament and take the consequences for his actions. If Mr. Harper had simply tried to make things work instead of resorting to his bully tactics we wouldn't be having these discussions.
  42. Solomon Grundy from God Save Canada from Crooked Cons!, writes: Well well well well well well well well well well well well well!!!

    What have we here? Cons caught in hypocrisy again!

    If only it were surprising.

    HARPO! LET PARLIAMENT VOTE!
  43. Spencer C from Canada writes: Wow some people are really missing the point.

    It didn't happen!

    The key to good judgment is knowing when something is a bad idea.

    Clearly after studying the consequences it was determined that any coalition with the Bloc was a bad idea, therefore it was never acted upon.

    Are we really going to dig up every aborted idea, caucus brainstorming session and scotch-fueled strategy talk that anyone has ever contemplated?

    The plan was never enacted because it was found to be a BAD IDEA.
  44. King Fisher from Canada writes:
    Guess they'll have to call a 'pot and kettle' meeting.
  45. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: Okay, so Stockwell Day has something to answer for? Is this supposed to be some big bombshell that will make Canadians forget that Stephan Dion lost the election and will soon be our PM? Jedi Mind Trick? What's the relevance G&M;? This sort of media mischief making is that last thing Canadians need right now.
  46. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: Wow - this is getting ugly....someone is digging deep to try to undermine the CPC and has their fax machine well warmed up. Of course the salient point is that the Libs, to whom 60% were opposed, simply could not be removed from office from 93 to 04 so it is rather academic. Those were back in the days when Rosedale and Westmount firmly ran the country and boy do theyre willing to stop at nothing to get it back!
  47. J. B. from Vancouver, Canada writes: This confirms only what every rational person already knows: If it is to the benefit of the Right then it is perfectly fine. If anyone else tries it then it is high treason.

    I'd wait for the predictable reaction that 'the Alliance aren't the Conservatives' but I see that's already begun. How quaint.
  48. Leon Russell from Gatineau, Qc, Canada writes: globefan Eh from Canada writes: 'Wasn't Stock parachuted into his riding..' No, it was a Seadoo.
  49. David Anderson from Canada writes: Some comic relief from Mark Steyn:

    Name of new coalition party:

    New Libs on the Bloc
  50. Robert M from Maritimes, Canada writes: Day was wrong to deal with separatists then just as Dion and Layton are now.

    Conservatives supporters: Get over it, your party commited an act that many Canadians consider treason for personal ambition. Shame on you

    Liberal/NDP supporters: Two wrongs don't make a right. Your parties are trying to do the same thing. Shame on you
  51. Brian Kates from Winnipeg, Canada writes: Talk about thin gruel. Let me get this straight: someone wrote a letter eight years ago, it was never signed (or acted on), and now it's relevant?
  52. King Fisher from Canada writes:
    Sorry but its a 'Minority Government', the cons can't accept it, rather tin pot Stevie can't. Bring on Prentice.
  53. J L from Toronto, Canada writes: A coalition is wrong - unless the Conervatives do it.
  54. Norman Petit from Calgary, Canada writes: The sheer volume of new posters on these threads is staggering, even for the CPC war room.
  55. Rick Splick from Canada writes: This coalition isn't a beacon of stability. I give it a shelve life of 6 months, just enough time for a new liberal leader.
  56. L. W. from Greener Pastures, Canada writes: Stay tuned for the next episode of, As the house of commons turns. I vote for the local candidate and not the party, so I tend to find the humour in this. I feel sorry for those whom are tied into one party. They have difficulty seeing the forest for the trees.
  57. Michael Clark from Calgary, Canada writes: We know your trying to protect those adverstisement $ G&M; - but bringing
    up a document that is so old that two of the parties are defunct and the former leaders have no bearing on this current situation - get a life -
  58. Duncan Cunningham from Iqaluit, Canada writes: Just because there were plans to include the BQ in a government coalition in the past doesn't change the fact that it is still wrong.
    Having the BQ on the government side of the House is like having your goalie in hockey belonging to the other team.
  59. West Coast from Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Harper has a secret agenda and now he is doing everything he can to hold on to power like a corrupt despot. The game's up.

    ---------------------------

    Silly me. I thought the secret agenda of the day and the week was a three-headed beast known as the Coalition. Even when the biggest news of the day is the secret agenda of the left, folks like you, Zoe, seem to revel in Harper's eveil secret agenda. Un-friggin-believable.

    Then, to compound matters, a man like Dion does all he can though his days are numbered to assume the mantle of power. This despite hihs trouncing in the election a few weeks ago. Yet, it is Harper alone that seeks power.

    You, sir, are beyond funny.
  60. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: Interesting history lesson but the relevance is lost on me. If it's true I would say to hell with Stockwell Day for attempting to seize power then just like I say to hell with Dion and Layton for trying to do it today. If anything is reminds Canadians how dirty the Bloc are and underscores the need to keep them as far from power as humanly possible.
  61. Brian W from Toronto, Canada writes: Scandal, outrage, scandal, outrage, posturing, blaming, finger-pointing, scandal, outrage, posturing, blaming, finger-pointing, scandal.....

    Gotta love politics!!

    Hopefully every Canadian is paying a lot more attention to what's going on.
    They might learn something about our polictical system because after what I've read over the past few days has been mind boggling

    I wonder how these people passed History and Social Sciences in high school is beyond me.

    It'll be interesting to see Prime Time Steve deliver his most desparate message tonight
    - take note of how many lies he's going to tell us and how many truths he's not going to tell us
    I think Canadians (and the GG) will see through the sheep wool quite clearly.
  62. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Brian Kates from Winnipeg, Canada writes: Talk about thin gruel. Let me get this straight: someone wrote a letter eight years ago, it was never signed (or acted on), and now it's relevant?

    IT'S RELEVANT IN SOFAR AS HARPER IS NOW CATEGORICALLY DISTANCING HIMSELF AND HIS PARTY AND CRONIES FROM DOING DEALS OR CONSIDERING DEALS WITH THE BLOC. OF COURSE, WE ALL KNOW THIS IS HYPOCRISY AND INFORMATION LIKE THIS IS EVEN MORE PROOF OF THIS.

    IT IS TIME CANADIANS LET THEIR VOICES BE HEARD. MOST OF US DIDN'T VOTE FOR THE CONSERVATIVES. WE DON'T WANT OUR PARLIAMENT TAKEN HOSTAGE BY A PETTY LEADER WITH A MINORITY GOVERNMENT WHO IS INTENT ON PERVERTING DEMOCRACY SO HE CAN RUN HIS OWN SMEAR CAMPAIGN.
  63. R. M. from Regina, Canada writes: I have no doubt they did. Don't all snakes live in pits? The House of Commons/Senate is the biggest pit of all.
  64. PRAIRIE LARRY from Prairies, Canada writes: Let the people decide... Open the vote in the early New Year

    This is embarassing already...

    Let's face it, it's the only way that we, as the people can make the decision as opposed to leaving it to the likes of bozo's like Dion and Layton...
  65. Jason Roy from Central Nova - After October 14th AKA STILL Peter MacKay Country, Canada writes: J. B. from Vancouver, Canada writes: This confirms only what every rational person already knows: If it is to the benefit of the Right then it is perfectly fine. If anyone else tries it then it is high treason.

    I'd wait for the predictable reaction that 'the Alliance aren't the Conservatives' but I see that's already begun. How quaint.

    -----------------------------

    ...just like it's perfectly fine for 'the left' to include the BQ in their plans?
  66. Nathan Weatherdon from Canada writes: The Conservatives seem to think that what's ethical for them to do is unethical when someone does the same.

    Efforts to build coalition governments are the definition of strong democracy.

    Efforts by the Conservatives to paint the present situation as an assault on democracy are, themselves, an assualt on democracy.

    I respect any political position whether backed up by values or reasoned arguments. A political position that degrades the legitimacy of other views, or that seeks to undermine the ability of other political views to be represented, is inherently worthy of disrespect and is an inherent attack on the values of democracy.

    I hope the future leader of the Conservative party is able to represent the values of their constituents with due respect for the fact that the strength of democracy lies in its ability to represent a variety of positions.

    A majority that seeks to rule unchecked is a sign of weak democratic values. A minority that seeks to rule unchecked is a direct assault on those democratic values.

    The Cons need some time for some serious reflections on how to respect democracy while supporting their values.
  67. C L from T O, Canada writes: All par for the course. This kind of backroom dealing is normal in a minority situation, and a healthy component of parliamentary democracy. It keeps the governing party on its toes, causes it deliver good governance in order to maintain confidence, and provides a healthy dose of new ideas that can be used as policy or, at least, to affect change.

    Harper's bombast against 'working with separatists' are just words, (obviously) don't hold any water, and shows that the only way the Cons can hope to hold onto power, in light of the current political reality in Canada, is through FUD: fear, intimidation and doubt.

    Get this FUDrucker out of power, and very very soon please, before he drives the country into the toilet.
  68. johnny thunder from Canada writes: thank god the libs got a majority and this didn't happen. man oh man, we'd be taking an iron fist real good if the bloc had any power
  69. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Nice to see the mop and pail pushing their political agenda under the guise of a respectable national newspaper. LOL - planning to discuss something is a far cry from giving the bloc the lever.

    But of course this is lost on anybody with a coalition agenda - which of course includes the mop and pail.

    I have said it before and I repeat - no respectable newspaper would carry on with this type of biased and agenda driven reporting. Only the mop and pail would preach this nonsense.
  70. Sam Barns from moncton, Canada writes: Harper and the NeoCons are lying, deceitful, contradictory, arrogant, abrasive, hypocritical, bigoted, and chauvenistic.

    They have no confidence in Parliament and are violating the principle of 'responsible government' on which Canadian democracy is founded.

    Turf them. Fell them. Send them packing.

    Cheers to the democratic coalition of the majority of elected MPs!
  71. john may from writes: The nore parties you have the more dysfunctional a parliament becomes. More petty fiefdoms.
    Less sensible government.
  72. Bob Bobins from Calgary, Canada writes: Why isn't the fact that harper signed a document moving for the exact same thing in 2004?_______________________________________________________

    'September 9, 2004

    Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson,
    C.C., C.M.M., C.O.M., C.D.
    Governor General
    Rideau Hall
    1 Sussex Drive
    Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0A1

    Excellency,
    As leaders of the opposition parties, we are well aware that, given the Liberal minority government, you could be asked by the Prime Minister
    to dissolve the 38th Parliament at any time should the House of Commons fail to support some part of the government's program.
    We respectfully point out that the opposition parties, who together constitute a majority in the House, have been in close consultation. We believe that, should a request for dissolution arise this should give you cause, as constitutional practice has determined, to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your constitutional authority.
    Your attention to this matter is appreciated.

    Sincerely,
    Hon. Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P.
    Leader of the Opposition
    Leader of the Conservative Party of Canada'

    (Also signed by Duceppe and Layton)
  73. Bernard Samson from Dog River Sask, Canada writes: It's true the document in question was never signed (and could be argued to be only a contingency plan). This preserves the 'plausible deniability' of such a piece of skullduggery. However a bit of research will confirm there were other such 'ententes cordiales' undertaken from time to time, to preserve the governments of the day.

    Nothing wrong with that. Mr. Harper loses credibility when he or his supporters begin to froth at the mouth at the concept of ever getting in bed with 'separatists'. Let's face it, his successive minority governments have survived many times only with the sufferance of the Bloc. Hey, isn't that the definition of 'functional' as opposed to 'dysfunctional' government?
  74. r b from Canadian Coalition Coup Party (CCCP) Headquarters, Canada writes: The Liberals have outdone the Conservatives again.

    While Day's lawyer mused about treason, the Liberals have gone all the way and made it policy.

    Congratulations!
  75. K T from Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: Wow some people are really missing the point.

    It didn't happen!

    The key to good judgment is knowing when something is a bad idea.

    Clearly after studying the consequences it was determined that any coalition with the Bloc was a bad idea, therefore it was never acted upon.

    Are we really going to dig up every aborted idea, caucus brainstorming session and scotch-fueled strategy talk that anyone has ever contemplated?

    The plan was never enacted because it was found to be a BAD IDEA.

    - Spencer it wasn't abouot judgement, the libs won a clear majority so there was no point signing it. If the libs had won a minority, I bet the pens would have hit the paper immediately. Not signing had nothing to do with showing good judgement.
  76. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: It was wrong then and it's wrong now. So what? Treason is always wrong. When the people of Canada give the keys to the kingdom to Dion after winning an election I will kiss his ring. Until then, he can go to hell.
  77. Caroline Knowles from St. John's, Canada writes: If it's treasonous, and undemocratic, and illegal now, as Harper insists, then it was treasonous and undemocratic and illegal when HE did it, and when Day did it. Same standard. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, Stephen. How dare Harper question the patriotism of Liberals or NDP, when he himself was perfectly willing to hop into bed with the Bloc just a few short years ago, and obviously so was Day a few years before. This double standard is ludicrous, and Canadians can see through it no matter how many times a handful of Neo-Con faithful clear cookies and change aliases to post their hate-filled diatribes.
  78. Chas van Dyck from Winnipeg, Canada writes: Well, not that surprising. Anything the Reform/Alliance folks, now masquerading as Conservatives do,can't shock Canadians anymore - we've seen enought to see that they'll stop at nothing. The current attack ads show, that just like during the election campaign, Harper's hapless followers have nothing to say on substantive issues, and thus, all they can do is attack their opponents when they have something constructive to offer. Many have feared all along, that Harper had a hidden agenda, and now we see our fears were not unfounded. Shutting down unions' right to strike, abandoning pay equity for women, shutting down opposition parties by taking away funding (and these parties often speak for those who can't afford to give donations to political like so many Con supporters can), who will be next? Canadians, let's give our collective heads a shake, and realize that it's high time we got our current government OUT OF OFFICE! Also, for all those who have such abhorrance for the idea of a coalition government: what do you think we've had for the last few years? Nothing but a coalition between Reform/Alliance and Progressive Conservatives, built on Peter McKay's lie to David Orchard. And, for those worried about the Bloc in all of this, who better to manage that than Stephane Dion, author of the clarity act? If ever there was someone committed to federalism, it is surely he!
  79. Armins copy of Swank from Canada writes: 8 years ago. One lawyer acting alone. Nice try Globe.
  80. West Coast from Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes:

    IT IS TIME CANADIANS LET THEIR VOICES BE HEARD.

    -------------------------

    Too funny. (Again.) Because, it seems to me that a motley association of libtards, leftards and blocheads want to do everything in their power to PREVENT an election.

    New Libs on the Bloc, indeed.
  81. Bob Smitherman from Canada writes: PRAIRIE LARRY from Prairies, Canada writes: Let the people decide... Open the vote in the early New Year
    -------------------------

    ...and get the same result as he last two times?

    That's exactly the reason the GG has been given her power, to stop the unnecessary cycle of continuously going to the polls with the same result. It's time to offer it to another group of elected ministers.
  82. Swiminbuff In Toronto from Canada writes: I agree with an earlier posting, Harper's stupidity is a fireable offence. He needs to do the honorable thing and resign now.
  83. St Fort from Victoria, Canada writes: Time for the Globe and Mail to behave itself and quit acting as an agent for this Coalition.
    You guys are throwing and digging to find something that will give you traction. Shame on you.
  84. King Fisher from Canada writes:
    And the 'Mop and Pail' endorsed who for PM.... twice???
  85. Ice Rider from Edmonton, Canada writes: Remember it was another Tory -- Mulroney -- who sold Canada's soul to the separatists to grab and hold power. Then it all went pear-shaped and we got the Bloc as a result. The Tories have done more for national disunity in Canada over the past 20 years than any separatist in Quebec.
  86. Russell Koehler from Calgary, Canada writes: The Conservatives are shown to be hypocrites again? How many times does this have to happen before people stop believing them for good.
  87. gilles monenemie from Montreal, Canada writes: Its a crazy Tory TV night, harper and the lies i live by at 7pm
    Airbus and the lies of old at 9pm
    Look for the tory propaganda machine commericals in between for more tory entertainment. You can't say they aren't helping the TV industry.

  88. Shawn Bull from Canada writes: Yes I know Globe you want to see the coalition succeed thus this document that magically appeared out of nowhere.
  89. jamie yavis from Canada writes: The sooner we get rid of Harper and his lying, conniving ways the better Canada will be ... the man is absolutely disgusting!
  90. A Guy from Ontario, Canada writes:

    The Conservatives, in their attempts to gain and hold power, are the most dangerous party in Canada.

    treacherous = Conservative

    gullible = Conservative voters
  91. Tory In Alberta from Calgary, Canada writes: Here we have Harper again, wearing his 'do as I say not as I do hat'. His ego and vindictiveness got him into this political mess. I'm all for allowing the 63% majority an opportunity to show that they can govern for the benefit of all. Harper definitely didn't meet that test.
  92. R B from Vancouver, Canada writes: globefan Eh from Canada writes: 'Wasn't Stock parachuted into his riding?' - I don't think so. He rode in on a Sea-Doo.
  93. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: It is interesting watching this whole thing because it is revealing about the support bases of the parties, which I interpret as follows:

    Liberals: Eastern big business
    NDP: Eastern big unions and academia
    Bloc: Quebec state-owned big business and unions and academia
    Conservatives: everyone else

    When you look at the electoral geography, I'm not far off; TO and Mtl knows where their bread is buttered so they vote Liberal, but once you get away from vested interests across the country, you get a lot of support for the CPC. The party funding issue is a good example - Angus Reid poll showed 48% in favour of removing it vs. 34% in favour of keeping it.
  94. North Star from Canada writes: Pot, meet kettle.
  95. gilles monenemie from Montreal, Canada writes: Neutered Bull

    even us quebecers dare will be tuned in for da tory TV night 2nyt!
  96. Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: Martha K. from Canada writes: Excuse me - way TOO hard. We know you are trying to bury Mr. Harper by assuring an historical association but I think this attempt is way past its due date.

    -----

    Actually this is very relevent. How is the bloc the devil incarnate one day, but not in 2000 and 2004. In other words, Harper is completely cynical and it is clear for all of his harsh rhetoric he is in fact willing to make a pact with the devil's grandmother to stay in power. Even to the point of using such an anti-democratic measure like proroguing to avoid a confidence motion in the house after only a few days sitting.

    Let's see how much he turns up the rhetoric tonight.
  97. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: PRAIRIE LARRY from Prairies, Canada writes: Let the people decide... Open the vote in the early New Year

    This is embarassing already...

    Let's face it, it's the only way that we, as the people can make the decision as opposed to leaving it to the likes of bozo's like Dion and Layton...

    NO, THAT'S A BAD IDEA. THE PEOPLE SPOKE WHEN WE HAD AN ELECTION IN OCTOBER. MOST CANADIANS DID NOT VOTE FOR THE CONSERVATIVES. MOST CHOSE NON-CONSERVATIVE MPs. A COALITION IS A PERFECTLY LEGAL CONSEQUENCE OF THIS ELECTION RESULT.

    SPENDING ANOTHER $35 MILLION ON AN ELECTION WOULD BE ROBBING THE TAXPAYERS. WHAT WOULD THE RESULT BE? A THIRD MINORITY GOVERNMENT FOR THE CONSERVATIVES? THAT PUTS A COALITION BACK ON THE TABLE. IT IS HIGHLY UNLIKELY THAT THE CONSERVATIVES COULD COME BACK AND GET A MAJORITY.

    WE ARE ALSO FACING A HUGE CRISIS HERE AND DON'T HAVE TIME TO WASTE. WE NEED THE COALITION TO GET DOWN TO WORK ASAP AND START RESCUING OUR ECONOMY. OBVIOUSLY, HARPER IS DOING NOTHING TO MEND OUR FAILING ECONOMY. HE HAS YET TO ADMIT WE ARE IN RECESSION.
  98. Johnny Test from Pork Belly, Canada writes: Joe Clark endorsed Day as PM? Something is not kosher here.
  99. West Coast from Canada writes: Sam Barns from moncton, Canada writes:

    Cheers to the democratic coalition of the majority of elected MPs!

    ---------------------------------

    Seig heil, comrade!
  100. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: The Libs called it treason when Day tried it. How can they argue it's not treason now that Dion has actually done it?
  101. NL Patriot from Republic of Newfoundland, Canada writes: Wow, where are the names on this coalition agreement, I would liek to see the leaders names on it.

    This is getting hilarious, I can't beleive the G&M; printed this
  102. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: C'mon people - the Bloc are a legitimate Canadian party. Make them illegal then complain. Until then, shut up and do something that will actually make a difference - like throwing the incompetent, divisive, arrogant Harper under the wheels of the bus before he destroys any gains the Alliance party has made since they're re-branding as so-called conservatives.

    Besides, if Quebec were ever going to separate from Canada it would have happened already. Isn't that how the argument goes?
  103. Jesu Pifco from Canada writes: Western Indepenedence,
    Err....Canada IS a confederation, albeit of semi-autonomous provinces. I thought all separatists out there wanted to go it alone, but if it's a 'hypocracy' some want...
  104. Sil T from Mississauga, Canada writes: 'Do as we say, not as we do.' - The Conservative Party of Canada.

    All this talk of Quebec getting money being a reason for dissent against a coalition is hilarious. I must ask, when Harper gave Quebec an extra $2 billion in the 2007 budget, did you Conservatives stomp your feet, gnash your teeth, and write stern letters to your MPs?
  105. a l from Toronto, Canada writes: The Conservatives have now lost all credibility to take the moral high ground on this issue.

    Harper should cancel his public address - there is nothing he can say to redeem himself or the former parties which make up the current Conservative party.

    He should take the time instead to draft a resignation letter and step down. Let Prentice lead.
  106. Hee Hoo Sai from Canada writes: Yesterdays news proves that the seperatists will sell their lack of principles to the highest bidder. This time though, the winner is broke like Quebec.
  107. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: The Liberals, in their attempts to gain and hold power, are the most dangerous party in Canada.

    treacherous = Liberal

    gullible = Liberal voters
  108. Bemused Lurker from Edmonton, Canada writes: I have to laugh at how the Bloq is being portrayed as 'EVIL' just because they hold the balance of power.

    Its called politics for a reason. A minority government will function with a loose coalition, or will fail when it cannot achieve one. In this case we have a coalition so what is the issue?

    People sure love democracy except when the vote goes against them. (and please learn the difference between a republic and the type of government that we have in Canada. They are different.)
  109. Georges Drouin from Montreal, Canada writes: Politics makes from strange bedfellows. Here is but another example of such machinations. It is not ever a question whether such tractations actually led to their actualization. It is only a question of intention.

    The Reform and the actual Conservative parties agreed to align themselves with the Bloc. The reasons for doing so are clear, to seize power. No different than today.

    The Conservatives accuse the Bloc of prostituting themselves to form a coalition government. This is no different than the Reform/Conservatives prostituting themselves on two previous occasions.

    There is no difference whatsoever. Daniel Leblanc of the Globe has done a good journalistic job in uncovering these facts. I call this efficient journalism.

    As I insinuated earlier 'this is politics'. Nothing more nothing less.

    Get used to it. Georges D.
  110. Harper can't be trusted from Canada writes: Something to think about.

    Let's just say that somehow Harpo found a way to save his bacon for now. Unlikely I know, but just consider it for a second.

    What does that do for US?

    Does it restore the confidence of the House of Commons in him? No it does not. At teh first opportunity, the coalition will remove him from power.

    Does it mean that Harpo will 'play nice' with others in the spirit of cooperation? No it does not. Harpo has already proven that at the first opportunity he will again try to destroy his political opponents.

    All that Harper is doing is postponing the inevitable and in the process, creating a unity crisis where none existed.

    In fact, through his actions now, Harper is trying to prevent Parliamentary laws from being enforced! Harper is PROVING that he is unfit to lead, as he is proving that he does not respect Parliament!

    It's over Harper.

    Pack your bags

    You are SO finished no matter what games you try to play.

    Give up, you simply can not win.
  111. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: I will agree that this story is OLD. Almost as old as Adscam. Why doesn't the Globe concentrate on more recent stories like Harper's in and out election financing cheat scheme, or his Cadman bribe and sleazy way he used libel chill to keep it out of the last election?
  112. Silent Majority from Canada writes: So what this one separatist says is gospel? Does he have proof?
  113. P S from Canada writes: West Coast from Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Harper has a secret agenda and now he is doing everything he can to hold on to power like a corrupt despot. The game's up. --------------------------- Silly me. I thought the secret agenda of the day and the week was a three-headed beast known as the Coalition. Even when the biggest news of the day is the secret agenda of the left, folks like you, Zoe, seem to revel in Harper's eveil secret agenda. Un-friggin-believable. Then, to compound matters, a man like Dion does all he can though his days are numbered to assume the mantle of power. This despite hihs trouncing in the election a few weeks ago. Yet, it is Harper alone that seeks power. You, sir, are beyond funny. ----------------------------------------------------------- West Coast are you on the CPC payroll? Everyone acknowledges that the opposition is fighting for its collective life. This is no power play. The last thing the majority of liberals want right now is to govern. They all know it will likely lead to more problems that it will fix, but Harper has left them little choice. Harper had a choice to (i) govern with the mandate provided to him or (ii) to play politics and confuse the public into giving him a majority. He chose the latter. He's pulling the strings here -and he's planned this offensive for a long time. Make no mistake about it - and take your CPC hat off for just a minute. There is no power grab from the opposition. It's a pathetic but necessary play for survival.
  114. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Systemic Risk from Canada writes: 'It is interesting watching this whole thing because it is revealing about the support bases of the parties, which I interpret as follows:

    Liberals: Eastern big business
    NDP: Eastern big unions and academia
    Bloc: Quebec state-owned big business and unions and academia
    Conservatives: everyone else

    When you look at the electoral geography, I'm not far off; TO and Mtl knows where their bread is buttered so they vote Liberal, but once you get away from vested interests across the country, you get a lot of support for the CPC. The party funding issue is a good example - Angus Reid poll showed 48% in favour of removing it vs. 34% in favour of keeping it.'

    YES, EVER NOTICE THAT THE POOREST EDUCATED AND MOST ILL-INFORMED CANADIANS VOTE CONSERVATIVE. GUESS IT'S EASIER NOT TO THINK FOR YOURSELF WHEN YOU AREN'T TOO SMART.
  115. Richard Soley from writes: theglobeandmail.com

    Zoe Morrow your parnoia is overwhelming, perhaps the west should not have any say in how the country is run. Please read the attached link if you really want to discuss 'secret agendas' and more importantly intergrity, honesty, and truth. As a westerner I am tired of being called a 'redneck' a Neo Con etc, the insults from the left go on as do the lies, call my bluff and read the link, Mr, Dion flaty rejected a coalition with the NDP as 'bad' for the country but is now prepared to give veto power to the BLOC, and empower the NDP to piss away billons. WHose going to buy the cars, lumber, etc. Go ahead and shut down the oil sands we'll wait sport till it gets real cold but the price will go up, and ask all the workers in the atlantic provinces who now have jobs in ALberta how they feel about you Liberal party. Go back to your dog and pony show but read the link.
  116. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: Another variation: IF Harper were ever going to tell the truth, it would have happened already.
  117. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: 'Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?

    Secondly, I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party. '

    Man, just ... give it up.
  118. Johnny Test from Pork Belly, Canada writes: What a joke the document doesn't even have signatures on it. It's likely a fraud.
  119. Jason Roy from Central Nova - After October 14th AKA STILL Peter MacKay Country, Canada writes: I wonder if the dumb@sses here trying to tie Harper into this even realise Harper was not even an MP in 2000?
  120. Plus 8 from Mont Tremblant, Canada writes: 'Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?
    Secondly, I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.'
    -------------------------------

    You guys can squirm but you can't hide.

    We have now determined that there are at least two previous instances that Harper or his party has attempted coalitions with Bloc support. (2000 and 2006)

    I disagree with you, I do NOT see a difference between proposing such an accord and putting it into action. The intent is identical. However, I also see NOTHING wrong in such a deal (aside from keeping it from the public gaze for 8 years). It is well within Parliamentary Law and precedent.

    What does bother me is that Harper now attacks the same Coalition for making the same agreement he and his cronies made twice in past. For Harper, it has suddenly become 'unpatrioitic'. 'unCanadian' and 'separatist. Give me a break.

    Is this the distasteful fellow the one we want at the helm at the moment. No wonder he lost the confidence of the house? (No small feat!)

    He is a mountebank http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/mountebank

    He must be replaced as soon as possible lest his damage continue. Either the Conservatives replace him or someone must replace the Conservatives. We need a functioning government now!

    end
  121. Guy From Guelph from Guelph, Canada writes: Wow, a document that was drawn up by a lawyer who may or may not have been working for a non-existent party, whose leader is no longer the leader, which has no signatures on it, and has somehow stayed buried for 7 years. All of a sudden, this document just HAPPENS to appear. How convenient for the Liberals.

    I have a document I made up too. It's got spots for Harper, Dion, Layton, and that traitor from Quebec to sign, which states that they are all idiots and that they are all resigning, and let some people take over that actually care about Canada. I've been to all of their local offices during the campaign, so I must be affiliated, which of course gives the document validity.

    Stop sensationalizing the news. Stick to real facts. I think Harper's an idiot too, but no reason to make up garbage like this.
  122. reality man from Canada writes: It's funny how every Con supporter rationalizes the CONSTANT cooperation between Canadian conservative parties and separatists a) Stockwell Day, who is a minister in the current government, and who is currently attacking Liberal cooperation with the Bloc, was willing to do the exact same thing to 'gain power through the backdoor' by making a pact with separatists. This is called hypocrisy and more damagingly a PRECEDENT! b) he plotted the scheme before the results of the election was even known, therefore, providing bullet-proof evidence of pre-planning, which is the thing that Con supporters are accusing the NDP and Bloc of doing. Hypocrisy? c) the Canadian Alliance is now TECHNICALLY defunct but it is one of the direct precursors to the Conservative Party and one of its 2 essential components. Joe Clark apparently was also involved making the leaders of both parties which amalgamated into the Conservative Party culpable d) Stephen Harper also plotted with separatists and socialists to 'take power through the back door' to turf the Martin Lib minority. This also is called hypocrisy and a PRECEDENT. The fact that both Harper and Day entered into such agreements indicate that they BOTH believe that i) replacing an elected minority with a coalition is legal, moral and part of Canadian parliamentary tradition ii) that an election is not needed to legitimize such a coalition and iii) that any such coalition depending on Bloc support is LEGITIMATE iv) they are both willing to throw Canada into a constitutional srisis to prevent actions that they themselves legitimated and desired. Throw in the fact that Mulroney gave foam at the mouth separatists (like Lucien Boachard) actual cabinet positions in both of his governments and caved in on several separatist demands collectively known as the Meech Lake accord (i.e he was willing to amend our constitution with separatist demands to win power) and you have an unprecedented level of hypocrisy unethical behavior
  123. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: Yawn. Nice try Leblanc. Next he's going to dazzle us with an old Christmas card he got from Alexi McDonough back in 92.
  124. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: If Canada were ever going to see responsible and competent governance from the Harper 'conservatives' it would have happened already.
  125. Brandan Matchett from halifax, Canada writes: Secret backroom meetings:

    Unknown Conservative says' so mr or mrs. Liberal mp. How about a cabinet position. we have convinced 9 of your comrades to cross the floor, and they are all on board. We need one more for our majority. Can we count on your support? If you don't cross the floor we can get someone else.

    Naw this would never happen - these people have way too much integrity for this kind of event to take place. drips with sarcasm
  126. Fake Name from Canada writes: 'Louise Volitans from Toronto, Canada writes: Who cares - we are in the year 2008 and the Alliance party doesn't even exist. The media in Canada are so biased it is sickening.'

    Well, considering that Day is still on the conservative front bench that was loudly claiming they'd NEVER consider such a deal as of yesterday afternoon, it does provide a bit of a character reference. I would think they ought to have some record of particularly important documents they'd given other parties, that they could reasonably expect them to have retained, so they wouldn't get caught with their pants down having now claimed never to have written any such thing.

    And Armins, is it REALLY conceivable that one lawyer acting alone would have prepared a document for his leader's signature that would have installed him as Prime Minister, turned over federal powers to the provinces, and relaxed the criteria for Quebec separation - all without the leader being aware of it? Can you say 'fall-guy'? His story is about as credible as the coalition's claim that their motives are pure as the driven snow.
  127. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: Wow, a document that was drawn up by a lawyer who may or may not have been working for a non-existent party, whose leader is no longer the leader, which has no signatures on it, and has somehow stayed buried for 7 years. All of a sudden, this document just HAPPENS to appear. How convenient for the Liberals.

    I have a document I made up too. It's got spots for Harper, Dion, Layton, and that traitor from Quebec to sign, which states that they are all idiots and that they are all resigning, and let some people take over that actually care about Canada. I've been to all of their local offices during the campaign, so I must be affiliated, which of course gives the document validity.

    Stop sensationalizing the news. Stick to real facts. I think Harper's an idiot too, but no reason to make up garbage like this.
  128. Guy From Guelph from Guelph, Canada writes: I like how my last comment originally got posted with the name of this newspaper in it and didn't make it to the board. I took it out, reposted, and somehow it makes it up. Interesting...
  129. Evil Umpire from Ottawa, Canada writes: the alliance/reform party still exists. just under a different name.
    this lawyer acted alone just like a lone gunman shot kennedy with his magic bullet.
  130. Nerdy Girl from Ottawa, Canada writes: Harper will spend millions and say anything to ensure he stays in power. He is in fact a desperate man. He will play on the political ignorance of the average hardworking Canadian. He will make them dig deep in their own pockets to further finance and prop up his lies and manipulations. I do not want him leading my country with those values.
    Congratulations to the majority of elected Members of Parliament in opposition for protecting the values of my Canada. I will still have less fear of the unknown waters of a coalition than the known shark infested, self-serving waters of a Harper government.
  131. Jeff M from Canada writes: Harper's address tonight:

    'Good evening my fellow Canadians. Through no fault of our own, these last few days have been very traumatic and dramatic at a time when calm and good judgement should prevail. Bla, blah blah. Blah, blah, blah. Undemocratic, blah, blah, blah. Separatist, blah, blah, blah. Usurping power, blah, blah, blah. Repeat last 3 sentences 18 times.

    Thank you and God Bless Canada.'

    Harper lies. From the time he clambers out of his regeneration chamber in the morning until he plugs himself back in each night.

    The tribe has spoken, Stevie. It's time for you to leave.
  132. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: The net net here folks is that Quebec runs the country - that was the trade off after the 95 referendum and most Quebecois are smart enough to realize what an incredibly amazing deal they have: 7.5 milion people with access to the resources of a country with 33.5 million and a political veto on everything. All uniting the right did was confirm that no other party could get a majority (by dividing Ontario). I think both parties should be ashamed of currying favour with the Bloc but what other choice do they have. It worth noting though that the Canada exQC trend in politics has been firmly going in the CPCs favour - they have 133 of the 233 seats or 57%. The left better hope Quebec never secedes!
  133. Brett Chandler from Whitehorse, Canada writes: And to think that only a month ago I despaired over how much more interesting the American election was...

    Harper is trying to deny the basic principles of Parliamentary democracy. He also seems to have lost the ability to count. He can try all he wants to govern as though he has a majority, but this is the risk he runs.

    The 'Fiscal Update' (amusingly abbreviated 'FU') was not the document of a careful, conciliatory minority government attempting to navigate a crisis, but an arrogant slap in the face to parliament and Canadians.

    If Dion and Layton were attempting some kind of naked power-grab, the time to do it would have been election night. Harper and his cabinet had a chance to consider a response to a global economic crisis, and responded with a drop-in-the-bucket proposal to drop political party subsidies. What a joke.

    I don't like our government overthrown in a bloodless coup, but neither do I want Harper's numb, indifferent, arrogant leadership to continue. He blew it.
  134. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: 'The media in Canada are so biased it is sickening. '

    Yeah, I can't possibly see the relevence of a party arguing that forming a coalition with separatists is treason, while having tried to form such a coalition in the past.

    Unbiased media doesn't mean 'only report the stuff we like', you know.
  135. Bad Bob from Montreal, Canada writes: Was this document ever signed by the three parties? If so then make it public.
  136. Suburban Sisyphus from Canada writes: Political party coalitions are un-Canadian ...unless a party on the right is involved.

    Harper's hole continues to get deeper...
  137. West Coast from Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: SPENDING ANOTHER $35 MILLION ON AN ELECTION WOULD BE ROBBING THE TAXPAYERS. WHAT WOULD THE RESULT BE?

    -------------------------

    Right. Why waste/'rob' $35 (?) million on an election when we can overthrow the government and shovel ('rob') $30 billion in taxpayer money for a 'stimulus' and another billion to Quebec?

    Right.
  138. Johnny Test from Pork Belly, Canada writes: reality man from Canada writes: It's funny how every Con supporter rationalizes the CONSTANT cooperation between Canadian conservative parties and separatists a) Stockwell Day, who is a minister in the current government, and who is currently attacking Liberal cooperation with the Bloc, was willing to do the exact same thing to 'gain power through the backdoor' by making a pact with separatists. This is called hypocrisy and more damagingly a PRECEDENT! b) he plotted the scheme before the results of the election was even known, therefore, providing bullet-proof evidence of pre-planning, which is the thing that Con supporters are accusing the NDP and Bloc of doing.

    Really where is the proof? I don't see any signatures on the document. Someone else could of typed it up for all we know. There is no proof. There is even the convenient statement that other MPs didn't know about this. Maybe it's because it never actually happened?
  139. Solomon Grundy from God Save Canada from Crooked Cons!, writes: .

    Haaaaaaaaarper!

    Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaper!

    Do you have the confidence of Parliament???

    If you think so, stop scurrying like a rat and prove it!

    .
  140. K J from Toronto, Canada writes: Am I missing something? The argument against this article is that previously plotted coalitions, for whatever reason, never happened. This one hasn't happened (yet) either. There is time for Harper to get his act together before Monday & present something that won't topple his government. The GG doesn't have to agree to a coalition government. People need to stop making excuses for why this is wrong & just do something that is right!
  141. Bob Bobins from Calgary, Canada writes: In sept 2004 harper signed a document suggesting that indeed should the liberal government disolve parliment that they along with the seperatist and the NDP would represent the majority.. and form a coalition government in a similar manner as the current opposition parties are doing right now.
  142. Derek Holtom from Swan River, Canada writes: People are celebrating while Canada burns.
    Only the Bloc benefits from all this
  143. PRAIRIE LARRY from Prairies, Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: WE ARE ALSO FACING A HUGE CRISIS HERE AND DON'T HAVE TIME TO WASTE. WE NEED THE COALITION TO GET DOWN TO WORK ASAP AND START RESCUING OUR ECONOMY. OBVIOUSLY, HARPER IS DOING NOTHING TO MEND OUR FAILING ECONOMY. HE HAS YET TO ADMIT WE ARE IN RECESSION.

    I agree 100%... We don't have time to deal with this grabage and it's time all MP's got their 'You know what' together and deal with what they are paid to do, and that's govern the nation...

    If that means firing Flaherty (which he's probably looking for a new job now, or should be) Good... Get back to their offices and come up with something that will help the economy and all the people who are and are about to lose their jobs, etc...

    Let's Git Er Done!!!
  144. Sober Second Thought from Toronto, Canada writes: Great to see the Globe finally using their journalistic skills instead of giving Harper a free ride - he probably counted on the Globe's support before his disastrous update.

    This will undermine most of what Harper is probably going to whine about on national TV. Remember how Martin looked pathetic a few years ago - Harper will be even more embarrassing.
  145. M P from Toronto, Canada writes: Well put Guy From Guelph.

    Why the Globe and Mail bothers with this garbage is a mystery. I thought this was a reputable and unbiased paper. Lately, it is clear who's side they are on. So much for unbiased reporting.
  146. The Wight from Canada writes: I'm really wondering what the CPC faithful are going to have to say when Harper attempts to prorogue parliament. Where do you think he's going the minute he gets approval for that?

    Straight to the BQ to try and cobble together a working coalition for a majority. Think he'll trust his political future to the off chance that some bill they table or budget they table will somehow convince a Liberal appointee GG that they've turned the corner and know what the heck they are doing? Hardly.

    Insult and denigrate the BQ at your own peril conservatives ... that entire 'balance of power' thing means you will be there, hat in hand, if you really want to save this minority government.
  147. Bad Bob from Montreal, Canada writes: Bob Bobins from Calgary - do you have proof? If so where is the signed document?
  148. Sam Barns from moncton, Canada writes: The Conservatives clearly cannot accept the basic and fundamental principle by which our system of Parliamentary democracy functions: Responsible Government, meaning that the executive and PM are fully accountable to the MPs of Parliament.

    The Cons do not have a majority in the House and cannot pass legislation.

    The opposition is ready to work as a coalition to make Parliament function.

    All of this is 100% legit and constitutional.

    The deliberate and disgusting campaign of disinformation coming out of the Conservative Party offends our system of Parliamentary democracy and must be opposed forthright by the majority of elected MPs in Canada.

    The Cons are manipulating popular ignorance on how our system of government works, just in order to keep power without the support of Parliament.

    The opposition must not back down; bring down the government and establish a new one based on the democratic results of the last election.

    This story proves once again how the Cons are the most hypocritical bunch of 'power grabbers' around; they are lying systematically to overturn or forestall the democratic will of Parliament.
  149. Paul F. from Toronto, Canada writes: Systemic Risk from Canada writes: It is interesting watching this whole thing because it is revealing about the support bases of the parties, which I interpret as follows:

    Liberals: Eastern big business
    NDP: Eastern big unions and academia
    Bloc: Quebec state-owned big business and unions and academia
    Conservatives: everyone else

    ----

    I guess the businesses based in Calgary, like the oil companies and other major corporations, are just the 'little people' included in 'everyone else'.

    By the way, funny how 'everyone else' got 1 million less votes than Eastern Big Business and Eastern big unions and academia.

    Your moronic division of the political parties is beyond stupid. Maybe you forgot the NDP got half of its seats west of Ontario.

    Not that facts matter in your 'analysis'. The Tories got majority of the vote in only two provinces, Alberta and Saskatchewan. So they don't get the only say in who is the government of the country.
  150. Brandan Matchett from halifax, Canada writes: Further backroom deals.

    Harper addresses the nation. 'we have managed to find 10 MP's 8 libs and 2 ndp mp's who have decided in the best interest of canada to cross the floor and become conservatives.'

    Meanwhile Dion shopping for wallpaper for his new house on sussex drive 'waht du yu meen, the colitiion is not appening?'
  151. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: sam themacman from waterloo, Canada writes: What else is in the closet?

    John Baird, but that's another story. ;)
  152. Michael Longfield from Toronto, Canada writes: The only thing Harper can do to avoid a confidence vote is admit the economic update was a grave mistake and ditch Flaherty. (I don't think it will happen.)
  153. JIm Smith from Canada writes: 'YES, EVER NOTICE THAT THE POOREST EDUCATED AND MOST ILL-INFORMED CANADIANS VOTE CONSERVATIVE. GUESS IT'S EASIER NOT TO THINK FOR YOURSELF WHEN YOU AREN'T TOO SMART.'

    You ever notice the left always pats themselves on the back for how smart they are but whenever a debate happens they're the first to resort to personal insults and the 'I'm smarter' card. Well done. When someones has to say they're smarter, they're not.

    Harper led the longest minority government in Canadian history, yet he can't work with the opposition. Just keep believing the coalition propaganda oh smart ones. It hard to believe such 'smart' people can't see through the red herrings.
  154. Slightly Optimistic from the West Coast, Canada writes: This is not unbiased reporting. it's a Conservative attack by the G&M.; If you really think about it, it's not really relevant. And of course, everyone knows that no politician ever tells the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Everyone's out for personal power and gain. That's what's really at the heart of all this. The opposition leaders should back off and work with the Conservative government to run the country properly. Technically, that's what the current MPs were elected to do, nothing more. So, shut up and get back to work.
  155. Silent Majority from Canada writes: This Country is screwed and is well on it's way to a slow and painful death.
  156. khadija uddin from Toronto, Canada writes: Thanks for your excellent coverage, no other outlet has aired this highly relevant story. This is great investigative work!

    Harper is trying to pit English canada against french canada just to hold on to power. However, we are all Canadians! We all want Canada to prosper! And we are strong united and weak divided.

    Let's unite and kick this divisive man out!
  157. Dan Shortt from Toronto, Canada writes: And what does this have to do with what is going on right now?
  158. Sober Second Thought from Toronto, Canada writes: M P from Toronto - Sour grapes???

    This is clearly news relevant to the tripe the Prime Monster wants to shove down our throats tonight.
  159. L P from Canada writes: To David Anderson from Canada, who writes: 'Some comic relief from Mark Steyn'

    The only relief Mark Steyn ever gave Canada is when he left it.
  160. Al Bore from OTTAWA, Canada writes:

    Doesn't change anything. Waste of ink actually.

    Canadians rejected Dion and the Liberals.

    Please go away.

    May I suggest France.

    Your mother country.
  161. Just another Canadian from Calgary, Canada writes: The liars are at it again inquestion period. The documents prove that these same people (remember Harper was a Alliance/Reform member) tried to make a deal with Separatists. This government could very well kill this Country once and for all. Email the PM at pm@pm.gc.ca and tell him you won't stand for it.
  162. The Rational Thinker from Ottawa, Canada writes: More evidence that the Alliance (I mean Conservatives as long as old Alliance politicians are in charge) will say and do anything to be in charge.

    The coalition is a valid alternative to the current power-hungry Conservatives now in power.

    Ditch Harper and bring in a new, moderate leader. Do that and maybe Ontario and Quebec can vote for you.
  163. sell.sell,sell,sell sell,sell from Canada writes: yes we trust what the block say
  164. Bad Bob from Montreal, Canada writes: Brandan Matchett from halifax, Canada writes: Further backroom deals.

    Harper addresses the nation. 'we have managed to find 10 MP's 8 libs and 2 ndp mp's who have decided in the best interest of canada to cross the floor and become conservatives.'

    More propaganda from Harper and company.
  165. Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: Jason Roy from Central Nova - 'After October 14th AKA STILL Peter MacKay Country, Canada writes: I wonder if the dumb@sses here trying to tie Harper into this even realise Harper was not even an MP in 2000? '

    Yeah, thanks for the reminder Jason. Harper was a lobbiest for the NCC in 2000. Hmmm, let me think. What was he lobbying for? Remind me. All I remember is the stuff he spewed about Canada being a Northern European Welfare State, and what he called the propaganda about bilingualism, and the unemployed who enjoyed being unemployed. The usual Harper type stuff which brings Canadians together....
  166. J-Me Mennie from GTA, Canada writes: I think this whole coalition thing does note quite measure up. Sure the other parties have the right to defeat the government and yes they have the right to form a coalition that makes up a greater number of seats then the current sitting government.
    The Bloc has agreed to support a Liberal / NDP government but they would not be part of the actual governing body (to do so would betray their seperatist following if they became the government of Canada). So the government would only be made up of the Liberals and NDP which together does not make up a greater percentage of house then the conservatives currently hold. The Bloc can support the defeat of the government but unless they join the other parties to become the government I don't see how they could avoid it going to another election.
  167. w b from Canada writes: Hello....
    The lawyer acted alone...? That is too funny....Hey maybe Harper copied that letter he sent the G.G back when he wanted to take power from Martin and form a coalition.

    People need to think....Alliance party is not gone it just changed...to Reform...that did not work so they changed went to Conservative...blah blah...same people when you look at it..and same ideas.

    Stockwell Day was going to Try...(cause it was just a lawyer on his own...lol)

    Harper wrote a letter to try....FAILED

    Layton and Dion (liberals) are doing....

    The Conservatives are just pissed Harper screwed his party..and put us in this mess...period.
    MIght as well have a Government that represents the majority of the population than having Harper's 30ish percent.....

    Take care:
  168. Tom H. from Vancouver, Canada writes: It's funny how some people like to be selective with History. It's OK to point out historic flaws against those they don't like.

    BUT NO~~~~! If you do it to my favorite party, you are 'BIAS'.

    Sigh...
  169. West Coast from Canada writes: And all this started because the three loser parties were afraid that they would not get party funding from the government anymore? Wow. They must REALLY need their welfare cheques!
  170. George Clarke from Maple Ridge, BC, Canada writes: I doubt the Globe or any other central Canadian newspaper has ever been in sympathy with the Conservatives, so I take with a grain of salt anything that they dredge up from the distant past in their attempts to discredit Prime Minister Harper. Neither the Liberals, NDP, nor the so-called 'national' media will countenance any national leader who comes from the West. God forbid the status quo be threatened by a Westerner! Well, we in the West are fed up with the status quo. If indeed this coalition is allowed to come to fruition, watch and listen for the ever-increasing outcries from those of us who dare to live west of Ontario. We will be taken for granted no longer. The West wants either its fair share, or it wants out.
  171. A Guy from Ontario, Canada writes:

    With every word Harper is helping the separatists.

    For the good of the country he has to go bye bye.
  172. Bob Bobins from Calgary, Canada writes: Bad Bob.. _______________________________________________________ 'September 9, 2004 Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson, C.C., C.M.M., C.O.M., C.D. Governor General Rideau Hall 1 Sussex Drive Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0A1 Excellency, As leaders of the opposition parties, we are well aware that, given the Liberal minority government, you could be asked by the Prime Minister to dissolve the 38th Parliament at any time should the House of Commons fail to support some part of the government's program. We respectfully point out that the opposition parties, who together constitute a majority in the House, have been in close consultation. We believe that, should a request for dissolution arise this should give you cause, as constitutional practice has determined, to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your constitutional authority. Your attention to this matter is appreciated. Sincerely, Hon. Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P. Leader of the Opposition Leader of the Conservative Party of Canada' (Also signed by Duceppe and Layton) _______________________________________________________ This is a copy of the document the BQ presented in question period on Monday or Tuesday.. It was an agreement they had. If you were watching question period you would have seen the document the BQ presented.
  173. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: jim smitH: 'When someones has to say they're smarter, they're not.'

    'WHEN SOMEONES'??? THANK YOU, JIM. I REST MY CASE.
  174. Hockey Guy from Canada writes: The Sh!t has hit the fan...
  175. Brian C from Canada writes:
    Geez G&M;, will you ever give up supporting your thieving Liberal Party of Toronto?
  176. Slightly Optimistic from the West Coast, Canada writes: Hey, Nerdy Girl from Ottawa, why do you assume that 'the average hardworking Canadian' is 'political ignorant'?

    And what Canadian 'values' are the opposition MPs actually protecting?

    Sorry, but your post is absolute nonsense.
  177. Down east from Eastport, United States writes: The letter in question brings to light that a major player in the current conservative government was willing to negotiate with the bloc if the liberals didn't win a majority. By winning a majority the letter forming the coalition between the alliance, conservatives, and bloc became moot. That the letter would have been signed if a minority liberal government had been elected can only be conjectured. However, it's existence, and the current campaign to paint anyone who thinks about an alliance with the bloc as a traitor, highlights once again the shear hypocrisy, arrogance, and hubris of the current government and it's small minded leader.

    For all those berating the G&M; for printing this article, and smelling some left wing plot, didn't they endorse Harper?
  178. Al Bore from OTTAWA, Canada writes:
    That's nice.

    Here are some other things that happened in the year 2000 that have nothing to do with today...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000
  179. Beer and Popcorn from Toronto, Canada writes: The Globe - reaching back NINE YEARS to try to propel the coalition into power
  180. Life Insurance Bribe from Canada writes: Ahhh, I see the usual Con rebuttals: 'So what if we did it too!?? The Opposition is trying to do it, so it's wrong!!' and 'Do as we say, not as we do!!!'

    Best option is for the Con supporters to contact their party & MP's & insist on Harper being dumped & replaced by a less crazy & vindictive Con.
  181. K J from Toronto, Canada writes: Didn't the Globe and Mail endorse Harper both of the last 2 elections?!
  182. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: The reality is that we are both right: Harper doesn't have the confidence of Parliament AND there is no viable, truly representative government in waiting; it's a bit of dog's breakfast and people are starting catch on. So now what?
  183. George Nikitin from Hamilton, Canada writes: So Harper isn't just a fascist, he's a hippocrite too. Neocons are getting easier to hate all the time.
  184. Jeff M from Canada writes: Tiu Leek wrote: 'What else is in the closet?

    John Baird, but that's another story. ;) '

    LMAO!! But throwing up in my mouth a little at the same time! ;-)
  185. Cur Mudgeon from Bahamas writes:

    David Anderson from Canada writes: Some comic relief from Mark Steyn:

    Name of new coalition party:

    New Libs on the Bloc

    Or rather, necon heads on the block.

    .
  186. P Martin from St. John's, Canada writes: Harper has lost the confidence of Canadians, if he ever really had it. The sooner this coalition starts the better. As for any secret coalition talks in the past, this should not come as a surprise. The last one that I remember is when Harper wrote a document about it a few years ago. Wait a second, that was not a secret. Harper is a hypocrite. That he is attacking like an attack dog is nothing new. I just can not wait until he is gone.
  187. Harpo was a Knob in High School and he is still a Knob from Ordinary, Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: Woulda, coulda, shoulda...DIDN'T!

    Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?

    And what is the purpose of having a contingency plan in place????
    DUH.. In case you get the chance to act upon it..

    Every intelligent educated Canadian knows Harper is a Liar..
    I find it amuzing that the G&M; would run this story when in 2004 Harper did the same thing!!!!
  188. Brandan Matchett from halifax, Canada writes: Bad Bob from Montreal

    Let's wait and see Bob. It would take real leadership to keep this coalition together long enough to take power.

    Libs just don't have it. Just which MP's will be the weakest links...

    Stay tuned....
  189. Just A Guy from Canada writes: The key differences are huge.

    1. This party is no longer around
    2. NO COALITION WAS FORMED

    In other news.....Dion is looking awfully unhinged. To think the MSM had the nerve to call Harper 'angry' in the past. Dion is looking psychotic. The dude is drunk on his lust for power.
  190. Barry Turner from Ottawa, Canada writes: If the GG dumps Harper and appoints the coalition, how long do you think it will be before Harper is trying to do a deal with the Bloc? 'Hello Gilles, your old pal Steve here. What can I give Quebec today to get your support?' How long? Can you count in nanoseconds?
  191. Bob Bobins from Calgary, Canada writes: George Clark.. the status quo is consequtive minority conservative governments that attempt to rule as a majority. So in that sense I'm sure the majority is tired of the status quo as well.. I suggest you convince the conservative party to seperate from Canada.. that would surely do in the conservative party forever.
  192. Rabidsenses > from Good gawd, a latte-swilling Westerner, Canada writes:

    Dear Stephen Harper and tabled Coalition:

    Prime Minister Stephen Harper: Please step aside for the sake of the country.

    Mssrs. Dion, Layton, Duceppe: Accept his resignation with grace and understanding, then dissolve proposed coalition idea; thank you for having backbone this time

    CPC can go on governing with Jim Prentice.
    Next election, 2010.

    Oh, and would the GLOAT & MAELSTROM please stop digging up any more dirt. Issue a responsible editorial instead.

    Thank you.

    - a concerned Canadian, any party loyalties willfully subdued
  193. Dave AAA from Canada writes: Frankly, I don't really care anymore who is leading the country. All I ask is that they respect my tax dollars by spending them in way that they honestly believe is in the best interest of the country and for no other purpose. It doesn't even matter if I agree with their idealogy, but I insist they must be sincere in their efforts. I'm I asking too much?
  194. Brian C from Canada writes:
    Zoe Morrow writes: 'YES, EVER NOTICE THAT THE POOREST EDUCATED AND MOST ILL-INFORMED CANADIANS VOTE CONSERVATIVE. GUESS IT'S EASIER NOT TO THINK FOR YOURSELF WHEN YOU AREN'T TOO SMART. '

    So, Zoe, everyone who thinks differently than you are poorly educated and ill-informed?

    That speaks volumes more about you than it does about Conservative supporters.
  195. West Coast from Canada writes: L P from Canada writes: To David Anderson from Canada, who writes: 'Some comic relief from Mark Steyn'

    The only relief Mark Steyn ever gave Canada is when he left it.

    -----------------------

    Another example of the tolerance of the Left! You guys are a parody of yourselves. Tolerance! Diplomacy! Friggin' neo-cons! ROTFLMAO
  196. Isaw Thelight from Ontario, Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: Woulda, coulda, shoulda...DIDN'T!

    Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?

    ...LOL...what CON BORG spin....

    Harper must go before he destroys Canada...
    get rid of him
  197. Greg Van Zandt from Canada writes: In an interview, Mr. Chipeur played down the importance of the offer, saying he never discussed the matter with Mr. Day or other MPs, and was simply getting ready in the event of a minority government.

    So the point is? The Liberal freindly media is streching a bit on this one.
  198. Harpo was a Knob in High School and he is still a Knob from Ordinary, Canada writes: Silent Majority from Canada writes: This Country is screwed and is well on it's way to a slow and painful death.

    The country is not screwed.. |It will survive... If anything our country will be more democratic with the coalition then with Harper

    How can you justify a democratic leader whos major concern is to destroy any opposition to his idiotology
  199. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: We will have [in a coalition] a mechanism of permanent consultation empowering the Bloc Québécois on every question of importance, notably concerning the adoption of the budget. This Prime Minister, this government, this party has never and will never sign a document like that,” Mr. Harper said.

    OMIGOD! NOT PERMANENT CONSULTATION! The Liberals/NDP have agreed to TALK to the BLOC. Oh noes!!! :)

    Keep it up, Stevie. Just keep talking.
  200. Bad Bob from Montreal, Canada writes: Bob Bobins from Calgary - I am with you, not against you. What is needed though is for the signed document to be made public not just seen on Question Period. The public needs to know this.
  201. Life Insurance Bribe from Canada writes: This 2000 document is even 'worse', in that it was prepared in advance of an election that hadn't occurred yet; the result (a majority Lib gov't, as it turned out) wasn't even known & already the NeoCons were eager to prepare an 'evil' coalition.
  202. Gaetan Pelletier from Parksville BC, Canada writes: What plot?? Let's remember that after Mr. Manning stepped down for health reasons, that the members of the Alliance party walked across the floor to the Conservative side. I remember backing the Alliance and casting my vote as such. I felt betrayed since I did not vote Conservative, that my vote became just that. Since that happened, my hope is that someday we will form a new party representing all Canadians, not just a 'specific' group like the Bloc is doing at this moment.
    signed by a PROUD CANADIAN and NOT A SEPARATIST
  203. CharmedOnes deVille from Unprecedented hypocrisy, Canada writes:
    Way to go Globe !

    Is it karma, or just a lack of common sense ?

    You see, when you spit on EVERYONE, eventually someone will return the favour !
  204. Ian m from New York (via Vancouver), United States writes: This is beautiful - the absolute moral vacuum that is the Harper Alliance party laid bare.
  205. B W from Canada writes: The common denominator here is the Bloc. Tread carefully with folks goaled with fragmenting the country.

    But what do we do now that this talk has gone on for so long? If the coalition backs down, will the Conservatives govern cooperatively, or will they continue to force legislation under threat of another election we can't afford?

    all of this has been extremely selfish and politics oriented, rather than Canada oriented. A Conservative budget aimed not at bettering Canada, but at dismantling their opposition. A Liberal proposal to put them back in power, when Canadians clearly didn't favour them. The NDP supporting the Liberals, knowing that most the backlash would fall on the Liberals and ultimately the NDP will benefit. The Bloc supporting the coalition knowing that it will outrage the West, perhaps leading to more solid separation talks out that way, which will in turn help their cause for an independent Quebec. NO BODY seems to have put Canada first! It's political gains they're all after. At least the Bloc is honest about its ultimate goals.

    sigh
  206. Marty York from Canada writes: A lawyer who never approached the party leaders, came up with a proposal, which most likely would have been rejected. So how does the big headlines get justified, and then in small print saying it was never presented?
  207. BERNARD EASTMAN from TORONTO, Canada writes: TO USE THE FAMOUS DIPLOMATIC LANGUAGE OF THE LATE WINSTON CHURCHILL, IT SEEMS THAT MR. CHIPEUR HAS GIVEN US A 'TERMINOLOGICAL INEXACTITUDE'.
  208. Tour de France from Canada writes: Harper's attacks on the coalition are just ridiculous. How can anyone not be cynical about the Conservative government?
  209. Joe Dick from Kingston, Canada writes: What on Gods green earth could this possible have ANYTHING to do with what is happening today?
  210. Dragline 62 from GTA, Canada writes: Brian Van Ezel from Ottawa, Canada writes: Harper lied....that's a shock.
    =================================================
    Dion said during the election campaign that he wouldn't consider a coalition. And now it turns out that 2 of the 4 wise men he was touting as going to for advice want no part of it. He won't tell the nation what Gilles Duceppes price for support is either.
    Are you shocked about any of that?
  211. joseph Cheng from Toronto, Canada writes: Wow! Stock was not the simpleton and non-conniving character that he appeared to be. Politicians are politicians and they would do anything to achieve power and personal glory. Should anyone be surprised that politicians are the least respected among all professions?
  212. B. Smith from Canada writes: I'm not even clear what the Conservatives stand for right now, beyond not intervening in the economy and holding onto power. All I hear is hypocrisy. The most common Conservative argument I'm hearing right now is that we must respect the rights of the voters by throwing out the results of the election before the PM ever faces Parliament and asks for it's confidence. No do-over means no democracy. Parliamentary decisions only count if Conservatives agree.

    The current situation is unprecedented for good reason. Every other Prime Minister we've ever had acceded to the will of the House and resigned when it was obvious he'd lost their confidence, with or without a formal vote. It is the only honourable course of action for a defeated leader and I cannot believe Mr. Harper will not take it. I still hope he will.

    It is shameful that one man's pride should drag the nation to this.
  213. Super Farmer from Canada writes: This journalism? God help us all. G&M;, get real!
  214. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Brian Van Ezel from Ottawa, Canada writes: 'Harper lied....that's a shock.'

    LOL...of course because after all Harper was such a key member of the CA caucus in 2000.

    Oh wait he wasn't even elected in Parliament when this happened.

    You hacks are pathetic.
  215. The State Failure Project from Canada writes: I don't consider questions about the bloc to be fear mongering. If you are really serious about making democracy work why not bring them fully into the coalition which would give the coalition an absolute majority?

    No one seems to know if it would be constitutional to have a separatist party rule over a country that they want to leave.

    So we end up with a compromise and a deal that reflects a real problem that no one wants to talk about.
  216. Adam Whitman from Montreal, Canada writes: To the author of this article:

    Sir, this is most shameful way yet, you and your newspaper organization, have tried to discredit the Conservative Party of Canada.

    According to your article, you have clearly implied that there is nothing to suggest that any Alliance MP at the time (including its leader Mr. Day), had the slightest degree of knowledge about this 'coalition plot' with the BLOC. So why do you use a headline title that suggests a plot concocted between the Alliance and the BLOC?
    It clearly shows that you are trying to misinform the public.

    Furthermore, anyone can come up with a bogus plan on a single sheet of paper to form a coalition. I myself can pretend to the rest of Canadians, that I came up with a plan to bring the Conservatives and the Liberals into a grand coalition. I can even try to make it realistic by proposing it to both Mr. Harper and Mr. Dion. Would you then publish my plan too, in your next article?

    This is clearly a blatant case of mediatic manipulation on your part. If you have the slightest degree of integrity, you would at least alter the wording of your title and avoid disseminating lies and defamation.

    Sincerely,
    Adam Whitman
  217. Marty York from Canada writes: Harper to blame, when Day or none of the other leaders even saw this document, which is not on any letterhead? What else can the socialists manufacture, a new printing of Mein Kempf?
  218. Ray Campagna from Canada writes: What a shame!

    Pinocchio Harper ignores his own party's history ?

    Does he know something else than me, myself and I ?

    The only solution fortthis crisis is the resignation of Harper as leader of his party. Immediately.
  219. bobo from monkeyhowl.com from gloriana, Canada writes: personally, i use the atmosphere as my shark repellent. they seem not to like it. heaven help us if they did.
  220. Marty York from Canada writes: The comments made by the coalition supporters on here shows just how much they are lacking in intelligence, which is what the globe is hoping for. Just stick a big headline out there tying everyone in to the plot, which had nothing to do with Harper or Day, or the Bloc for that matter, because the document never got submitted to the leaders. Don't let intelligence and a little lack of ability to read the whole story to get in your way.
  221. Dar Hartley from North Vancouver, Canada writes: The arrangement considered at that time did not come to pass. A deal as proposed by this unholy alliance at this time should be rejected by all who care for this country.
  222. Scott McGinn from Canada writes: Wow. I have always respected Joe Clark and never thought he'd received quite the respect he deserved. I voted for him in 1979. If a deal with the Bloc was OK with him in 2000, then a deal with the Bloc is OK with me in 2008.
  223. Chris Edwards from Canada writes: 'The enemy of my enemy is my friend' philosophy never pays anything but short term dividends, and is always more expensive in the end. Both sides have played this game. Harper and his supporters are holding to a tenuous argument, while Dion et al are holding to a desperate dream.

    Duceppe, as always, wins.
  224. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Marty York from Canada writes: 'A lawyer who never approached the party leaders, came up with a proposal, which most likely would have been rejected. So how does the big headlines get justified, and then in small print saying it was never presented?'

    It's simple...

    After the coalition looked like a bunch of monkeys yesterday with Gilles proclaiming the coalition is good for Quebec sovereignty while Dion and Layton looked dumbfounded when asked to respond to those comments the 'coalition' is desperate and will put forward anything to bolster their position.

    Expect the 'coalition' to dig up anything they can find where the CPC might have worked with the Bloc.

    Anytime the two parties voted together will be brought up.

    If Harper or a CPC MP ever passed a roll of toilet paper under the stall to a Bloc MP taking a dump they'll bring it up.

    They're desperate because they know the vast majority of Canadians don't support what they are doing.
  225. The State Failure Project from Canada writes: so is cutting deals with the bloc good or bad? its bad if the conservatives do it but good if the coaltiin does it? have I got that right? or is it the other way around?

    maybe when the G and M can decide what exactly it is they are trying to communicate here they should hold off making judgements

    seems to me any deal in which the leaders have decided to leave a party out of a coalition because its risky is bad for democracy

    isn't that what the liberals have done?
  226. Andre Binette from Montreal, Canada writes: Former Governor-general Ed Schreyer said today on television that prorogation is not as easy as expected for a prime minister to get in any circumstances. He says the first question to ask Harper would be : ''Why?'' If it's to avoid a confidence vote, that's not a good answer because the government is responsible before Parliament. It's not a slam-dunk.

    Harper seems to think the problem he created will just go away. As they say in the U.S. Army manual, hope is not a plan. Unless the plan is to buy off Liberal members with Cabinet seats, Senate positions or other juicy appointments. Who knows?
  227. Upper Canadian born and raised in Western Canada from Canada writes: You know I said it last night in a thread that got deleted, and I'll say it again,

    'Everybody LOVED Trudeau and yet he was a meglomaniac'...

    I would say quite clearly these types of articles are those which are trying to fracture the power base of the Conservative Party..... and is it really effective?

    I don't believe so. =)
  228. David Bakody from Dartmouth, Canada writes: In an electoral system where first past post wins.... it is all about votes so it should not appear strange any party could and should be able to find ways to collect votes within the the rules of game... For Harper to say this different........Hello?
  229. K Tomislav from Chelm, Canada writes: So finally everyone is finally in agreement?!

    Sauce for the Reform Goose is sauce for the Liberal Gander!

    Coalitions are democratic and proper! Denying this coalition and proroguing parliament would be unprecedented expansion of PRIME-MINISTER'S powers. The Governor General is beholden to parliament not to the prime minister.
  230. cam b from Canada writes: This is getting ridiculous. Harper is acting like he is fighting a war with the propaganda that they are spewing out, and yet it is all lies or hypocrisy. When did the constitution become open for change at a whim by a Prime Minister?

    By the way Conservatives who are defending this deal because it didn't go through, you should read the part of the article that says the deal was disbanded because the Liberals won a clear Majority. Why would they form a coalition that would have no power anyways, and would probably disband by the next election?
  231. Jesse Winger from Calgary Questions Harper, Canada writes: We know for a fact that the Cons were fully prepared to dance with the Separatists in 2000 - it's undeniable.
  232. Kevin Desmoulin from Toronto, Canada writes: I wonder if Harper has the guts to take any unscripted questions tonight? lol
    Secret Conservative deal just one of many many lol with this one with those Quebec Devils, you know the one that want the destruction of Canada.
  233. Peter Turner from Hamilton, Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: Wow some people are really missing the point.

    It didn't happen!

    The key to good judgment is knowing when something is a bad idea.

    Clearly after studying the consequences it was determined that any coalition with the Bloc was a bad idea, therefore it was never acted upon.

    Are we really going to dig up every aborted idea, caucus brainstorming session and scotch-fueled strategy talk that anyone has ever contemplated?

    The plan was never enacted because it was found to be a BAD IDEA.
    -----------------------------------------------

    No Spenser C. It didn't happen because the Liberals won a majority.

    And -- for all others who claim that it was hatched by a now defunct party. That may be true -- but Stockwell Day is not defunct -- he, the one who insists now that even the concept is 'unprecedented', is still very active and probably still wondering which way Niagara Falls flows.
  234. Marty York from Canada writes: I have just contacted the media department of the Conservative party to make them aware of this misleading headline. What next, if we all come up with a proposal, and if we are party members, we can say we planned a coup as well, but never presented it to the leaders? Would that make headlines? Is the globe going to report that canadian soldiers will be posted in our cities next?
  235. Rob Ruttan from Barrie, Canada writes: In the last House, Harper pushed Parliament to the brink repeatedly. He turned legislation that wouldn't normally be considered as confidence motions into confidence motions. Perhaps he played brinkmanship too often and is now getting what he dared the Opposition to give him -- a resounding NO. Should it be pointed out, by the way, that many of those motions passed only because he had the support of the BQ, something he now decries? In other words, you can't act like a thug and not eventually get coshed.
    Secondly, Con supporters whinging about how the G&M; has a bias against their side might recall which party the G&M; endorsed a few weeks ago.
    In 2004/5 (?) as this article points out, Harper was clearly open to the idea of taking power in a coalition...which would have required support from the BQ. Now, he says that it's UnCanadian and Undemocratic. What swill.
    Last night, I heard the Minister for Intergovernmental Affairs on CBC radio claim that Harper 'predicted' the recession a year ago and had already taken steps to protect Canadians from it. Good grief! They have been beaten (possibly!) at their own game and will say anything to retain power. This is what is called grasping at straws, isn't it?
  236. Joe Dick from Kingston, Canada writes: After reading these comments it pleases me to know that only the sheeple are picking up on this.
  237. No Coalition from Canada writes: zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzz
  238. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Kevin Desmoulin from Toronto, Canada writes: 'I wonder if Harper has the guts to take any unscripted questions tonight? lol'

    NO, IT'S PRE-RECORDED. IT'S NOT LIVE AT ALL. HE WILL JUST SAY HIS PIECE AND EXPECT CANADIANS TO BUY EVERY WORD OF IT. THEY COULDN'T AFFORD TO HAVE HIM GO ON UNSCRIPTED OR LIVE.
  239. The Bull from Canada writes: um, is it just me, or is it a bit disengenuous to say the 'alliance had a secret deal with the bloc'?

    i must be on crack, but i'm sure that's what the article is implying,

    and yet.......

    there was no such 'deal'.

    bias, anyone?

    either way, the Liberals and NDP don't have enough seats together to match the Conservatives, so GG won't let them form a govt.

    period.
  240. Gaetan Pelletier from Parksville BC, Canada writes: Since ALL MP's should represent ALL Canadians, I feel that the Bloc have boxed themselves in by only choosing to represent Quebec constituents. Therefore, the Liberal and the NDP are the only opposition representing the whole country and they do not have a majority between them. Hence the Harper government has and should take their mandate and rule for the next four years until another election is called. Then it's a free for all.
  241. so, what from and beyond, Canada writes: I have a box of tissue for the right wing and tory supporters who are trying so hard to make a valid point. Stop crying about how harper will lose power and try to understand why.

    If Paul Martin had fought this hard to keep himself in power, you all would be going insane. BOOHOO....losers.
  242. Sometimes left Sometimes right from Canada for CANADIANS, Canada writes: The common factor in coalition discussions that disgust the people of CANADA? The bloc. They are a cancer to this country, the sean avery of our HOC. The people of our country have to be willing to give and take. The vast majority of Quebec is only willing to take and not interested in voting for a Federalist party. 259 regions in this country believe in Federalism and elected an MP that reflects Federalist values. Hopefully we can all agree on that. Of these 259 regions, 143 seats, or 55% elected conservatives to represent their region. In other words, a majority of FEDERALIST regions support the conservatives. The people who believe in Canada and want what is best for the country, support the Conservatives.

    I am not a con hack or a blind partisan supporter. My vote changes based on who I feel is the best fit. The cons are the best fit at this time, but MUST actually work with the other parties. The Libs need a strong leader to bring them back towards the center and offer a viable alternative to the cons.

    Let the people who BELIEVE in CANADA, decided who runs CANADA.
  243. A Canadian from Cole Harbour, Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Kevin Desmoulin from Toronto, Canada writes: 'I wonder if Harper has the guts to take any unscripted questions tonight? lol'

    NO, IT'S PRE-RECORDED. IT'S NOT LIVE AT ALL. HE WILL JUST SAY HIS PIECE AND EXPECT CANADIANS TO BUY EVERY WORD OF IT. THEY COULDN'T AFFORD TO HAVE HIM GO ON UNSCRIPTED OR LIVE.

    --

    That Ok Zoe because Dion will also be on TV and no doubt, you will buy every word he says.
  244. Marty York from Canada writes: It's like a lawyer saying something in front of the jury, then told to retract it by the judge. Just what this leblanc author is trying. He knows the vast majority of left wingers in this country are uneducated and don't read more than the headlines and are counting on this to stick in what little minds they have in order to paint the tories with the same brush.
  245. so, what from and beyond, Canada writes: Marty York from Canada writes: I have just contacted the media department of the Conservative party to make them aware of this misleading headline.
    ___________
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....and they probably laughed at you when you hung up.
  246. Herbalizer man from toronto, Canada writes: if you neocons keep bringing up the Adscan which was under a different leader of the liberal party, then it is only fair that we look at the actions of those currently in power while under other leaders. the fact that it was a few years ago is irrelevant! the Aliance (which formed the majority of those that are in the PC party now) tried to form an aliance with the PQ. Again it is the intention, not whether it occured. It shows that when it was convient for them, they had no issues dealing with the 'Devil'. what surprises me the most is how many of those posting here forgot about this.... it was only a few years ago and it cause a stir. cons have a very short memory.... also, please stop calling the media biased... it is rather childish.
  247. Marty York from Canada writes: Actually no, so, what from beyond, they took this slanderous headline seriously and have forwarded it to their media department. Unlike you, they actually read the entire article and find it misleading, and have a higher i.q. than you.
  248. larry hallatt from Canada writes: What a crock, next some newspaper will say Stalin had a deal with Hitler to divide up will say Poland and because Stalin was left leaning like our local Jack that this has something to do with our situation. Whats the problem people don't you have enough fun with Britney and Michael Jackson!!! Are we starting to convert our media into FOX 'NEWS'..... Fox and News are hard to say in the same breath. Lets not make over our papers to become Hollywood tabloids
  249. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: The Liberals would have totally gotten away with stealing the election but installing that idiot Dion was their fatal flaw. He has neither the confidence or, after this coup blows up in his face, the respect of canadians. Did George Bush steal the election from Al Gore? It was all perfectly legal now wasn't it? It was still wrong and despite my political leanings it's wrong when the left does it to. The mental gymnastics you have to perform to arrive at the position that the october election was an endorsment of a formal alliance between Dion and Layton propped up by the Bloc is mind boggling. In my day we had heated disagreements with conservatives but this new generation of the left seem to be nasty and visious lot indeed. The possibility of forming such a coalition was strongly denied by both Dion and Layton 6 weeks ago. I don't like Dion but I voted for him and he lost. The Canadian people must be given an opportunity to vote for this formal coalition as it is CRUCIAL information that we did not have 6 weeks ago. I am a Liberal who does not wish to be in a formal alliance with the Bloc but if that's what happens after a free and fair election, fair enough. Without one, Dion is making a mockery of my party, this country and those of you progressives who support this just because you have a hard on for Harper should be ashamed of yourselves. My God, if Dion had won the minority and Harper got away with what Dion and Layton are doing you bloody hypocrites wouldn't be spending 12 hours a day online quoting from Roberts Rules of Order you would be comparing Harper to Hitler. Anybody who supports what Dion is doing is a disgrace to the progresive movement.
  250. Khawaja Khawaja from Aweil, Sudan writes: I seem to recall Stockwell Day commenting on the possibility of aligning with the Bloc, and Jean Chretien referring to him as 'Blocwell Day', claiming the Liberals would never do such a thing. But that was then and this is now.
  251. snow lander from Edmonton, Canada writes: I don't believe that Mr.Chipeur acted alone. You don't just produce a document like this on the day of an election without consultation. They had prepared it before the vote count so that they could with the assistance of the SEPARATIST unseat what they were hoping would be a liberal minority government. So as usually the cons are a bunch of whiny hypocrites.
  252. Marty York from Canada writes: Herbalizer, how can it be a plot if the document was not even presented?
  253. Old blue from Canada writes: Back then the G&M;'s readership was much higher as well.
  254. Marty York from Canada writes: Ah, Sudan, the birthplace of democracy?
  255. Charles Theriault from Canada writes: On the basis of his behaviour this past week, I have a feeling the PM's address tonight is going to be a 'sad spectacle.'
  256. Lee Turner from Canada writes: For all the shoot the messenger types trying to slag the Globe and Mail, and accusing them of trying to sabotage Harper, I have two questions:

    Which candidate did the Globe and Mail endorse in the last election?

    Which candidate did the Globe and Mail endorse in the second last election?
  257. Cest Laguerre from Canada writes: I mean I know all politicians are prone to stretch the truth and conveniently 'forget to remember ' certain aspects which might be inconvenient but Steve Harper and the current crop of Torries are setting the bar to new lows by just out and out lying. I can only guess they got this tactic from the US NEOCONS which found that a lie told enough times by enough people will be accepted (weapons of mass destruction anyone?)
  258. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: I don't see how the coalition using the Bloc to win confidence votes is any different from Harper using the Bloc to win confidence votes.

    He has not been able to find common ground with the NDP, he is has waged a destructive campaign for years to destroy the Liberal Party, leaving him the Bloc as the party to work with.

    How is this different? Somebody explain this to me before you rant about the coalition working with the Bloc.
  259. Marty York from Canada writes: Lee Turner, who did Leblanc, the writer of this article support? Because he is french, I could paint him a separatist. After all, you don't have to be the author of the document or even see it to make a link apparently.
  260. Lars Weldrake from Canada writes: The key differences are huge.

    1. This party is no longer around
    2. NO COALITION WAS FORMED

    In other news.....Dion is looking awfully unhinged. To think the MSM had the nerve to call Harper 'angry' in the past. Dion is looking psychotic. The dude is drunk on his lust for power.
  261. Greg Smith from Canada, Canada writes: So two wrongs make a right???

    Why is the Globe and Mail insistant on helping to break up canada... anybody that wants to get in bed with the Bloc is playing with fire! I expect that Layton and Dion to get burned...

    This is a lose lose situation for Canada...if the coalition works, then the bloc wins, but western canada will threaten to leave...if the coalition doesnt work...then the Quebec seperatists will be in arms... its bad all away around.

    I hope that everybody takes a time out...and comes back with some common sense
  262. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: bob london - Can you tell everyone what you meant by 'Oops, you are upset socialist/seperatist journalists with a platform.'? Is it a simple matter of a seeming large proportion of Conservative zealots being uneducated? That's certainly what comes across as you read through the comments.
  263. bruno tomassini from Canada writes: Was it not Preston Manning dream to have an 'inclusive' Government? That is including the Bloc? Read his book!

    Cheers!
  264. G E from Ottawa, Canada writes: It is obvious to any objective observer that Mr. Harper has done and is doing more to harm our country than the Bloc. CPC apologists, give your head a shake. The behaviour exhibited by Mr. Harper, his caucus, and his backroom advisers is beyond partisan. It is reckless and absolutely contrary to the best interests of our country.
  265. John Doucette from Manotick, Canada writes: 'Alliance had earlier deal with the Bloc!'

    D---mmm, there goes the best point I wrote for Sean Avery, Sorry-for Stephen Harper's, speech to Canadians tonight. Its hard to tell the two apart, both have such good taste and manners.
  266. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Charles Theriault - If I may I'd like to amend that to 'A sad spectacle in a sweater.' ;-)
  267. Percy from NL from Canada writes: Man, is Harper making the Conservatives look stupid right now or what? This guy is losing it, and he doesn't mind that he is taking the Conservative party with him.

    Stephen Harper is about to become the first Prime Minister in the history of this country to cowardly shut down the House of Commons in order to avoid the people's representatives from carrying out their democratic rights. He also seems not to care that the economic uncertainty which goes along with this crisis he created is going to build over the next almost 2 months. What a sad man he is.
  268. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Lars Weldrake from Canada - And you're sounding desperate.
  269. Marty York from Canada writes: Greg Smith you are right. The west will not recognize this coalition, nor follow its rules, nor send taxes to it, nor let federal inspectors on the oilsands sites to measure for cap and trade emissions money grabs. Civil unrest will begin, which will add to the misery of the economy.
  270. larry price from Arnstein, Canada writes: Harper is to speak to the nation tonight. If he corrects the lies, and confesses his sins, he will need much more air time.
  271. Lorna Draper from The Rust Belt of Southern Ontario, Canada writes: Yellow journalism? More like a deep shade of chartreuse. Scraping the bottom of the barrel for a story like this that should be decomposing in the bottom of a landfill. God, what's next? Exposing that Sir John A. MacDonald drank? I don't know who looks more desperate-the leaders of this so-called coalition or the MSM who, IMHO, are fast turning in to tabloid hacks.
  272. Katie E from Canada writes: I love how all of the right wing conservative supporters seem to think there is a statute of limitation for judgements on political dealings. It is okay to drudge up Liberal party decisions/actions from the 90s but it is offensive when we judge the Alliance, err Conservative, party on back door politics from 2000! Maybe if Harper were less dramatic and didn't refer to the Bloc as the devil than it wouldn't be as amusingly hypocritical. I wasn't sure how I felt about the creation of a coalition but I sure am sick of Harper's sneaky right wing agenda and double speak. You would think the party would have done a little research before speaking so harshly of pairing up with the Bloc!
  273. Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Sometimes left wrote: 'Let the people who BELIEVE in CANADA, decided who runs CANADA. '

    DO YOU MEAN 'DECIDE'? IT'S HARD TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY HERE.

    CANADIANS HAVE ALREADY SPOKEN AND MOST OF THEM DID NOT VOTE FOR THE CONSERVATIVES. A COALITION IS A LEGAL AND LEGITIMATE OUTCOME TO THE OCTOBER ELECTION. THE CONSERVATIVE MINORITY GOVERNMENT IS DOING NOTHING TO AVERT ECONOMIC DISASTER AND WE NEED THIS COALITION TO WORK TOGETHER TO GET THINGS DONE FOR CANADIANS.

    THE CONSERVATIVES ARE NOT THE RIGHT FIT FOR CANADA. THEY HAVE DROPPED THE BALL HERE SO MANY TIMES. MOST CANADIANS DID NOT VOTE FOR THEM EVEN. WHY THEY THINK THEY HAVE A MANDATE TO LEAD FROM CANADIANS IS BEYOND COMPREHENSION.
  274. V ADS from Canada writes: Criticisms of the G&M;'s reporting bias have always struck me as coming from partisan sources (on all sides), but criticism about the prominence given this irrelevant non-story are valid.

    Plus, why did the G&M; run the 'Wise Men' feature story complete with photos, without checking the sources first? It turns out the Liberal 'wise men' (Manley and McKenna) weren't on board with the so-called 'Advisory' board to the LPC-NDP-BQ coalition at all.

    But the most questionable lapse of judgement was endorsing this ill-advised coalition so early, without details of the stimulus package, or even digging into the basic details of the framework agreement, such as what the deal entails in terms of concessions to the BQ, and what they mean for Canada. We had to wait for Pauline Marois and Jacques Parizeau to provide some clues on these critical aspects.

    Criticisms aside, G&M; provides a great service by opening up its comment section to the public, even if partisans abuse the process.
  275. Marty York from Canada writes: ARTICLE WAS NOT PRESENTED TO THE LEADERS, SO THEY WERE UNAWARE OF THE LAWYERS INTENTIONS. Big enough and slow enough writing for you government educated socialists?
  276. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Lorna Draper - Can you explain why you feel this story isn't relevant?
  277. Roman Spears from St. Catharines, Canada writes:

    You can just envision all of Stephen Harper's speech writers suddenly editing tonights whine and saying, 'Damn Globe and Mail! We almost got away with it too.'

    How long before the TV ads get changed as well?
  278. David White from Oakville, Canada writes: Wow, some people (Spencer C) are really obtuse. This issue is about one thing only... the importance of the opposition parties in a parliamentary system. PM Harper either does not get this or chooses to ignore it. It matters little what the Bloc stand for. Their members of parliament were elected just like the Conservatives, Liberals and NDP. They matter and their voices deserve to be heard. In a minority government, the opposition parties always represent the majority of Canadians. In order for a minority parliament to work atleast two parties have to co-operate. PM Harper had the first crack at this as he should have. His failure to embrace at least one of the three opposition parties has created this mess. The last Parliament survived only due to the Bloc's support of the Conservatives and the Liberals lack of leadership and opposition. Thank god they have finally shown up. No one likes a hypocrite. PM Harper cannot embrace the Bloc when it suits him (in opposition or when he is PM) and demonize them when they take him to task (as is their job). If you have a problem with the Bloc's presence in the house.. move to Quebec and work to defeat them. Otherwise, accept that they have a voice equal to any other federal MP and in a minority Parliament they have the power and right to work with the government or work to defeat them. For PM Harper to claim he would never sign a deal with the Bloc is correct... he much prefers to keep his deals hidden from public view and outside the bounds of our democracy (so much for his increased transparency). To say he would never make a deal with the Bloc is a lie and he knows it. To say that his party (present or past) would never make a deal with the Bloc is clearly false (proven twice). Stop slitting hairs.... and get back to governing.. which in a minority parliament means talking to and dealing with the opposition or standing aside so they can get to work.
  279. ila letap from Canada writes: Harper should step down ASAP...How can anyone trust this evil evil person
  280. larry price from Arnstein, Canada writes: 'Sam Barns from moncton, Canada writes: Harper and the NeoCons are lying, deceitful, contradictory, arrogant, abrasive, hypocritical, bigoted, and chauvenistic.'

    And besides that they are not very nice.
  281. Pam Bookham from North Vancouver, Canada writes: Harper has been too clever by half in trying to exploit every political advantage our parlimentary system presents. As for Stockwell Day's response to the letter presented in QP by Mr. Duceppe, it's called plausible deniability, if, in fact, his lawyer acted alone, which I highly doubt. What has become abundantly clear in QP this week, is that Harper and his chorus of trained seals will stop a nothing to cling to power--even fan the flames of Separatism, at this most critical time. True leaders bring people together. They do not play divide and conquer. The Liberal-New Democrat Coalition, with the support pledged by the BQ, will bring stability and resolve to to take the necessary measures to provide economic stimulus and relief for workers and their families. In a time when all Canadians must be prepared to make sacrifices, we need leaders who can cooperate for the greater good of all the people in Canada, regardless of the political party they support. Harper, disregarding his own legislation on fixed date elections and hoping to secure a majority, sent voters to the polls this fall. The voters have spoken. They chose their MPs and granted the Conservatives the opportunity to lead a minority government. It is very clear that Stephan Harper is incapable or unwilling to lead under these circumstances. The Financial Update made that undeniably clear. Give us leaders who have the skills and courage for the job. Give us leaders who will bring out the best in all Canadians, wherever they live, not pit region against region.
  282. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: 'A lawyer who was described then as being close to Day, says he didn't discuss the matter with the MPs '

    When asked to elaborate, the lawyer responded by saying 'Although I didn't talk directly to the MP's involved, I just knew instinctively that the Canadian Alliance would just JUMP at the chance to form an alliance with separatists'

    'I drew the paperwork up, though, just for the sheer fun of it. Billable hours, y'know. '

    'I've also got a marriage proposal I drew up for President Bush and Osama Bin Laden. Wanna see it?'

    ;)
  283. Kevin Desmoulin from TO, Canada writes: Just Think, Stock Boy as PM. lol a real mix of laughter and horror.
  284. Marty York from Canada writes: I always thought left wing supporters were brain dead, judging by their comments linking Harper to a lawyer article that didn't even make the light of day says it all.
  285. Al B from Canada writes: The fun never ends. What a great week.
  286. Jesse Winger from Calgary Questions Harper, Canada writes: Lorna Draper from The Rust Belt of Southern Ontario, Canada writes: 'Yellow journalism? More like a deep shade of chartreuse. Scraping the bottom of the barrel for a story like this that should be decomposing in the bottom of a landfill. God, what's next? Exposing that Sir John A. MacDonald drank? I don't know who looks more desperate-the leaders of this so-called coalition or the MSM who, IMHO, are fast turning in to tabloid hacks.'

    Curious that you, in the 'rust belt', an arew which the Cons continue to ignore, would post such a comment. The Coalition is willing to address your issues NOW, the Cons... sometime next year.

    The fact that the Cons were ready to jump in bed with the Bloc back in 2004 UNDER HARPER AND in 2000 UNDER STOCK DAY is a big news story that needs to be told!
  287. Clear Thinker from Canada writes: Stephen Harper is not Stockwell Day nor Joe Clark and the Conservative Party is not the Canadian Alliance nor the Progressive Conservative party. Good try but the analogy fails. Say no to Separatists, say No to this ill-fated 'Coalition'.
  288. t scot from Canada writes: Marty York...So you have informed the party Have you? Das is good Herr York.
  289. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: bob london from Canada:

    Hee, hee, hee! I can't believe that you believe this lawyer when he says that he acted alone. Is it conventional for a lawyer of all people to forward agreements to outside parties without the formal consultation of elements of your own group? A lawyer is not that dumb. If he is, then he's working out of a shoe box and has a second job flipping burgers to help pay the bills.
  290. B.C. Expat from Ottawa-Hull, NCR, Canada writes: Wow, mainstream political parties like to try to get into power. Next you're going to tell me that Somalia isn't a preferred vacation destination.

    Look, the problem here is that the coalition threatens to return power to the same old, same old Toronto-Montreal axis which has governed without the rest of the country since 1867. It's not treason, it's not a coup, but it's yet another slap in the face to those who know that Canada is more diverse than the part of the VIA rail route that gets used.

    Not everything in life is about Quebec and Yankee-bashing, but you wouldn't know that based on the political establishment in Canada.
  291. Percy from NL from Canada writes: You know, some Conservatives have to be admired for their ability to turn their morals and principles around on a dime (as in their response to this article). It's a pretty cool skill that Harper has taught them; laughable, but a cool.
  292. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Clear Thinker - Can you please explain what you mean by 'Say no to Separatists'? Do you mean all the zany pro-Harper Western Separatists that keep popping up on this board?
  293. Marty York from Canada writes: A lawyer proposed a settlement for a car accident I was involved in. It was rejected.
    Get the point?
  294. Jackson Pollack from Canada writes: This is as old as adscam - forget them both.
  295. Michael Longfield from Toronto, Canada writes: L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: How is this different? Somebody explain this to me before you rant about the coalition working with the Bloc.

    I second the challenge.

    Harper's only hope is to convince the GG that this 'separatist coalition' somehow represents a constitutional crisis, and thus grant him an unprecedented prorogation despite the fact he's clearly lost the confidence of the House.
  296. Just In from Canada writes: The Alberta Harper Conservatives have only one defense:

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    Oh well.
  297. Canadian First from Hazelton, Canada writes: The bloc has always been there and will always be there. Steven Harper is there but will not always be there. Who is the smart and strong one?
  298. Rob Roy from Toronto, Canada writes: I have to tell you, this is getting a bit borring. Pino-Harper do you remember the Emerson Affair, do you remember your lack of respect for DEMOCRACY and the voters of the Vancouver riding which were robbed of their vote by you and Emerson. Please do everyone a favour hold the confidence vote and leave gracefully. The time for dictators are over.
  299. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: Think of it this way... if this lawyer took it upon himself to include the Bloc...
    A) Your credibility is down the toilet if the Bloc agrees to some sort of deal but then the Canadian Alliance and Conservatives turn around and say, 'deal, what deal?'
    B) Your judgement is questioned by your own group for going behind their backs and soliciting support from a 'hostile' parliamentary party.

    Credibility and Judgement: Good lawyers do a good job of protecting both of these. So why would he be putting both on the line for what some of you here would describe as a 'pet project.'
  300. Blair Ericson from Canada writes: If people want a minority government to prorogue Parliament and rule without the consent or consultation of the House then they would have voted for a majority government and not three straight minority governments.

    The CPC can make this all go away by doing three simple things:

    1. Force Harper to resign and send him to the backbench of obscurity

    2. Form a true coalition government with the Liberals and give the Liberals 40 percent of the Cabinet posts, including Health

    3. Rule by cooperation and coalition as the voters of Canada have demanded from their governments (but not ever received) in the last three consecutive elections.
  301. J M from Calgaristan, Canada writes: This is treason, pure and simple. Harper and Day should be tried and hung right in downtown Calgary.
  302. Steve I'm Not an Alberta Redneck from Calgary, Canada writes: Systemic Risk from Canada writes: 'It is interesting watching this whole thing because it is revealing about the support bases of the parties, which I interpret as follows:'

    You need some help:

    Conservatives: Oil Companies, Tax evading speculators, Rural Welfare Queens, Fundamentalist Slimeballs, Anyone Stupid or Fearful enough to fall for their advertising blitz.

    You're F**Ked - Everyone else in a CON riding
  303. G MACK from Canada writes: MARTHA K

    who's trying way to hard???? look in the mirror! you're a harper fan...we get it!

    he's a hypocrite with facts to prove it...they all are!

    move on.
  304. Harold Uhlman from Lunenburg, NS, writes: It seems to me this newspaper endorsed the CPC during both of the past two elections. That was OK but writing anything not making the CPC out to be cute and cosy is not. If it happened, it is news. Do I hear any denials that it happened? Shout as you will, in at least two cases the Alliance/Conservatives considered a marriage with the bloc putting something in writing. Intent does reveal much about people and politicians. Do you suppose Mr. Harper would refuse bloc support to get out this self-imposed crisis? I expect he would embrace this as a democratic move. Having said that, the coalition is a bad idea, economically and politically. This is not the time to have instability, better to live with the weakness of Mr. Flaherty. If a coalition government does happen , it is political suicide especially for the Liberals once the coalition falls. How could they attempt this plan before their leadership convention? They are gambling that an election won't happen while Mr. Dion is leader. Why would they want to take over as the country is about to go into Mr. Harper's, 'essential deficit', but would wear it. Why wouldn't they continue as opposition with a humiliated, weakened Harper government, being forced to backtrack and to pay heed to the opposition in a deficit time? There is simply too much that can go wrong for this coalition very quickly for Canada and the opposition parties in this agreement. The best choice - Mr. Harper steps down as PM and a more moderate replacement goes to the GG - Jim Prentice perhaps.
  305. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Blair Ericson - Hear hear.
  306. kevin o'connor from Toronto, Canada writes: Harper is obviously hypocritical on this but all politicians play these games. The real issue is the stimulus package. Bill Gates is on CNN today saying that a stimulus package is necessary. He was very matter of fact about it as if it's the most obvious thing in the world, which it is. I don't know if he has an economics degree as one poster suggested was needed to have an opinion on this (or more specifically an opinon different from the PMs)but I think he's a pretty smart guy who might be worth listening to. Our economy is integrated to a large degree with the USA (NAFTA) and also to the global economy. We are in a better fiscal postion federally due to good government on that file under Chretien and Martin (and due to sacrifices made by Canadians) but that is not enough to protect us from this terrible global recession. We need a massive stimulus package to keep our economy afloat, just as all other nations are planning. If we don't all our sacrifice for fiscal prudence in good times will amount to nothing now we are in bad times. Our economy will grind to a halt and we will lose far more than if we had had a major stimulus package at the start. All I care about is a government that understands the nature of the economic crisis and has a plan to deal with it. If harper can't see the need for a stimulus package he is unfit to govern because the only way one can come to that conclusion is ideology, not by any honest look at the economic facts. (Or total mind blowing incompetence, which is harder to believe, he has many flaws but the man does not seem stupid). He didn't win a majority and if he wants to brazenly force ideological nightmare policies like the recent economic statement on the nation he should get the boot and lets get some pragmatist leaders in there who will do what all other nations led by leaders left, right or center are doing: Offering a stimulus package to help mitigate the worst economic crisis in 70 years.
  307. Anthony B from Maritimes, Canada writes: Amusing to see the usual suspects have received their talking points on this one:

    'Alliance is a defunct party'

    'That was then, this is now'

    'It was only a contingency'

    Stay tuned, folks, this is not the only time the Reform/Alliance/Conservative Party has done (or tried to do) a deal with the Bloq in order to gain or hang onto power. Sad thing is, it's not the act itself that's abhorrent; it's the denial and the false outrage at other parties doing it.
  308. Sometimes left Sometimes right from Canada for CANADIANS, Canada writes: Zoe Morrow from Canada writes: Sometimes left wrote: 'Let the people who BELIEVE in CANADA, decided who runs CANADA. '

    DO YOU MEAN 'DECIDE'? IT'S HARD TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO SAY HERE.

    Zoe, if you have trouble understanding from a simple spelling mistake, then maybe stop trying to read and go back to simple picture books.

    Canadians did NOT vote for this coalition. It is legal, but it is morally unethical - a pure power grab. I don't pretend to think one party is good and the rest are bad. They are ALL guilty of hypocrisy. Dion needs to go. Harper needs to go. It is asinine to believe that all the people who voted for the NDP or Libs want this coalition. Let the people decided if they want a coalition.

    New leaders, new election. Stop the power grab, go to the people. It
  309. steve allan from Canada writes: Are you sick and tired of the lying Tories by now? If you aren't it's because you're one of them !

    If Harper wants an election then let's have one so we can clear the garbage out of Ottawa and get on with the nation's business.
  310. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: Marty York from Canada: Do you think the lawyer had the agreement of his client before he forwarded you the offer?

    This agreement was forwarded to multiple members of the Bloc. Something happened between point A and point B. Please think about that.
  311. De Roguer from DowntownCowtown, Canada writes: Pam Bookham from North Vancouver, Canada writes: Harper has been too clever by half in trying to exploit every political advantage our parlimentary system presents. ....

    ...Give us leaders who will bring out the best in all Canadians, wherever they live, not pit region against region.

    --------------

    Bravo Pam, I agree we need legitimate leaders who represent 63 percent of voters who were NOT fooled by Harper. We are people who have been bullied and who will not face this abuse any more.
    He is scary bad.
  312. Yvonne Wackernagel from Woodville, Canada writes: I find this so amazing. CTV and the Globe are, as far as I know, under the same umbrella. The Globe came out strongly in support of Stephen Harper just before the election but, whilst CTV has consistenly very strongly supported the Conservatives (and even Harper in these days of negativity over his record), the Globe has now reversed course and is calling for Harper to resign.

    Gee, if only the Globe had not supported Harper just before the last election, Harper might not have been re-elected. Just a possibility!
  313. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes:
    What's with all this Conservative shouting & hysteria
    Have they all been eating cold cuts at the Parliamentary cafeteria

    It's prudent and normal to seek out a coalition
    When a party finds itself in a minority position

    'patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel' tis said
    A proverb Mr.Harper and his party has clearly read

    With all their flag waving and comments inflamma-tory
    You'd think they've all taken a collective supposi-tory

  314. Tom Poleck from Mclure, Canada writes: All of the narcissistic party leaders in Ottawa should give their heads a shake and stop arguing about who has the confidence of the house. Not a single one of then has the 'confidence of the people'!

    1) Stephen Harper started out in parliament as the clear choice for PM but he was arrogant enough to put himself in the position he is in purely for the sake of partisan politics. His arguments against a coalition parliament are the definition of hypocritical double speak.
    2) Stephan Dion was clearly rejected by the Canadian public during the recent election. He is not supported by the Liberal party either.
    4) Jack Layton is in fourth place to begin with. His gain in votes during the election were mostly protest votes against Dion who he now wants to make PM.
    5) Elizabeth May is talking about a Senate seat. This is ludicrous until her party has won a seat in Parliament.
    6) Gilles Duceppe, enough said. The majority of Canadians to not want the balance of power in government to be held for ransom by the Bloc.

    The best solution would be a new election with new party leaders. The one clear theme that came from the last election is that the majority of Canadians DO NOT support any of the current candidates! This is why voter turnout was at an all time low. Also I do not believe that the majority of Canadians wish to follow the lead of our neighbors down south by pumping tens of billions of dollars into failing companies. We talk about not having another election because they are so expensive but the stimulus package the coalition is talking about would be in the neighborhood of 100x the cost of another election. Consider an election a 1% consultation fee to see if Canadians truly wish to give 30 billion to failing manufacturers in Southern Ontario and Quebec.
  315. Dave Campbell from Canada writes: Spencer C from Canada writes: Wow some people are really missing the point.

    It didn't happen!

    The key to good judgment is knowing when something is a bad idea.

    Spencer, you have an interesting way of interpreting things. The reason this wasn't signed at the time was because it was absolutely pointless. The liberals had a majority and thus any coalition at that time wouldn't have been able to take control.

    Listen, people are going on and on about how there's no precedent for this blah blah blah and you'd be right. But there's also no precident for a minority government to so blatantly try to force the opposition into submission. Harper had a plan b) after he didn't get his majority and it backfired. He tried to play games when he should have been trying to lead and unite the country.

    On top of that, the way he is vilifying the BQ is embarassing. Like them or not, they are a legitimate political party that still represent a substantial portion of Canadians. He's spreading fear and hatred like a fundamentalist.
  316. forty sum from Canada writes: Hear, Hear Blair Ericson
  317. Paul Mullen from Canada writes:
    This is BS... Two lawyers musing about stuff (even dumb stuff) happens all the time. There was never anything like a plan to sign a formal arrangement with the Bloc to grab and maintain power over the country.

    This headline will mislead a lot of people. Congrats to the Globe.
  318. Percy from NL from Canada writes: Words of some Conservatives ... we are law-abiding citizens who want to get tough with young offenders. Oh but to hell with the supreme laws of our land (our Constitution) and our parliamentary system. If they don't suit us, we do not have to obey them.

    What great examples they are to our youth.
  319. raymond Girard from toronto, Canada writes: Am I the only one who is far more afraid of Kitchen Table Jack's involvement in the 'coalition' than the Bloc's? That strident unreformed Trotskyite will do far more harm to our democratic institutions than smarmy yet ineffectual Duceppe could ever hope to.
  320. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Sometimes left Sometimes right - Jeez I wish people would stop saying 'Canadians did NOT vote for this coalition.' If you think about nobody EVER votes for a coalition because coalitions aren't elected. They are sometimes formed when the government doesn't do its job. Harper had a chance and blew it. Nobody wants another $300 million time consuming election because we need a government to start running the country. Harper has made this mess because he is a greedy bully.
  321. Michael Robertson from Carstairs, Canada writes: While were at this why don't we accuse the Liberals of being Nazi supporters (because Trudeau once wore a swastika armband), the NDP of being the Communists in disguise, and the Conservatives of all being drunken attempted murderers (because Macdonald once tried to strangle Alexander Mackenzie). It is one thing to use history for its lessons, so as to understand the context of the times, quite another to abuse it by using past leaders and parties merely associated with the individuals in modern situations. This is beyond ridiculous!

    In the infinite wisdom of Spaceballs LUDICROUS SPEED GO!!!
  322. Sometimes left Sometimes right from Canada for CANADIANS, Canada writes: Tom Poleck from Mclure, Canada writes: see 4:49pm post.

    Well said!!
  323. can I vote again from around-Kingston, Canada writes: .
    I wonder if Harper is going to dismiss this little ditty while he talks down to Canadians?
  324. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Leon Russell from Gatineau, Qc, Canada writes: globefan Eh from Canada writes: 'Wasn't Stock parachuted into his riding..' No, it was a Seadoo.
    ------
    Love it!
    I think we need to start a petition to bring John Crosbie out of retirement... and another afterwards to have Him as Speaker of the house.
  325. Sometimes left Sometimes right from Canada for CANADIANS, Canada writes: Tom Poleck from Mclure, Canada writes: see 4:49pm post.

    Well said!!

    Correction 4:59!!
  326. Linda Dial from Canada writes: Mr. Harper would tell any lie to stay in power. Instead of facing the House, he throws Quebec under the bus, making him the Chief Wrecker of national unity, which is not the problem here. Most disgusting are the lies he tells about our parliamentary democracy and his erroneous arguments concerning the our constitution and the regulations that accompany it.
  327. Jason Roy from Central Nova - After October 14th AKA STILL Peter MacKay Country, Canada writes: Not the Alliance from In my opinion, The Harper Gov't is totally Incompetent, but excel at whining that it's ALWAYS somebody else's fault., Canada writes: Jason Roy from Central Nova - 'After October 14th AKA STILL Peter MacKay Country, Canada writes: I wonder if the dumb@sses here trying to tie Harper into this even realise Harper was not even an MP in 2000? '

    Yeah, thanks for the reminder Jason. Harper was a lobbiest for the NCC in 2000. Hmmm, let me think. What was he lobbying for? Remind me. All I remember is the stuff he spewed about Canada being a Northern European Welfare State, and what he called the propaganda about bilingualism, and the unemployed who enjoyed being unemployed. The usual Harper type stuff which brings Canadians together....

    ---------------------

    Gee NTA, as one of the more open-eyed/minded posters on here I would figure if you were pi$$ed of at this you would be equally pi$$ed at the present deal with the Bloc...

    ...afterall, we've listened to 3 years of you and your peers mocking the CPC defence of 'well the LPC did it to' so surely the LPC supporters wouldn't accept the same from their party today!

    Cheers!
  328. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Percy, while you are here, please send some of those newfound oilbucks to Ontario. We are bleeding here as havenots. Never mind the politics, please ask Danny to send a cheque.
  329. Peace First from Canada writes: When will these fine citizens of this great country throw these criminals in jail and take back their country?
  330. con hack losers cannot silence the truth from Canada writes:
    One by one, Harpercrite's flimsy arguments get shot down.

    No choice but to prorogue Parliament now - which of course is what the scumbag had planned all along.

    Nice rallies, though. Reminds me of Nuremberg.
  331. martha stewart from Canada writes: Nice photo of Joe Clark.

    Sorry folks. The coalition is dead. Parizeau put the final nail in its coffin.

    Harper will prorogue the House and by the time it returns the CPC budget will have a well thought out economic plan which will conveniently steal all the good ideas from the coalition.

    In the meantime, AFTER the Big Three provides the needed information, and AFTER they do the same for the Americans, and AFTER the Canadian, Ontario, and U.S. governments develop a coordinated action plan, they will act on the auto sector.

    The demands by the Three Stooges coalition to throw money at the auto sector before these steps were taken was stupid beyond belief - and reveals that this really was just a naked power grab and not about the economy.

    Too bad Dion doesn't get to be the faux PM. Hope he doesn't cry too much.

    And too bad for the future of the LPC that Trudeau Jr went along with this and publically spoke about his support for it. His rationalizations for working with the Bloc will come back to haunt him. His sainthood just ended.
  332. Harold Uhlman from Lunenburg, NS, writes: As an aside, does this situation not give us a glimpse of what happens should we have prportional representation which would almost guarantee coalitions would be formed after an election, not before, under the present party system in Canada.
  333. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Linda do not forget your BP pill. I am sure your pressure is up.
  334. Adrian M from Vancouver, Canada writes: This gets funnier every moment. I love this. Our country has the dumbest political structure possible for a 'democratic' country. I am now truly convinced we need a new system.
  335. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Tiu Leek from Canada writes: 'Why can't people understand the difference between making contingency plans and actually putting those plans into action?
    -------

    Let's make it convenient to buy condoms but let's else outlaw it's usage.

    Un-freak$%#@-believable
  336. Percy from NL from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada
    Actually we were thinking about switching our 7 MPs over to Mr. Harper since he's now freely offering cabinet positions and seats in the senate ... but I think we'll wait this one out first :-)
  337. sam slick from Canada writes: Help, please give Harper a majority government!!!!!!
    Wait, he had two chances to get one. Maybe third time a charm! At a cost of $600million. Wait there is more!! It seems the Canadian people wants a MINORITY GOVERNMENT because all those running no matter which party are BLOCKHEADS. Also, those posting here from both side of the fence. Canadian wants a MINORITY GOVERNMENT. Accept it.
  338. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: martha, someone should tell Joe that his head may explode!
  339. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: Zoe Morrow writes: 'YES, EVER NOTICE THAT THE POOREST EDUCATED AND MOST ILL-INFORMED CANADIANS VOTE CONSERVATIVE. GUESS IT'S EASIER NOT TO THINK FOR YOURSELF WHEN YOU AREN'T TOO SMART

    A perfect example of the attitude of Cdn left: a level of elitism that would have made the French nobility in 1788 blush....

    So Zoe, since, to your apprent horror we have a universal franchise in this country, how do you propose to win over all these ignorant louts?...things are getting scary now that they're within spitting distance of majority government, and this coalition is EXACTLY what is need to push us simpletons over the top.
  340. Steve Higgins from Ottawa, Canada writes: This should come as no surprise. Minorities plan for this contingency so they have a strong bargaining position. The Conservatives forgot this since they became accustom to weak opposition. If you want to hold power you need the support of the opposition and the Conservatives couldn’t accept sharing “power”. They could have reached out to any of the three parties involved which would have prevented this.
  341. Michael H from Canada writes: All I know is harper is trying to motivate the Canadian public into keeping himself in control and trying to circumvent the constitution by screaming at the top of his lungs. Voters voted for the Bloc Quebecois and the NDP and the Liberals. The Bloc, NDP, and Liberals are now representing those people by forming a coalition to stop a bill which would bankrupt the only 3 opposition parties and not the party in power. While Harper may have cleaned up that part of the bill they are continuing to do so because they believe it to be in the best interest of their parties and overall Canada. So now instead of having a government supported by 37% of Canadians we have a government supported by 62% of Canadians. (there are 2 independents which make up the remaining 1%). So denying their coalition would mean the party with 37% support would be leading the country instead of the group of parties with 62% of the population. Suggesting this is undemocratic in any way is undemocratic and halting this effort is, and i don't want to use this word but I will for lack of a better one, fascist. Proroguing parliament in a desperate attempt to cling to power, although legal, is incredibly immoral and would be incredibly undemocratic.

    harper needs to stop pushing to be the king of Canada and accept his loss without trying to circumvent the law through telling half truths to the Canadian public.
  342. j hynes from writes: Funny how the system works only when it favors Conservative interest. Stephen Harper needs a lesson in minority governments - to say that Canada gave the Conservatives a mandate to govern shows just how 'pig headed' they really are. A minority leader is basically the first place loser. I continously see Harper ignoring economics question and relate everything back to the Quebec issue. Way to go Mr. PM. I hope the people of Quebec see what they really mean to the Conservatives. I am a proud Canadian and feel this is no time to play the Bloc card when the economy in upside down. Get with the Program! If a coalition is what we need to get through these times then it should not matter who is in it, as long as everyone works together to solve the problem.
  343. Jesse Winger from Calgary Questions Harper, Canada writes: Michael Robertson from Carstairs, Canada writes: 'While were at this why don't we accuse the Liberals of being Nazi supporters (because Trudeau once wore a swastika armband)'

    That's an ignorant lie, MR from Carstairs. Never happened. How low will Cons stoop to smear? We just saw it in writing.

    Shame on Carstairs for hosting citizens like you.
  344. joseph Cheng from Toronto, Canada writes: Joe Clark too? My goodness! Is there any honest politician with some integrity left in our country?
  345. cunuck T from vancouver, Canada writes: Let the liberal and NDP join together in the next election, if they win enough seats to from government thats a coalition I could get behind.
  346. Paul Mullen from Canada writes:
    All you liberals suggesting that Harper is finished should get a head-start and eat some of your words now... A couple times a year, he slips a bit, and you're all over the place saying he's got to go. The rest of the time, the opposition parties are the ones sliding backwards.

    As far as the 'coalition' goes... pouring gasoline on a match instead of blowing it out isn't going to win them any votes, which I suppose is why they don't plan to ask for any.
  347. E. Coli from Canada writes: We in the East really pulled one on Western Canada. We plan to put a Socialist, Idiot and Separatist in charge of the country and the West gets to pay for this hijack. Ha Ha!!

    Wake up BC and the Prairies, you get to pay for this hostile takeover and the subsequent fleecing of your wealth.

    Ontario gets to keep the defunct auto industry and pay the fat pensions to their crowd. Quebec gets to fleece billions per year while giving you the finger and the Maritimes.... well most of the good ones are working in the West.
  348. Davisville Town from Canada writes: Please understand, all those foaming at the mouth about G&M; reporting this are being paid to do this. Similarly, a large number of really partisan comments against Harper may also be from paid 'concerned citizens'. Hey we all have to feed our families
  349. Percy from NL from Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada
    Parizeau? Was he also in on this earlier deal that this article speaks about?
  350. Overtaxed Taxpayer from Canada writes: The Globe better be careful. Their stories are heading into Toronto Star territory.
  351. Ian Berg from Canada writes: The 2000 election did not result in a minority Liberal government. The Canadian Alliance and Bloc Quebecois did not move forward on the proposals circulated by a couple of lawyers. The Canadian Alliance would have had a helluva time trying to convince its own supporters of the merit of governing with the Bloc Quebecois.
  352. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: martha stewart - You might be the biggest blowhard on this board. Why are you calling a coalition of two parties 'the Three Stooges coalition'? Exaggeration? What makes you think the coalition is dead? Crystal ball? Assassination plot? Why are you talking about Justin Trudeau? Because rather than presenting factual arguments you prefer to go around blowing hot air and zealot talking points? Who do you think you're impressing (other then the obvious of course, i.e. yourself)?
  353. Eric Williams from Ottawa, Canada writes: Mr Harper, do the honourable thing: RESIGN!
  354. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: No, No Percy, forget Steve. We here in Ontario need cash big time. Our liberal premier is all spent out. You and Danny are our best hope.
  355. DeMock Racy from Toronto, Canada writes: Please leave Harper, I can't read any more anti Harper hate blogs its embarrassing. In reality this is hilarious,let's admit it, we Canadians have a great sense of political humour, in many countries there would have been a march down main street to the palace rounded up with a proper old lynching!!!
  356. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: sam slick - kind of a clear trend party-support-wise:

    2000 2004 2006 2008
    LPC 172 136 103 77
    CPC 78 99 124 143

    So what are we really getting this coaltion? It's a last desperate attempt of the LPC to stave off disaster and over a decade in the wilderness; Harper has given the left the biggest Xmas present ever - if he stepped aside Cdn reticence would disappear and we'd have a lovely decade of Mulroney era majorities (not the sad pathetic Chretien style ones...).
  357. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: Paul Mullen from Canada writes:
    This is BS... Two lawyers musing about stuff (even dumb stuff) happens all the time. There was never anything like a plan to sign a formal arrangement with the Bloc to grab and maintain power over the country.

    This headline will mislead a lot of people. Congrats to the Globe.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I think you missed the point about this article.
    That's it's quite normal to propose a coalition before an election in our type of democracy, or after an election during a minority government(see Harper 2004)

    It's rare that it actually happens as the right sset of circumstances and criteria have to be met.

    In this case it is quite plausible as there is a coalition set up if Harper loses a confidence vote. He would then ask for an election and precedents point the GG saying no and asking Mr. Dion to form a government.

    Even if Le cardigan tries to prorogue , the G.G. may deny this as avoidance of the house and it's members right to act..
  358. Percy from NL from Canada writes: Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada
    Please be patient, counting is a challenge to some. Sometimes they will count 1,3,4,5, 6 ... when they're excited and troubled at the same time :-)
  359. Hugh Andrew from Ottawa, Canada writes: Where is the once proud Progressive Conservative Party?

    Lies, bullying, vindictiveness, violating laws and dictatorship are not becoming of any party representing Canadians.
  360. mike griffin from Ottawa, Canada writes: There once was a brat from Alberta
    Who could not be spanked
    Cause it hurta
    He begged for time out
    And he blustered about
    As he learned you can't polish a turda
  361. Percy from NL from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada
    Listen, don't worry, do what Steve has done and predict that you're going to sell off undisclosed government assets in a buyer's market. That way you can balance your books.
  362. Rudy Krueger from High River, Canada writes: By the way, why is Quebec still here? I thought they'd left. Did someone forget to issue their welfare cheque?
  363. Black Knight7 from Sudbury, Canada writes: I DON'T KNOW IF ANYONE NOTICED BUT THE LIBERALS HAD A MAJORITY AT THE TIME OF THIS SOCALLED DOCUMENT, SO IT MUST HAVE BEEN PRETTY HYPOTHETICAL. IT WOULD HAVE REQUIRED A LOT OF DEFECTIONS FOR SUCH A COALITION TO COME ABOUT.
    WHICH MEANS THAT THE DOCUMENT SHOULDN'T BE TAKEN TOO SERIOUSLY. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT SITUATION IT WAS CONTEMPLATED FOR.
  364. mike sty the Coalition Centrist from Canada writes:

    Why does Day always look like he should have stripes on his shirt ??

    Black and white ones.
  365. Anyone but Ignatieff; Rae and LeBlanc. or Duceppe for the new Liberal Leader. from Canada writes: Funny the globe & mail has yet to publish the parizoo statement from the seperatists. The globe is certainly behaving oddly by supporting the seperatist government. I'm wonderijng now if the seperatist coalition canvessed the Globe & Mail ahead of time for their support?
  366. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: soup from Calgary - send a letter of support to your Calgary liberal MP. Oh, right, forgot there are none.
  367. Penny B from edmonton, Canada writes: Its too bad our wonderful country of canada is going to be run by three blind mice.And be the laughing stock of canada now.
  368. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Percy from NL from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada
    Actually we were thinking about switching our 7 MPs over to Mr. Harper since he's now freely offering cabinet positions and seats in the senate ... but I think we'll wait this one out first :-)

    ------
    He who laughs last, laughs best :-)

    Notice they ain't making Newfie jokes anymore??
  369. sam slick from Canada writes: Where is Preston Manning?
  370. Garth West from Victoria, Canada writes: Is Harper going to do a Tricky Dick Nixon tonight in his little heart to heart.

    The only thing I want to hear from this blackguard is, 'I'm sorry; I apologize; I'm out of here;' and then the click of the door locking behind him.

    I can only hope he hasn't done irrepairable damage to both his party and to the country.

    Begone Stephen! Begone - you should have left before now.
    Get thee to a nunnery.
  371. Jon Newton from Toronto, Canada writes: Can someone please explain to me why this isn't the front page story?

    theglobeandmail.com

    Isn't it somewhat relevant that the Liberal Party's biggest star is being encouraged to distance himself from the coalition?
  372. Adam Whitman from Montreal, Canada writes: I can't believe how retarded some of the Leftist posts over here are. Some leftists (actually all) are so brainwashed, they can't even reason out WHAT THE FACTS ARE. Why don't they read the article first, before disseminating even more slander against Harper? In fact, it could be even simpler for them - they don't even have to reason anything - JUST READ THE FACTS!!!! THE FACT IS THAT THIS LAWYER APPROACHED NOT A SINGLE ALLIANCE MP to discuss about a possible coalition.

    So what are people talking about, claiming somehow that the cons were scheming with the BLOC in the past? It's complete bullcr*p on the part of left-wingers. Shame on you.
  373. Joe Dick from Kingston, Canada writes: Please Black Knight7 all these little facts and differences have no meaning to us.

    We are liberal, the G&M; told us what to think so we will simply regurgitate it.
  374. Logical Thinker007 from Canada writes: First, simply working with the Bloc is not wrong - question is what policies are you trying to implement. I think Harper needs to stop using inflamatory rhetoric that Quebecers will see as a slight against them, especially considering that over the last few years he has repeatedly worked with the Bloc to undermine the Liberals. He also needs to resign and perhaps that way save the PCs from being in the opposition. He still doesn't seem to have figured out that having a minority of seats does NOT entitle you to absolute power in the parliament.

    Had Harper taken a cue from Obama and tried to govern for ALL Canadians and leave his bully tendencies at the door this would not have happened. I say we get Jim Prentice in as leader of PCs - he seems to me like a sensible human being.
  375. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: Systemic Risk from Canada writes; 'we'd have a lovely decade of Mulroney era majorities'

    In both cases their arrogance led them astray proportionally to their majorities.

    Big majorities are not good for democracy!
  376. Patrick Nash from Canada writes: What is saddest about this is the desire of the G & M to unabashedly report this as front page news. I used to think the G & M had a hope. Not any more. The partisan editorialism which today spews forth from the pages of the G & M is a disgrace and the worst kind of an insult to journalistic integrity. G & M - for once, please try to report just the facts, instead of trying to influence people with your own partisan politics.
  377. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Percy, can we start with the CBC? Just shutting it down, forget selling it, would save us $2 billion.
  378. Green Canada from Edmonton, Canada writes: Just because it wasn't used doesn't undermine the hypocracy that is running rampant in the conservative rhetoric at this point.

    I for one think the coalition should back off and give the conservative minority another chance but the b.s. being spewed by the cons is nothing but propaganda and hugely misrepresenting the nature of our federal parliamentary system.
  379. The Artful Dodger from Toronto, Canada writes: Just one decent Canadian leader...PLEASE!!!!!!

    I'm disgusted with the whole lot of them. Truely shameful
  380. G MACK from Canada writes: IT'S SIMPLE MATH...

    if you voted LIB, BLOC OR NDP which is let's say half the country - then this is a good thing!

    Harper asked for an election thinking he would get a majority and didn't - his arrogance cost taxpayers millions, etc.

    I'm looking fwd to the change and happy to see the political process working! It's only unethical if you support Harper remember, but I bet you supported him doing the same thing in 2004!
  381. mike sty the Coalition Centrist from Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada writes: Parizeau put the final nail in its coffin.
    -------------------

    I see you got your pre-scripted talking points from myCampaign.ca

    Keep up the good work.

    Just like a dedicated little Harper soldier.
  382. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: Hugh Andrew - so true - isn't there anyone there in this country on the centre right who has passion, leadership skills, judgment and a winning smile who can step up and run the CPC? I am convinced if they did, we would see 200 seat majorities because the opposition is a disaster - THAT is what is so galling about this 'coalition' - it is truly the 'losers' in every sense of that word, winning. It need not be so.... Haroper would be happier on the board of a giant oil company where I'm sure his tactics will be more prized by voracious shareholders.
  383. joseph Cheng from Toronto, Canada writes: When the three amigos signed that coalition document on TV, my brother-in-law (a diehard Conservative) and I made the comment that at last we saw Duceppe did something official in the presence of the Maple Leaf. Then the next day, PM Harper ranted in the parliament the coalition document was signed without the presence of our national flag. This proves that politicians can only see what they want to see ie., power and only power, and don't give a damn what is real and unreal in the real world.
    Mr. Dion: Please go right now!
    PM Harper: Please go right now!
  384. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes:
    Joe Dick from Kingston, Canada writes: Please Black Knight7 all these little facts and differences have no meaning to us.

    We are liberal, the G&M; told us what to think so we will simply regurgitate it.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Well we don't the PMO talking points so someone has to give us news scoops to argue over.

    I know it's not approved party dogma, but take pity on us for trying to think for ourselves instead of being parrots...
  385. Geoff Day from Canada writes: It is truly amazing how people defending Mr Harper now selectively say this news is too old. Could you please give us the time frame within which we can criticize Mr Harper and his colleagues? We need the rules. Of course Mr Harper is not too good at defining rules that 'stick'.

    Indeed Mr Harper also has a convenient memory loss re. his dealings with the Bloc and he now appears to want to re-define a 'real Canadian' majority. It goes like this in his one-track mind:
    - there are 308 seats in the HOC
    - the Bloc has 75 max
    - those seats can't be used in any coalition because they are ONLY there to destroy Canada (except when I need them of course or if I have any of those seats!)
    - therefore any majority is based on 308-75 = 233 seats
    - I only need 117!
    - so in my present situation the NDP/Lib coalition cannot rule because they don't have a majority of 'real Canadians' - I do!

    Please Mr Dion show Mr Harper how working together works using your REAL majority including the Bloc - they ARE elected even if you disagree with some of their beliefs Mr Harper!

    Desperation?
  386. james m from Edmonton, Canada writes: Patrick Nash - I couldn't agree with you more. Like when the G and M endorsed Stephen Harper for PM seven weeks ago - now that was truly 'a disgrace, and the worst kind of an insult to journalistic integrity'.

    Or is partisanship only bad when it opposes the party you support?

    You, like the PM, Mr. Day, and the rest of the incompetents in the current government, appear to be an outrageous hypocrite.
  387. Percy from NL from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada
    Shutting down the CBC will save 2 billion? Wow, then Harper could build his promised state-controlled by-invitation-only media center in Ottawa.
  388. mike sty the Coalition Centrist from Canada writes: Just In from Canada writes: The Alberta Harper Conservatives have only one defense:

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    MY BOY CAN DO NO WRONG.

    Oh well
    --------------------

    How true.
  389. Jeff Werkman from Oakville, Canada writes: This is insane. I remember years back wanting to vote Conservative to get rid of the corrupted Liberals. However, I just couldn't do it because of Harper. The guys is sleaze. Speeches that weren't his, deals he's made in the past. All the obvious lies. This was the guy who talked ethics and now holds our goverment hostage because he doesn't want to lose power. Don't buy into the crap he's saying about doing this for Canada. The facts are laid bare, don't ignore them and be so niave. I ask all Conservatives to send this guy packing, he's dead weight and dumb as nails. Get a new leader who knows how to put the nation first. And liberals need to do the same. And Ndpers, you'll always be welcome as opposition. And Quebec, there is a Canada beyond La belle province, we'd like you to particapate in Federal politics.
  390. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Spencer C from Canada wrote:
    I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.

    Spencer,
    Stockwell Day is not defunct .......... he is a leader in the Tory cabinet.

    ........ and the Tory party is not defunct either
    ......... they just change aliases as often as they change underwear
  391. Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> anoni moose writes : 'it's quite normal to propose a coalition before an election in our type of democracy, or after an election during a minority government, It's rare that it actually happens as the right sset of circumstances and criteria have to be met.'

    Actually moose, it's normal for parties to try all kinds of political posturing and manoevering with no intention of actually following through. Good sense and fear of voter retaliation usually stops the dumb stuff before it's too late.

    There has only been ONE coalition in the history of Canada, it was during the first-world war, and there was a serious debate at the time over conscription.

    How does that compare to our situation now, where the only real item of contention is that of political funding, and advantage ?
  392. Luke Morrow from Canada writes: Not another election. Conservatives strongly ridicule Dion when asked the ridiculous question on the economy from the so called reporter. The Conservatives were against redoes, therefore no election.

    Some words from Harper when he was in opposition.
    “Harper: There seems to be an attitude in the Liberal government - that they can go in, be deliberately defeated and call an election - that's not how our constitutional system works. The government has a minority - it has an obligation to demonstrate to Canadians that it can govern. That it can form a majority in the House of Commons. If it can't form a majority, we look at other options, we don't just concede to the government's request to make it dysfunctional. I know for a fact that Mr. Duceppe and Mr. Layton and the people who work for them want this Parliament to work and I know if is in all of our interests to work. The government has got to face the fact it has a minority, it has to work with other people.”
  393. The Wight from Canada writes: Dave Campbell: _'On top of that, the way he is vilifying the BQ is embarassing.'_ Harper has so royally fvcking the CPC's chances today that I'll be amazed if he lasts to Monday as leader. The absolutely last thing you do is stab the balance of power in the back, but he played that 'this is treason' card around the BQ and now he is screwed. There really are only three options with Harper at the helm: a) he prorogues and has until Jan 27th to come up with a budget and stimulus package good enough to avoid a non-confidence motion on budget day. He ALSO has to court the BQ again or he'll face never ending non-confidence motions on all major bills. He NEEDS the BQ ... and he just screwed that possibility. b) he isn't allowed to prorogue and the coalition assumes power on Monday. c) the GG calls an election and now Harper faces a coalition of the LPC and NDP, guaranteed (8pt lead) and quite likely with GRN (15pt lead) in the mix because a general election means GRN's million voters are finally in play. Do the math with the previous elections numbers and the coalition gets a majority, handily, and the CPC is confined to Alberta, an island in central BC and a smattering of ridings in northern Ontario. Everything else flips. BQ could play spoiler and throw in with the CPC ... but what are the odds after Mr. Personality's stunt today? If I was a CPC strategist, I'd be cutting his brake lines right now.
  394. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: I wonder what all of this spending is doing to the CPC's bottom line. First, all of the spending on network time during the election and now network time over this past week must be putting serious dent in the coffers. Throw in the fact that the economic downturn will make it harder to raise political funding and I would say that the playing field is started to even out between the Conservatives and Liberals. The Liberals have been doing all of this on a shoestring budget. In an effort to bankrupt the Liberal party, it appears that Harper is bankrupting his own party.

    If he fails as PM, I do not think Conservatives can justify the results for all of the money that he has poured into propping his agenda. So if the GG goes with the coalition, then Harper is out as leader of the CPC.
  395. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: DeMock Racy from Toronto, Canada writes:
    In reality this is hilarious,let's admit it, we Canadians have a great sense of political humour, in many countries there would have been a march down main street to the palace rounded up with a proper old lynching!!!

    -------
    Agreed; but that was so last century;

    But we do need a 'Saturday night Live' of our own

    I say: From Regina it's 'Saturday night Live' ; Regina will save us.

    Yes we Can

    Cheers
  396. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Percy, you are right. You tell Danny, he may be able to get in on the deal. Also while you are talking to Danny please ask him to send some of those oilbucks. We are getting desperate here in Ontario.
  397. The Wight from Canada writes: Paul Mullen:

    'How does that compare to our situation now, where the only real item of contention is that of political funding, and advantage?'

    More parties.

    The single biggest predictor of minority governments is the number of parties. The single biggest predictor of coaltion governments is the number of minority governments that arise by election.
  398. C Gardner from Canada writes: From the G&M;

    September 23, 2008 at 1:50 PM EST

    BURNABY, B.C. — Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion flatly rejected forming a coalition government with the New Democrats today on the heels of hints from NDP Leader Jack Layton that he'd be open to the idea.

    Mr. Dion, speaking after an address to a Vancouver-area business crowd today, said he could not work with Mr. Layton in this way because the NDP leader wants to hike taxes on business.

    “We cannot have a coalition with a party that has a platform that would be damaging for the economy. Period,” the Liberal leader said.

    LIAR!!
  399. Gaston Paquette from Mars, Canada writes: Keep spinning that fast Con-bots anf your heads will detach from your bodies .
    Yikes ! These Con-bots are dumb .
  400. Michael Robertson from Carstairs, Canada writes: Jesse Winger from Calgary Questions Harper, Canada writes: Michael Robertson from Carstairs, Canada writes: 'While were at this why don't we accuse the Liberals of being Nazi supporters (because Trudeau once wore a swastika armband)'

    That's an ignorant lie, MR from Carstairs. Never happened. How low will Cons stoop to smear? We just saw it in writing.

    Shame on Carstairs for hosting citizens like you.

    _______________________________________________________

    Yeah he definatelty did not protest WWII and King never asked his dog and dead mother for advice on state affairs. Our PMs are a cooky bunch of nut bars - no matter the party. You assume that I am a Con and you assume I am uneducated? Both wrong my friend - and personally attacking me because we all seem to have forgotten manners and decorum in debate - how about we all try to avoid emulating those who we scorn? I realize that it is difficult not to call each other names, especially with such a wonderful example being set by our supposed leaders, and yet we wonder how they could be so stupid and partisan. Humble, meaningful, and intelligent debate have gone the way of peace, order, and good government. Maybe the Dodo can greet them in the land of extinction.
  401. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Spencer C from Canada wrote:
    I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.

    Spencer,
    The Tory party is not defunct ............
    ......... they just change aliases as often as they change underwear.

    ........ and Stockwell Day was given a seat in cabinet without any whining from the likes of you.
  402. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: anoni moose - yeah but its good times for a while!

    I've said forever that Canada needs the German system: 2 votes each - one for local riding and one for national party. Half FPTP and half PR - a perfect blending of regional and national issues - then have the Senate appointed half by provinces and half by PM for 8 or 10 year terms - both these things would give WAY more representative government, and more coalitions, but also ones that felt more valid (since you'd need close to 50% to win outright so it would be much tougher). Maybe I'll start a blog on this topic - always wanted to do that!
  403. monty bissett from sjd, Mexico writes: A DOCUMENT NOT SIGNED AND WITH A DEFUNCT PARTY. GIVE ME A BREAK.
    WE EITHER NEED AN ELECTION OR PEROGUE. I THINK A ELECTION IS IN ORDER. HAVING A GOVERNEMNT WITH AN ALLIANCE WITH SEPRATISTS WHO HAVE NO DESIRE TO SEE ANY HELP FOR CANADA AND JUST 1 PROVINCE ISN'T AN OPTION.
  404. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: E. Coli - Congrats on choosing a name that so accurately reflects the nature of what comes out of your mouth. You Conservative zealots seem awfully fond of the phrases 'Wake up people' and 'Give your head a shake'. This is funny because you're also as a group responsible for a lot of comments that are long on rhetoric and wacky concepts and short on facts and common sense. I'll close with another favourite, i.e. What have you been smoking???
  405. Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> L M87 writes : 'I wonder what all of this spending is doing to the CPC's bottom line'

    According to this paper, the Conservative party finished balancing their books a couple weeks after the election, while the other parties continue to wallow in debt.

    If only we could figure out who could best lead the country out of an economic crisis... any ideas ?
  406. Gord Gilmour from Winnipeg, Canada writes: OK, help me out here. I'm a bit confused.

    So in 2000, when the CA, PC and BQ captured 48.79 per cent of the popular vote, they'd have been prepared to move.

    But when three parties representing 58.9 per cent of the popular vote want to do it today, it's somehow undemocratic?

    This is insane. Stephen Harper shot himself in the foot. Now to save his job and hide he's willing to question the legitimacy of established precedent in a parliamentary democracy? Yet the forerunners of his own party were willing to consider it themselves on an even flimsier pretext.

    This guy should resign. He's willing to reignite both Quebec and Western separatism and risk having our country go the way of street protests and anarchy?

    He should be ashamed of himself. Time for Mr. Harper to resign and the rest of them back down. They're perfectly within their rights, but if Mr. Harper cuts his own head off, my view is that's penance enough and the parties should then count it as a clean slate.

    This guy has clearly been the irritant. Once he's gone, then the rest of them should all sign a document promising to make it work for the next two years. If they're not willing, let's have an election right now.

    But give us voters a 'none of the above' choice so we can enjoy the spectacle of a generation of Canadian politicians frantically searching for the one thing they'd never need...

    A real job.
  407. Z M from Canada writes: September 9, 2004

    Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson,
    C.C., C.M.M., C.O.M., C.D.
    Governor General
    Rideau Hall
    1 Sussex Drive
    Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0A1

    Excellency,
    As leaders of the opposition parties, we are well aware that, given the Liberal minority government, you could be asked by the Prime Minister
    to dissolve the 38th Parliament at any time should the House of Commons fail to support some part of the government's program.
    We respectfully point out that the opposition parties, who together constitute a majority in the House, have been in close consultation. We believe that, should a request for dissolution arise this should give you cause, as constitutional practice has determined, to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your constitutional authority.
    Your attention to this matter is appreciated.

    Sincerely,
    Hon. Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P.
    Leader of the Opposition
    Leader of the Conservative Party of Canada'

    (Also signed by Duceppe and Layton)

    Why don't the con-hacks on here address this? Geez, I wonder.
  408. martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel writes: 'martha stewart - You might be the biggest blowhard on this board.'

    I might be. Or you might be.

    'Why are you calling a coalition of two parties 'the Three Stooges coalition'?'

    Because, in reality, the three are in a de facto coaltion. Or did you just see two parties sign that agreement?

    'What makes you think the coalition is dead?'

    ------------

    mike sty writes: 'martha stewart from Canada writes: Parizeau put the final nail in its coffin.
    -------------------

    I see you got your pre-scripted talking points from myCampaign.ca'

    Anyone who can't figure this out for themselves can't figure much out for themselves at all.

    The only surprise for me so far is that this coalition lasted this long. The only thing that really united them was that threat to their party subsidies. I thought they implode as soon as that was off the table but I guess Chretien advised them to go for the power grab anyways - as he would do.

    The coalition... R.I.P.

    Common sense.

    'Why are you talking about Justin Trudeau?'

    Because I have seen him twice on CPAC rationalizing this very poorly and he is (was?) the shining hope for the LPC's future.
  409. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: L M87, do not worry, I will send Steve another cheque.
    100,000 of me and my buddies x 100 bucks = 10 mill, no problem.
  410. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Gaston Paquette from Mars, Canada writes: 'Keep spinning that fast Con-bots anf your heads will detach from your bodies .
    Yikes ! These Con-bots are dumb .'

    Says the guy who can't spell 'facts' or 'and'.

    Thanks for the laugh.
  411. AlbertaOilpatch is Great from Canada writes: EXTRA EXTRA
    Read all about it. This just in Mickey Mouse has made a letter of intent to the Bloc to support them. I also heard that Mulruney is thinking of signing off on this letter. And Robert Stanfield also thought of signing on as well but he unfortunately has some problems coming back from the dead.
    On other breaking news the airbus airfare has come to light and needs a thorough investagition. Oh wait that horse is also dead and has trouble coming back to life.
  412. Nick W from Canada writes: All politicians lie. Liberal, Conservative, NDP, Bloc, Green, Rhino, whatever. So, no surprise here.
  413. Percy from NL from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada

    If I were you I'd calm down because Jim 'Hide the Deficit' Flaherty will soon be available to Ontario as a finance minister. I'm not sure that they'll want him back after his brilliant recent economic update however, but I could be wrong.
  414. L Stewart from Canada writes: I am outraged! A Canadian Press report states that 'Ontario MP Bob Dechert accused the Liberals of trying to destroy the country by aligning with the separatist Bloc.

    'They're getting into bed with the separatists,' he said. 'They've actually written a deal giving the separatists a veto over every decision of the Canadian government. That is as close to treason and sedition as I can imagine.'

    I'm not his biggest fan, but Stephane Dion has done more for Canadian unity than anyone now on Parliament Hill. To accuse him and the coalition of treason is unbelievable. And now we learn that 'Bloc part of secret coalition plot in 2000 with Canadian Alliance'!! Not to mention the deal to bring down Martin's government that the Tories apparently tried to make with the Bloc in 2004!

    Stephen Harper and the Party he leads are really scaring me now.
  415. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: C Gardner - Be careful who you call a liar. Creepy Steve and his cabinet have been responsible for some doozies.
  416. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Systemic Risk from Canada writes:
    .... Haroper would be happier on the board of a giant oil company where I'm sure his tactics will be more prized by voracious shareholders.
    ------
    Agreed, but not a Canadian Company..... My RRSP needs to recover
    and besides He can't count.
  417. James Young from Brantford, Canada writes: Be gone Harper and take the CPC with you. You have done enough harm.

    Canada is not a Republic. What is more astonishing is the CPC do not understand how our system works. When they meet the GG there will be a reality check.

    Many posters obviously don't understand what a Constitutional Monarchy is. Amazing! Many posters don't understand how Parliament works.

    This little upheavel in Parliament should be a real eyeopener for many ignorant posters. Others are just trying to befuddle the issue, similar to their would be dictator , Harper.

    Durgan.

    Durgan.
  418. Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> Systemic Risk writes : 'I've said forever that Canada needs the German system: 2 votes each - one for local riding and one for national party. Half FPTP and half PR'

    It's all well and good to want to fix the system, but adding complexity only obscures democracy... It's hard enough getting people to understand and participate in the system we've got now...

    Which, by the way is broken. The senate is supposed to advocate for the provinces, but instead is a partisan (Liberal) monolith. Why don't we start by fixing that, and see where it takes us ?
  419. Tiu Leek from Canada writes: 'So in 2000, when the CA, PC and BQ captured 48.79 per cent of the popular vote, they'd have been prepared to move.'

    But Gord, don't you understand? That was over 8 years ago, so it doesn't count at all.

    Also, they never signed the deal, so that means they never intended to follow through with it. Some lawyer just drew up the paperwork because he thought the separatists and Canadian Alliance would be interested forming a partnership.

    Also, Joe Clark was a Communist, so it doesn't count either. And so are the reporters at the Globe and Mail.

    Is it clear now? :)
  420. martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel - Oops. Here's my answer to you again, without the glitch. I accidentally mixed up the alphabet in my soup last time.

    Soup Campbel writes: 'martha stewart - You might be the biggest blowhard on this board.'

    I might be. Or you might be.

    'Why are you calling a coalition of two parties 'the Three Stooges coalition'?'

    Because, in reality, the three are in a de facto coaltion. Or did you just see two parties sign that agreement?

    'What makes you think the coalition is dead?'

    Common sense.

    'Why are you talking about Justin Trudeau?'

    Because I have seen him twice on CPAC rationalizing this very poorly and he is (was?) the shining hope for the LPC's future.
  421. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: martha stewart - Nice garble.
  422. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> anoni moose writes : 'it's quite normal to propose a coalition before an election in our type of democracy, or after an election during a minority government, It's rare that it actually happens as the right sset of circumstances and criteria have to be met.'

    Actually moose, it's normal for parties to try all kinds of political posturing and manoevering with no intention of actually following through. Good sense and fear of voter retaliation usually stops the dumb stuff before it's too late.

    There has only been ONE coalition in the history of Canada, it was during the first-world war, and there was a serious debate at the time over conscription.

    How does that compare to our situation now, where the only real item of contention is that of political funding, and advantage ?
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Usually it's less about good sense than circumstance that derails these attempts.
    In the case of the 2004 attempt by Mr. Harper et al, the request by Mr. Martin for an election was within the correct time frame to preclude Mr. Harpers request. Moreover, I don't think it was matter of confidence.

    The reverse is true of this case as the government has been sitting for less than a month.

    I know it would be expedient to think that this hasn't happened before due to right thinking and so on. However I'd much prefer examples to back up your assertions.
  423. D'Arcy Mackenzie from Toronto, Canada writes: To Conservatives and especially those from the west: this has become personalized around Harper. Another poster refered to it perfectly - the issue of trust. I was quite comfortable with the Conservatives having a minority, but not a majority - because of the trust issue. This episode only reinforces that sense. So I agree with the Globe editorial that we need to see a new leader for both the Conservatives and Liberals - say in year. Then have an election. I don't know much about Prentice except that unlike Harper he was born in the west (am I correct?) There is something about Harper's relationship to the province of birth that makes me uneasy - as if he has some pathological dislike for the political culture here. I grew up in the 1970's when we had an era of great leaders including Peter Lougheed, Alan Blakeney and Rene Leveques who represented their views and their provinces without denigrating others.
  424. Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes: ......when they supported his first minority he lovingly (blue sweater style) christened them 'a nation within a nation'........now, with his face contorted with rage, he refers to them as separatist traitors.......Stevie has brought this country to the brink......
  425. Z M from Canada writes: Ok Ok...I'll try again con hacks...EXPLAIN THIS LETTER!!!

    September 9, 2004

    Her Excellency the Right Honourable Adrienne Clarkson,
    C.C., C.M.M., C.O.M., C.D.
    Governor General
    Rideau Hall
    1 Sussex Drive
    Ottawa, Ontario K1A 0A1

    Excellency,
    As leaders of the opposition parties, we are well aware that, given the Liberal minority government, you could be asked by the Prime Minister
    to dissolve the 38th Parliament at any time should the House of Commons fail to support some part of the government's program.
    We respectfully point out that the opposition parties, who together constitute a majority in the House, have been in close consultation. We believe that, should a request for dissolution arise this should give you cause, as constitutional practice has determined, to consult the opposition leaders and consider all of your options before exercising your constitutional authority.
    Your attention to this matter is appreciated.

    Sincerely,
    Hon. Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P.
    Leader of the Opposition
    Leader of the Conservative Party of Canada'

    (Also signed by Duceppe and Layton)
  426. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes:

    'I wonder what all of this spending is doing to the CPC's bottom line.'

    Actually with this silly coalition business the CPC coffers are likely overflowing.

    I know people who didn't vote last election and are completely apathetic about politics who have donated to the CPC.

    Conservative supporters have been cutting cheques for the last week.

    The only party membership I've ever owned was CA to vote against Day and I've never made a political donation in my life...until last week.

    When I heard about this silly coalition I cut a cheque for the maximum allowable and sent it to the CPC immediately.

    How ironic. This silly coalition came to fruition so the opposition parties could save their collective hides with public funding.

    The result will be they are still broke and the CPC will have more money than ever.

    The irony is just too good.
  427. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: Just to add to my point above, I don't think (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that my proposal would require constitutional change, though the PM would probably have to sign off on provincial Senate appointees which could be problematic if there was antipathy but I digress. Anyway the German hybrid model is the best, and under than model a LIB/NDP coalition would be stronger though still short of an outright majority. Note too that Germany is one of the only countries to have a left-right coalition (CDU/SPD) - one cannot even imagine a CPC-LPC coalition in this country.
  428. martha stewart from Canada writes: mike sty writes: 'martha stewart from Canada writes: Parizeau put the final nail in its coffin.
    -------------------

    I see you got your pre-scripted talking points from myCampaign.ca'

    ----------

    Anyone who can't figure this out for themselves can't figure much out for themselves at all.

    The only surprise for me so far is that this coalition lasted this long. The only thing that really united them was that threat to their party subsidies. I thought they implode as soon as that was off the table but I guess Chretien advised them to go for the power grab anyways - as he would do.

    The coalition... R.I.P.

    -----------

    Yes mike, its a re-run. Messed up an earlier post. I tried to make a 'coalition' out of two posts and, well, you know how that works...
  429. Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes: monty bissett ...a 'perogue' is an Ukrainian delicacy....
  430. J Birch from Hamilton, Canada writes:

    ATTN CON Borg War Room Troll ALERT

    Better get extra large coffees tonight - you are going to need them to Spin this one !!!

    .
  431. J A from Ottawa, Canada writes: Wow isn't that scandalous! The Reform/Conservative Party tried to form a coalition with the Bloc!
  432. SHaun Bowring from Toronto, Canada writes: I can't believe the general ignorance on how our parliamentary system actually works. Please educate yourselves.
  433. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: martha - See I think you're a blowhard because you think it's common sense that the coalition is dead. That might be what you wish for but you have no idea whether it is or not. You're mostly interested in sounding like you know what's really happening. I have no particular interest in J Trudeau but I do think it's strange that you levered him into a conversation that concerns him only very peripherally. You also don't mention any other MP's who supported it. It makes one think that you have some kind of irrational hate on for Trudeau. The coalition is between the Libs and the NDP period. The Bloc support it, as do the Greens, but they are not part of it. So again, one wonders why you are exaggerating like this. Perhaps, again, you're not as interested in fact as you are in spreading misleading statements. Just a thought. ;-)
  434. Joan Forsey from Canada writes: The central fact remains that, just seven weeks ago, 74% of the Canadian electorate rejected the Liberal Party and Stephane Dion as Prime Minister.

    Now we are faced with the prospect of Stephane Dion as Prime Minister.

    And Canada is supposedly a democracy!

    Moreover, in late September, about three weeks before the election, Stephane Dion rejected Jack Layton's suggestion that the oppostion parties form a coalition. He said in Vancouver, 'We cannot have a coalition with a party that has a platform that would be damaging for the economy. Period.'

    Now, supposedly in the interest of stimulating the economy, Dion joins a coalition with Layton!
  435. C T from Canada writes: It's sad to see Harper make this situation a unity issue in order to save his own hide. Is this 'good governance' for the best interest of all? Is it crass ambition? Or is it blind desperation? I'd say the latter two.

    Also, are there any poles taking the pulse of all Canadians?

    And! Were there this many posted comments on any significant headlines during the election?
  436. Paul Vermeersch from Canada writes: Stephen Harper and the CPC have nothing but lies and propaganda to offer the country on this matter. They have engages in a campaign of misinformation to muddy the waters of constitutional law for the... um... casually concerned. Even when their hands are still covered in crumbs from their own coalition cookie-jar, they persist in their bald-faced hypocrisy. The CPC wouldn't know the truth if flowed backwards up Niagara Falls in a wetsuit.
  437. Will Farnaby from writes: Heil Harper !

    The ReThugLieCon Party of Canada.
  438. Systemic Risk from Canada writes: Paul Mullen - but I proposed to fix the Senate too! I think an elected Senate in the short term is too much to hope for (and might muddy who was accountable to whom) but by having half the seats directly appointed by Premiers, it would take on more regional legitimacy.

    I don't think the German system for our HoC is complex, in fact I think it is amazingly intuitive and way better suited that the pure Westminster model which I would say tends to work better in non-federal/regional countries such as the UK (I guess it is quasi-federal now but anyway).
  439. Adam Whitman from Montreal, Canada writes:
    OUR NEW NATIONAL ANTHEM UNDER THE COALITION GOVERNMENT:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQV3uPqXrLo&feature;=related

    Adieu Canada!!!
  440. Jake ---- from Canada writes: Harper is Puppet for the global conservative agenda, which is to unite the world into one government. They are trying to do it with the Naorth American Union, once each continent has a free trade deal all continents will come together to form a one world government.

    Now thats a conspiracy theory, but each day it looks more true.
  441. J L from Toronto, Canada writes: Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes:..'the CPC will have more money than ever.'

    Great! Now maybe the CPC can invest in some vans with loud speaker (you know, the kind that dictators typically get), so the next time they are in power they could really spread their lies and deception. They can go up and down the street trying to convince us that we don't have a parliamentary democracy or that there is no global warming... you know, the CPC truth.
  442. The Wight from Canada writes: martha stewart:

    'The only thing that really united them was that threat to their party subsidies.'

    I really don't think that's true.

    Layton was pushing for a coalition back around election day, as we now know, and that was long before the CPC spending supplement was even created, let alone tabled.

    Maybe that pushed them over the top, maybe not, but I think this coalition has been in the works for longer than either of them are willing to admit.
  443. donald kennedy from Canada writes: The big flaw in the coalition plan is Dion. Really aprotem leader should be one with no longer term ambitions such as Manley was, in this case Ralph Goodale,a sound finance minister an an unexcitable anchor. Dion evokes a visceral turning away.
  444. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Joan Forsey - Here we go again. Wish you folks could get it straight. The central issue is actually that 62% of Canadians rejected Stephen Harper as a leader. Harper then proceeded to play the bully instead of getting down to the business of looking out for the best interest of Canadians. Now the opposition parties are doing their jobs by challenging Harper's ability to do his job. And Mr Harper, in true bully fashion, is crying foul because someone dared to stand up to him. I need to get some t-shirts made up saying all of this and sending them to these poor confused Conservatives who have things all wrong.
  445. Murdoch T. Bird from Canada writes: Funny to see the Conservative operatives out in force on these forums. You know something's off when you've got western separatists whining on the CBC site.

    Why are you trying to defend this guy, people?

    The biggest thing standng between you and a majority government right now is Harper.

    The guy will do anything for power, including trying to bankrupt his opponents so he won't have to fight them on credentials. He doesn't even listen to you, his supporters, or you wouldn't be in this mess.

    Take this opportunity to rid yourselves of this guy. Stop trying to defend the indefensible.
  446. Vern McPherson from Canada writes:
    When will harper fire the GG ???

    When will the yahoos call for her removal ??

    What part of the COns PR campaign will that be ??

    When does it start ??
  447. kevin o'connor from M'Chigeeng, Canada writes: All this pre scripted talks is nonsense. If they had been, the NDP, Liberals and Greens could have formed an alliance BEFORE the last election and had a majority now. I for one wish they had. From a political self interest point of view it would have been hard, but the math is easy; Run 200 or so liberals without green or NDP opponents, ditto for the NDP in 80 ridings, and the greens 25. Endless haggling over the exact numbers is possible, but if you chose which ridings to run which candidates with care you'd have a landlside reflective of the center left nature of our nation. Yes I know proportional representation would do the same thing but we don't have proportional representation. And you do it up front and let the voters decide, I don't think they would have minded one bit. As it stands the center left vote is fractured and we have 2 conservative minority governments in a row.
  448. Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Z M from Canada:

    a) That letter was rejected by the GG

    b) No formal coalition was ever actually discussed.

    A letter asking the GG to look at all options is still a long ways away from this silly coalition threatening Canada today.

    c) The Liberals were polling and planning to use any association with Bloc against the CPC if an election was called.

    The Liberals know exactly how Canadians feel about Quebec separatists and they were still dumb enough to move ahead in a coalition with them anyway.

    The LPC and NDP are going to get what's coming to them whenever the next election is held. It won't be pretty for them.
  449. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> anoni moose writes : 'it's quite normal to propose a coalition before an election in our type of democracy, or after an election during a minority government, It's rare that it actually happens as the right sset of circumstances and criteria have to be met.'
    ...

    There has only been ONE coalition in the history of Canada, it was during the first-world war, and there was a serious debate at the time over conscription.

    How does that compare to our situation now, where the only real item of contention is that of political funding, and advantage ?

    If you don't think the current economic crisis is as serious a problem as you can have without war, I don't know how you could miss that.

    The political funding cuts & the shackling of the public service were the catalyst for the diverse groups to begin talks. It is not their raison d'etre, that is the unprecedented crisis facing the world.
    Or if you prefer 'It's the economy stupid'.
  450. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: soup, what did your liberal MP say when you contacted him/her?

    Percy, never mind Jim, just send the money to McGuinty.
  451. C T from Canada writes: Soup Cambell... re: the sweater... touchee! And Will, I agree that many parallels can be drawn between Harper and Hitler. Remember that liberal commercial (during elections vs. Martin) when it accused Harper of using the military to suppress public dissent... Perhaps prescient?!?!
  452. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Spencer C from Canada wrote:
    I don't see what the relevance is of plans made by the former leader of a now defunct party.

    Spencer,
    The Tory party is not defunct ............
    ......... the cons just changed thier alias 4 times in the past 16 years.

    Were you whining when Stockwell Day was given a seat in cabinet ?
  453. AlbertaOilpatch is Great from Canada writes: This just in Harper, is actually a reptilan kitten eater from outer space or Darth vader in a blue sweater. We should have a new law banning blue sweaters. Wait Wait not just blue sweaters but the color blue entirely. Is indigo still blue.
  454. J L from Toronto, Canada writes: The GG has no choice.

    She must not allow Harper to hide from a confidence vote.

    If Harper looses a confidence vote and the opposition can form a government the GG MUST allow it!

    END of Story. That is our system of government!
  455. martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel writes: 'martha - See I think you're a blowhard because you think it's common sense that the coalition is dead.'

    That's your opinion. But my common sense and observations tell me that it is dead. I've been sayiong that for days now, ever since the subsidies to the parties issue was taken off the table. I'm surprised that it lasted this long.

    'I have no particular interest in J Trudeau but I do think it's strange that you levered him into a conversation...'

    I'm looking ahead. He just made a serious blunder.

    'Perhaps, again, you're not as interested in fact as you are in spreading misleading statements. Just a thought. ;-)'

    Reread my posts. I call it like I see it. If you want to show me something 'misleading' please do. And I already explained why it is obvious that the Bloc is an integral part of this coalition despite the cover story. Look who signed the agreement.

    And BTW, Soup Campbel, nothing personal but I prefer Knorr ;-)

    P.S. STAND BY!!! Harper will soon be on TV. Prepare to vent, hiss, throw stuffed animals at the screen. Its all very therapeutic.
  456. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Will, did you make that up all by yourself? Must be from TO.

    Oh, Oh, Fern has joined the fray. The drugs must have worn off.
  457. Zando Lee from Vancouver, Canada writes: ....just saw Wall on TV echoing the neocon talking points......hardly a surprise....as for our Grodo....poor guy is sh!tting bricks...with this court case thing happening, his pet Olympics spawning overruns, investigations and lawsuits..the provincial NDP nipping at his heels...and now his only suck-up bailout avenue is threatened by this proposed coalition...gee this is enough to drive one to drink.....
  458. c Blackstock from Ottawa, Canada writes: Beyond all of the political manoevring I want to know what happened to the 22 billion dollar surplus that was spent well before the fiscal crisis happened. This past week the government again told a group of First Nations children from Northern Ontario that they could not afford to give them a school to replace run down portable trailers that had been put in place after their school building became contaminated by a diesel fuel dump. If we can't afford safe schools that support children to learn then what exactly was the money spent on because I can see no group in society that is 22 billion dollars better off now than two years ago.
  459. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Fern suggested firing the GG. Can anyone be GG or do you have to be a female CBC employee?
  460. Paul Mullen from Canada writes: >> Soup Campbel writes 'the central issue is actually that 62% of Canadians rejected Stephen Harper as a leader'

    Actually 'soup' .. the PMs personal approval ratings were considerably higher than those of his party...

    As for our political system...

    People who say that we vote for MPs, not parties are denying the reality of our system, and discounting the votes of millions of Canadians who chose a party by electing that party's local candidate to represent them.

    Of course there are others who vote for different reasons, but parties have considerable power to control their mps, so the only way to truly elect an mp for their own merits is to elect an independent.

    So, in order to make an informed decision on voting day, we need to know which party line each mp will have to tow. If they don't tell us, they have misrepresented themselves, and should go back to the voters for new mandates.
  461. martha stewart from Canada writes: J L from Toronto writes: 'The GG has no choice.'

    True. But its not the way you wish it was. Harper will prorogue the House and the GG has no choice but to accept that.

    There is no precendent or compelling reason to do otherwise... despite all the furor.
  462. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Will, did you make that up all by yourself? Must be from TO.

    Oh, Oh, Fern has joined the fray. The drugs must have worn off.
    ------------------------------------------------------

    Hell, mine just kicked in...

    Yo Vern...The Moose is on the loose
  463. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud - Sorry I have no idea what you're getting at. I'm not as clever as you are.
  464. J L from Toronto, Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada writes...'True. But its not the way you wish it was. Harper will prorogue the House and the GG has no choice but to accept that....There is no precendent or compelling reason to do otherwise... despite all the furor'

    NOT SO... If the GG prorogues the House then she will be facilitating the PM's attempt to hide from a vote of confidence. It will be very hard for the GG to help the PM avoid a vote of confidence - that is the cornerstone of our political system.
  465. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes:
    Harper then proceeded to play the bully instead of getting down to the business of looking out for the best interest of Canadians. Now the opposition parties are doing their jobs by challenging Harper's ability to do his job. And Mr Harper, in true bully fashion, is crying foul because someone dared to stand up to him.
    -------

    Exactly;Thank You!!
    Conservatives and Liberals are not enemies; they are adversaries.
    I don't want a one party state under either one!!
    We need strong, honest and representative leadership on both sides as I demand clear and honest choice.

    The other parties don't count as they will never form a government but I will support and argue for their existence as I know I have been wrong before and reserve the right to change my mind.

    Cheers
  466. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: martha - See this tends to prove my point 'I've been sayiong that for days now' that you want to seem like you know everything. Unless you have psychic connections you don't know what will happen. Or maybe you can provide an explanation other than 'common sense'.
  467. john 'trillium boy' smith from Canada writes: @Spencer C from Canada writes: 'Wow some people are really missing the point.'

    like Harper promised less partisanship and focus on economy during election campaign - it also did not happen.

    cons, just dump him please and get somebody more moderate. it is very simple.
  468. Z M from Canada writes: Go Oilers Go! from Canada writes: Z M from Canada:

    a) That letter was rejected by the GG

    b) No formal coalition was ever actually discussed.

    A letter asking the GG to look at all options is still a long ways away from this silly coalition threatening Canada today.

    c) The Liberals were polling and planning to use any association with Bloc against the CPC if an election was called.

    The Liberals know exactly how Canadians feel about Quebec separatists and they were still dumb enough to move ahead in a coalition with them anyway.

    The LPC and NDP are going to get what's coming to them whenever the next election is held. It won't be pretty for them.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------

    PATHETIC!

    a) It's not about whether it was accepted...it's about what Steve Harper wanted, and that is clearly a coalition with the 'socialists and separatists'. Why else would he have sent that letter? Were there other serious options other than coalition or election (which he didn't want at that time obviously).

    b) The letter was signed by Harper, DUCEPPE AND LAYTON. Do you honestly think there was no discussion? Wow, are you THAT partisan that you can't see the obvious?

    c) Yup. The liberals would have done that....same thing as Harper is doing now.

    That was so weak, but at least you tried. Sort of.
  469. Offshore Reg from Bridgetown, Barbados, Canada writes: “Whether Canada ends up as one national government or two national governments or several national governments, or some other kind of arrangement is, quite frankly, secondary in my opinion.”
    Any idea who said that?

    You guessed correctly.....

    .....none other than on Stephen Harper, current Prime Minister of Canada.

    I cannot think of another Canadian Prime Minister or politician first, who would even think to make such a statement, let alone actually make it. Now this sanctimonious clown self-righteously wants to invoke the issue of ‘national unity’.

    What ‘unity’ is he talking about??? Would that be the unity of one nation???? two maybe???? Several perhaps???? ...or is it really secondary in his opinion.

    This guy has been given a free ride since he took over the Conservative party. He has proven he is no leader. It is really time for this character to simply leave and find another job.
  470. Harald Lotz from Brazil writes: What?!! Canadian politics more fun than the American version?!!
  471. mike sty the Coalition Centrist from Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel writes: 'martha - See I think you're a blowhard
    ---------------

    Bingo !!!!
  472. L B from Canada writes: bring on lies liberals,this is what happens when you lay with the dogs,this is more fun than watching Duceppe pretend nothing is bothering him, good-bye money,and Layton the snake trying to make him self look good,eh, bye the way where was Dion to-day,didn't see the muffin man,now liberals rally around your leader,where was he ? getting more pointers from the great one?ah I really feel for the three stooges, and can't forget jack the snake,and the new senator ms Elizabeth Mae,welcome to the misfit party,as you leave grab a few brown envelopes,and a few names for our new ad buddies.and most of all your going to need a lot of tissues and a place where you all can lay low,how about IRAG,you guys love action.
  473. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada writes: J L from Toronto writes: 'The GG has no choice.'

    True. But its not the way you wish it was. Harper will prorogue the House and the GG has no choice but to accept that.

    There is no precendent or compelling reason to do otherwise... despite all the furor.
    -----------------------------------------------
    According to some experts quoted today, the G.G. does have some wriggle room on that issue as well, mind you it is even more exacting than the parameters for allowing the coalition in the face of non confidence.

    Apparently it has to do with the avoidance of the house and the reasons for it. As I can find no Canadian reference, I think it may stem from the British House of Commons.
  474. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Paul Mullen - Sorry. To rephrase, 62% of Canadians didn't vote for Conservative MP's. Mr Harper got drunk on power that he didn't have. The Opposition stood up to him. Mr Harper got mad.
  475. steve allan from Canada writes: The Bloc is like the town flirt everY guy is trying to sleep with. I'm laughing hysterically at the shenanigans going on in Ottawa.

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
  476. Vern McPherson from Canada writes:
    Even the Blue Jays laid off 2 dozen employees today.

    We can't afford to wait around for 2 months - when another 100,000 Canadians or more lose their jobs - doing nothing while harper and fakerty fake something or other.

    Seems they want the 2 month delay so thay can hide whatevr is in the books. Hide their lies about how they cooked them. Make the situation to their political advantage.

    We already know flakerty cooked the books in Ontario and Ontario is still trying to straighten things out ........
  477. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: L B from Canada - Muffin Man? Jake the Snake? Misfit Party? We talking wrestling here? Or punk bands? You ok LB???
  478. gar gurr from Canada writes: In talking to my relatives across western Canada I hear the same message regardless of the outcome of this fiasco. Reform originally went to Ottawa with the motto 'We want In' It is obvious eastern Canada does not agree regardless and really do not think we in the west have the same courage as the BQ. It pays well as the BQ know.The only difference is that we in the west our motto is in english' We will Remember' It shames me to see that Liberals and NDP will trade their federalist roots in for power.This is the end of the federation even though many would disagree thanks to Dion who was once on the same side as Duceppe but will not admit it or will the Liberal press.
  479. BaB EmImE from Canada writes: ..//

    and if Mary Queen of Scots was successful in assassinating Elizabeth I, she would have Queen of England.

    ..//
  480. C Gardner from Canada writes: 'Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: C Gardner - Be careful who you call a liar. Creepy Steve and his cabinet have been responsible for some doozies. '

    I'm sure they have. They're politicians.
    Care to address Dion's campaign lie about not getting into bed with the NDP?
  481. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: soup, I realize you are not as clever. It was a trick question. There are no liberal MPs in Calgary!

  482. garlick toast from Canada writes: Funny how when the Bloq supported Harper, they were '' sovereigntistes'' but now they're '' separatistes''. Did they change? no.
  483. steve allan from Canada writes: The word making the rounds is that none other than the Minister of Justice, Rob Nicholson, is angry with Harper and thinking of abandoning ship.
  484. Kilgore Trout from So it goes, Canada writes: To Soup Campbel : The coalition is not dead, as they smell blood and won't let go and as they don't trust Harper, as well, why should any sane Canadian after all the promises to 'work with the other party' get broken nearly on day one and this last fiasco of denegrating the BLOC that is sure going to get them to help support him, no, sooner, possibly a bit later but not that much later, a vote of confidence is going to be held, the government will go down, and the Gov-Gen, as per Harper's 2004 own directions, will see if the opposition has a viable alternative government, see that they indeed have one via the coalition and voila...Dion is PM, all thanks to Harper, I doubt I will ever forgive him for that... all because he couldn't contain that nasty side of him that we always see in the house, seems blue sweaters only work during elections... and it could be why his numbers always went down when the house was in session...
  485. Vern McPherson from Canada writes:
    The GG is not a rubber stamp for the PM. That is not how a Parliamentary Democracy based on the Westminister model works.

    It's too bad the yahoos are ignorant of that fact.

    Besides all that ignorance Canadians are tired of harper's bullying and lies. Obviously he won't go gracefully so we'll have to throw the bum out ............
  486. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: 'Fern suggested firing the GG. Can anyone be GG or do you have to be a female CBC employee?'

    There are quite a few females at the CBC I would nominate. Plus one or two folks from CTV are suddenly available.

    I know what about Le Cardigan's ex spokeswoman?
  487. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud - Ah. Right you are. Or hahaha. Or you sure got me. You can just fill in whatever my response was supposed to be.
  488. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Fern, Blue Jays still have a team? Wow, and they still had employees? I thought baseball season was over.

    I understand TO also laid off a basketball coach today. Things are bad in TO.
  489. martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel writes: 'martha - See this tends to prove my point 'I've been sayiong that for days now' that you want to seem like you know everything.' I have been consistently saying that this coalition is dead, on these threads, for days now because that was my conclusion. Why? Because the only thing that united them was the threat to their party subsidies - that $1.95 per vote - and when that was gone, so was the only real glue that held them together. The LPC and the NDP have nothing else in common but their hate for Harper. The Bloc is helped by having Harper in power. Look what the Bloc just did. Duceppe announces that the coalition is great for PQ sovereignty and then Parizeau piles in. Now why do you think they might have done that? In the meantime, inside the LPC they're in the middle of a knife fight with Dion, the greatest loser in LPC history, as their 'leader.' And then there's the idea of NDP 'guidance' in this economy!!! I could go on but I won't. This coalition never had a chance. And now its dead. That's my opinion. By the next election there will be new leaders all around... except May, who thinks she is vital for the planet.
  490. Kilgore Trout from So it goes, Canada writes: To C Gardner: Yup, Dion flipped flopped, but then Harper promised to work with the other parties and flip flopped on that promise, several times so far, and in the house today he said his party never has slept with the BLOC, but we see in 2004 he did indeed, and in 2000, though that one he may not have been aware of, but given his fingers in all pots nature, I think he was well aware of it, the cover up of course begins... then of course, Income trusts never to be touched, cross his heart and hope to die, many many times, and then gone, lies, lies, lies, etc. as well, he is also a politician. Both need to go, Dion is already thankfully on the way out, Harper will soon follow. That Harper has basically made it a very real chance that Dion will be PM is reason enough to turf Harper don't you think?
  491. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: C Gardner from Canada writes: 'Care to address Dion's campaign lie about not getting into bed with the NDP?'

    Firstly, I haven't seen any tell all pics, so no proof yet.

    Secondly I think He meant Notre Dame Poutine.
    It may taste damn good, but you just can't get it out of the sheets.
  492. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: c'mon soup lighten up. You would think Cowtown was in a recession with that gloomy look on your face.
  493. garlick toast from Canada writes: The CPC is also a coalition party, Reformers and Progressive Conservatives.
  494. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: martha - You just sound jealous now: 'except May, who thinks she is vital for the planet'.
    But seriously, maybe you should get into politics. I'm sure you and your common sense would be a huge asset to the Conservative Party.
  495. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: moose, this getting into bed thing, is Dion or Jack on top?
  496. 1 2 from Canada writes: This nonsense will continue until Harper is removed.
  497. Jack About from Disbeelief, Canada writes: Wow, is the Globe just blatantly a left wing rag? What a crap article. Now unsigned unacted proposals by former party strategists are somehow relevant to today?

    This whole situation is retarded but it's quite funny. Flaherty has already promised the earliest budget in history (Jan.) because of the economy. That's not fast enough for the Coalition, the Goverment needs to commit to spending billions now! Just how many billion, err, gee, we need time to figure that out. LOL. B4 the election the Coaltion parties were crying for a balanced budget. Now they want massive deficit spending. LOL. Make up your mind.

    The Coaltion has lost confidence in Harper because 'no stimulus pkg' - I guess Layton kind of blew this lie with the conference call where he admits coalition discussions started way earlier.

    Does the majority of Canadians (MOC) really want to see and pay for massive handouts to the auto sector besides the auto industry?

    Does the MOC disagree with cutbacks to political parties and think this is a good reason to change the PM? (and incidentally the cuts would hit the Tories the worst)

    The Coalition of Failure - Let it happen. When it fails, it will just make it worse for the Liberals and NDP. This is Layton and Dion's end. They might actually stay in power for 6 months before we all go to the polls again. A premature election is written on the wall now, and this time it will be a Conservative majority because the MOC will never vote for these power first, Canada second leaders again.

    Harper needs to resign. LOL. The Coalition has made Layton, Dion and their parties look like desperate wannabe's. Canadians won't forget the leaders in waiting all support this Coabortion. In the 2009 election the MOC will be to embarrassed to vote Liberal or NDP.
  498. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: EJ
    Them being politicians, if together with Gilles dropping in now & then?
    My guess is they can only talk about it and eat the poutine.

    Now throw in a taxpayer or two and watch the sparks fly.
  499. Raymond Leronowich from Qualicium Beach, Canada writes: Stockwell had taken a tumble off his jet ski which led to this twisted offer. Cut Harper some slack we all know Leopard's can change their spots. Or can they????
  500. mike sty the Coalition Centrist from Canada writes:
    How many LIES will Harper make in his resignation speech this evening ????

    1) 10

    2) 25

    3) 40
    (please note these numbers are for the whole speech, not per minute)(I hope)

    4) None
    (Bet a lot of people from Alberta pick this one)

    5) Tooooooo many to count.

    Now ...............be Honest.
  501. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: I had to laugh when CTV news (Conservative Tunnel Vision) show L'Empereur being cheered at Sussex drive. The commentator remarked that they were mostly Conservatives staffers who would lose there jobs if Harper fell....
  502. Offshore Reg from Bridgetown Barbados, Canada writes: “Whether Canada ends up as one national government or two national governments or several national governments, or some other kind of arrangement is, quite frankly, secondary in my opinion.”

    Any idea who said that?

    You guessed correctly.....

    .....why, none other than on Stephen Harper, current Prime Minister of Canada.

    I cannot think of another Canadian Prime Minister or politician first, who would even think to make such a statement, let alone actually make it. Now this sanctimonious clown self-righteously wants to invoke the issue of ‘national unity’. What ‘unity’ is he talking about??? Would that be the unity of one nation???? two maybe???? Several perhaps???? ...or is it really secondary in his opinion.

    This guy has been given a free ride since he took over the Conservative party. He has proven he is no leader. It is really time for this character to simply leave and find another job.
  503. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Just read on the broadcast blog that Jack now calls it a proposed coalition. Jack and Dion have to share the 10 minute response to Steve. Jack is pouting.
  504. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: moose, this getting into bed thing, is Dion or Jack on top?

    ------
    It's with Canada in the middle.
    Regardless it's always Canada in the middle.

    But, Only one says He Loves us.

    Cheers
  505. garlick toast from Canada writes: Jack About from Disbeelief, Canada writes: Wow, is the Globe just blatantly a left wing rag? What a crap article. Now unsigned unacted proposals by former party strategists are somehow relevant to today?

    -------------

    Yup, the G&M; is so left wing that they officially endorsed Harper before the last election.
  506. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: Jack About - Seriously what is it with you Conservative zealots that right off the bat you start in with the really dumb pet names like The Coalition of Failure? It's not funny or witty or cool or accurate or anything really except corny. Just more hot air and sarcastic name-calling...this is what passes among zealots as rational argument.
  507. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Dion is late with the tape.
  508. Soup Campbel from Calgary, Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud - Is he? Hahaha. That's hilarious. I hear Harper is limp.
  509. anoni moose from Ozoneville, Canada writes: Soup
    In the spirit of conciliation, perhaps all the party leaders could get together and make maple fudge.

    The CBC can make a documentary.
  510. C Gardner from Canada writes: Kilgore Trout (great handle BTW), I somewhat agree that Harper's beligerance IS a problem here. A looming crisis in the economy is no time to be poking political enemies with a stick (the funding thing). That said though, this coalition was in the works long before the funding poke that supposedly set this off. There's a couple of things I believe though. While legal, and constitutional and all, I don't believe a time of shaky investor confidence is really the time for a coaltion gov't with a lame duck leader. I also believe that Canadians did elect a Conservative minority government, not a coalition. My opinion only.
    Ideal situation? Grown ups running things on all sides. I would prefer to see a negotiated budget, which would take cooperation and some give and take, on all sides. Probably not gonna happen though. We humans seem to thrive on us vs. them, as evidenced here.
  511. Peter Francis from Vancouver, Canada writes: Ok, I've seen and heard enough now. Stockwell Day is a senior member of this corrupt government. We know longer have trust in this government. This government must resign or it must stand and face the vote on Monday.

    I am sure there are a few decent and honorable Conservative MP's will do the right thing and abstain. They would begin to re-store faith in this party and begin a fresh clean right of center party.

    Peter Lahay
    Vancouver
  512. Gossipy Busybody from Canada writes: This is an extremely funny story, when you consider Harper's 'we will never allow the separatists...' line this evening.

    Worst speech ever. Sounded like he thought he needed to talk to a bunch of not-too-bright kids.

    Sorry, Harper old man -- we're smart enough to see through your BS.
    All the parties, at one time or another, have cooperated with the Bloc. Period.
  513. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Peter Francis from Vancouver, Canada writes: Ok, I've seen and heard enough now. Stockwell Day is a senior member of this corrupt government. We know longer have trust in this government. This government must resign or it must stand and face the vote on Monday.
    ----
    Personally I would accept an apology and a binding promise to work toward the protection and not the destruction of democracy.

    A promise of Him taking a refresher course on how minority governments work would also be nice.

    Cheers
  514. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Dion is late, doing ten retakes.
  515. Duncan Morris from Salmon Arm, Canada writes: Mr Harper by throwing his hand grenade in the house has alienated his party in Quebec and has exposed the old 'yahoos' from the bigoted Reform Party. I loved seeing Stockwell Day in the photo with Gilles Duceppe after hearing him on 'As it Happens' last night condemning Gilles as the devil 'separatist' and the Governor General as a complicit 'separatist'. You have to admit that since these hillbillies have entered the fray even the Republicans are moved to watch Canadian politics.
    This morning on the current a political scientist referred to Harper as a 'bully kicking sand in the face of Stephan Dion once too often' finally the bully was hit back and he doesn't know what to think about it! The coalition may be the next evolution in politics and anything that unites even a small part of the political process sounds good to me.
  516. Gossipy Busybody from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Dion is late with the tape.

    --- Try not to be an idiot. First he had to listen to Harper. Then write and record a response.

    I wonder why Harper didn't go live, like Paul Martin did in 2004. I suspect he was worried his blue sweater mask might slip off and he'd start spewing venom...
  517. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes:
    Harper , as usual, says nothing.

    Just like his economic statement.

    Just like his platform.
  518. Gossipy Busybody from Canada writes: garlick toast from Canada writes: Funny how when the Bloq supported Harper, they were '' sovereigntistes'' but now they're '' separatistes''. Did they change? no.
    ---- Actually, garlic, he uses 'separatists' in english, and 'sovereigntists' in french, so that he can load up the meaning here in english canada, and calm it down in quebec.
    But fortunately, CBC saw through the ruse & called him on it.
    Over at the Conservative Television Network, they probably haven't noticed...
  519. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Fern, soup, your guy did not show.
  520. Jack About from Disbeelief, Canada writes: To: Soup Campbel from Calgary,

    Seriously what is it with you Liberal zealots that right off the bat take offense to names like The Coalition of Failure? It's only you who doesn't thinks it's not funny or witty or cool or accurate or anything really except corny. Just more hot air and sarcastic name-calling...this is what passes among Liberal zealots as rational argument.

    P.S. I prefer calling it the 'Coabortion Government' as opposed to 'Coalition of Failure'
  521. Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .

    What ON EARTH?

    Mr. Dion cannot even get his tape to the CTV on time to be broadcast?

    And Mr. Dion expects to be taken seriously as a responsible leader?

    LAUGH OUT LOUD!

    It is really not so hard to get a videotape delivered on time, Mr. Dion!

    And you failed!

    What an embarrassment on the world stage!

    Perhaps Dion should instead seek to lead some banana republic somewhere!

    .

  522. Will Cardinal from Nanaimo, BC, Canada writes: Hello Quebec: Please pay no attention to the comments of the nearly deposed Prime Minister! He doesn't speak for the majority of Anglo (etc.) Canadians! I'm fairly sure he doesn't speak for any of you, anymore! How do you say Arrogant in French? My personal opinion, which is only that, is that this coalition will finally (since Mr. Trudeau) represent the majority of all Canadians, not just the self serving and well off. Steven will fit right in with Joe and Brian in the rogues gallery of prime ministers who are now poster(old)boys for the Me First Club! We can only hope that there are no fresh skeletons hiding in the Conservative Closet!
  523. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes:
    CTV?

    Who watches that crap network?

    CBC had no trouble broadcasting an important speech instead of a filler show.
  524. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Will, Nanaimo , Stevie speaks for me. It seems Dion cannot even speak.
  525. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Is Dion getting even with CTV for his 10 outakes a few months ago?
  526. Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .

    Honesty Policy dude, face reality, dude!

    It was Mr. Dion who was responsible for ensuring his videotape was delivered on time to Canada's major TV stations, including the CTV which broadcast live to the world on its internet site.

    And Mr. Dion failed at that simple task!

    Laugh out loud!

    The world was watching, and where was Mr. Dion's videotape?

    Oops - Mr. Dion failed to deliver it on time!

    Mr. Dion is an embarrassment tonight to the internet-watching world and is unworthy of leading the great country of Canada.

    Seriously, what ON EARTH?

    Mr. Dion cannot even get his tape to the CTV on time to be broadcast?

    And Mr. Dion expects to be taken seriously as a responsible leader?

    LAUGH OUT LOUD!

    It is really not so hard to get a videotape delivered on time, Mr. Dion!

    And you failed!

    What an embarrassment on the world stage!

    Perhaps Dion should instead seek to lead some banana republic somewhere!

    .
  527. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes: CTV is like FOX news.

    Slanted.

    Their 'hill' reporter is a conservative shill.
  528. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Jack About from Disbeelief, Canada writes:
    Seriously what is it with you Liberal zealots that right off the bat take offense to names like The Coalition of Failure? It's only you who doesn't thinks it's not funny or witty or cool or accurate or anything really except corny. Just more hot air and sarcastic name-calling...this is what passes among Liberal zealots as rational argument.
    -------
    Because of Harper we don't know yet if it will fail; at this stage it is only your assumption;

    You do know what they say about assumptions; right?

    Cheers
  529. Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .

    Honesty Policy dude, that 'plop plop' sound you are hearing...

    ... is the sound of egg falling from Mr. Dion's face down onto the floor...

    ... and down on the floor is how low Mr. Dion's embarrassing performance was tonight, the man failing even to get his videotape delivered on time.

    Laugh out loud!

    And nothing you gripe about CTV is going to help Mr. Dion with his failure there on the world stage - the man failed!

    .
  530. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes:
    CTV failed.
  531. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .
    Mr. Dion with his failure there on the world stage - the man failed!

    -
    Mr. Dion is now the greatest failure on the world stage.

    You must be either from Texas, Alberta or good friends with Bush
  532. C T from Canada writes: With respect to this coalition and the Bloc's support. Canadians and the Quebecois are working together on shared principles!

    Lets see if the GG is true to her word: '...the time of two solitudes is over...'

    Harper's address was a 'sad spectacle' indeed.
  533. G L from Thunder Bay Ont, Canada writes: Plot what Plot? a blank typed letter with no signatures.some 8 years old The mouth piece for the Separatist Liberal NDP Coalition is stretching it a little I think.Where's the transcript of the NDP Caucus meeting where Mr I am a separatist lover Layton gleefully proclaimed Separatists in Quebec are good for Canada. GOOD for CANADA? I guess if your a separatist supporter they are or if your counting on their support to prop up you Coalition
  534. Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .

    Garibaldi, do not shove your made-up words in my mouth.

    Contrary to your post, I never said 'Mr. Dion is now the greatest failure on the world stage'.

    What Mr. Dion is is the greatest CANADIAN failure on the world stage tonight.

    And yes, every country has its own failures that fail to do needed actions, such as, um, making sure their videotape gets delivered on time to the news stations so that they do not embarrass themselves for all the world to see...

    .
  535. Ray L from Vancouver, Canada writes: All you bible thumping Cons in Alberta who don't like what you read in the Globe - go whine to National Post readers. Oh wait - there aren't any.
  536. C T from Canada writes: Can't we all just get along?!?!
  537. Tom Willette from Niagara Falls, Canada writes: There may have been discussions between the various forms of the conservative party and the Bloc but they never came to fruition or we would still be governed by the Liberals because the majority of Canadians would have made them pay at the next election. If this coalition goes through the Liberals are going to find this out.
  538. Will Cardinal from Nanaimo, BC, Canada writes: Thank you Soupy!! It's reassuring to know that not everyone on this continent is into some born-again judge-mental-ism, thinking they must save the rest of us from ourselves! This is where arrogance seems to blossom! Since 'you're not one of us, you must be wrong'! All my life (60yrs) I've witnessed this attitude! The other observation I'd share is the 'short term memory syndrome'! It hasn't been that long since Mulroney, and geeze, he just keeps kreeping back into the headlines! How can you forget? Now here's a Conservative who thinks he's earned the 'right' to badmouth Mr. Trudeau! They don't learn much, the arrogant, but boy, can they find the faults of others, actual or imagined! .... bassicwill
  539. L B from Canada writes: no the speech didn't change my thoughts I still say lib/ndp goodbye,what a bunch of B.S. I don't trust them,when the liberals were in last time,strange but they did not help certain provinces out, and i do not like the way they run government, surplus, I wonder how they got that, oh i know with all there cut backs, back room deals, no thanks.
  540. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    The GG should tell Harper to stop running and hiding ..............

    Harper dared the opposition to move non-confidence just 4 months ago and now all the Harperites are scared they will ............
  541. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: It was amusing listening to Layton begging for tv time away from dion. More amusing hearing dion talk about an NDP-Lib coalition , no mention of the block. Even though the lib-dip seat count is useless without the bloc. A partner when its convenient, a stranger when its not.
  542. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Will, how are things in Naniamo? You sound agitated. Go look at the ocean, have a pint. Your coalition sure bombed tonight. The only honest one was Gilles who said he will take all he can get for Quebec, Canada be damned.
  543. Doris Wrench Eisler from St. Albert, Canada writes: The scheming, the lying, the hypocrisy. But who is surprised? Still, it takes something for Flaherty to make the pious assertion he'd rather make a deal with the devil (than with Gilles Duceppe and the Bloc). Come to think of it, he probably has made such a deal, non-figuratively speaking; how else could such a mediocrity have attained his present position?
  544. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Tom Willette from Niagara Falls wrote:
    There may have been discussions between the various forms of the conservative party and the Bloc but they never came to fruition or we would still be governed by the Liberals because the majority of Canadians would have made them pay at the next election. If this coalition goes through the Liberals are going to find this out.

    Tom,
    Its the Tories that will pay.

    Thats why all those Tory staffers were out on the streets of Ottawa demonstrating today .............
    ............ they are about to lose their jobs along with Harper
  545. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Will C writes : 'Since 'you're not one of us, you must be wrong'! '

    Will - I would say you just coined the coalition of the unwilling (43 walks and then stand up for handouts) new catch phrase.
  546. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Tyler Williams from seattle, United States writes: .
    What Mr. Dion is is the greatest CANADIAN failure on the world stage tonight.
    --------
    That Dion is a failure; I agree; He has served a purpose
    That Dion is a failure in Canada 'tonight' I'm sure some will agree
    That Dion is the greatest Canadian some remotely might agree
    But that Mr. Dion is is the greatest CANADIAN failure on the world stage tonight I don't; Harper has yet not allowed it.

    Cheers
  547. Garry BC from Canada writes: smiley capt beaver was interesting.........In nov i told the Pm to do this ...and that... yadda yadda yadda......and suddenly its a proposed coalition as well my gawd is this man full of himself or what? ..oh and also he has vulunteered his whole caucus to GG should she need them....... is this rich or what?
  548. Garry BC from Canada writes: coalition of 3 ......er 2 ......er then there was one... smiley capt beaver jack bin layton
  549. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Sleazy jack says today that the coalition is just a proposal - thats why he should get air time. Yesterday they were glad handing with separatists saying they had a deal. Is it a deal or a proposal? What are you today lefty? A dip or a lib or a pqst or a coalitionist or just whatever the hell will get your left wing ideas put in play. All you would give us is separatists in the senate and a 24B dollar deficit to give money to dead industries. Canada would thank you by putting the nail in your coffin.
  550. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Gilles said, 'this deal is good for the separatist cause'. Translation - good for the breakup of Canada. Wow, and all you liberals and dippers still think this is a marriage made in heaven.
  551. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: the only hope for kanada now is for the three not-so-wisemen to step down and call on Julian,Ricky,and Bubbles to lead us out of the wilderness .....
  552. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: Ej... at least gille was honest about his intentions....
  553. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Gille is right. This is great for Quebec's cause. My hat off to Duceppe for taking these two idjits down the garden path.

    Senators in the senate and 24 billion of debt - whats not to like about this fiasco.

    Gille, best of luck, I hope you guys are gone by this time next year. Only when this country realizes its splinterd and regionalized will we be able to move forward. Confederation of Canada with four nations independent of each other - west - quebec - ontario - east.
    Viva la separation. Viva la coalition.
  554. Richard in Burlington from Canada writes: is there a signed copy available? didn't think so.
  555. Henry Slofstra from Waterloo, Canada writes: What's the issue? What substantial idea of the NDP/ Liberals/ BQ has been thwarted, to establish non-confidence in the govt? Don't tell me they would destroy the country for a now-withdrawn party funding proposal.
  556. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Gilles said, 'this deal is good for the separatist cause'. Translation - good for the breakup of Canada. Wow, and all you liberals and dippers still think this is a marriage made in heaven.
    ---------

    I'm still trying to figure out:
    Are you guys against it because it may work
    or
    Are you guys gainst it because it may fail??

    Personal I think to want to take over in these troubled waters they are either crazy or have as per Hillary; testicular fortitudes.

    Cheers
  557. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: you think there might be a tar and feathering tonight at lib headquarters?
  558. L M87 from Calgary, Canada writes: The gauntlet has been laid. The Coalition has a plan. The onus is on Harper to counter with a plan for the continuation of Parliament through these tough times. The next year will be vital and Harper has offered no plan to demonstrate that he is capable of uniting Parliament for an extended period of time.

    I think the same argument holds for proroguing the government. What evidence does Harper have that he can make Parliament work? If we are dealing with the same political questions January 21 instead of December 8, then what was the point of the wait other than to delay political help for the economy.

    An election is out the window. There is no evidence that an election would result in different results. It looks like a waste of cash and even more importantly time. With the holidays around the corner and the mandatory wait period for holding an election, what are we looking at here... 8 weeks plus the added time until Parliament sits. We're getting into spring here people. I don't know about you but I'd like a political body in place during this economic crisis.
  559. Still Learning at 78 from Canada writes: Under the constitution the coalition is a perfectly legal instrument to protect the citizens from a runaway leader. Case closed. Get over it Harper, you made your bed now sleep in it.
  560. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Garry BC, yes he was the only honest one amongst the troika. Does this mean Canadians should embrace good old Gilles while he blackmails and robs us blind?
  561. Honesty is the best Policy from Canada writes: One thing Harper's histrionics in the house and his speech tonight mean Zero votes for the Cons in Quebec in the next election.
  562. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: L M87, what plan? The plan that Gilles blackmails and robs us blind and then says see ya later suckers.
  563. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Honesty - a lot more votes in the ROC. The first leader in decades to tell the separatists to get stuffed.
  564. Doug R from Toronto, Canada writes: Unfortunate that so many of the comments made by 'average Canadians' on sites like this are so similar to the the angry and abusive stances that we condemn in our politicians. I guess the apple doesn't fall very fall from the tree.

    I've been a Progressive Conservative - I dined with the House Leader, and met Joe Clark several times, who I admired greatly. I have also been a Liberal, and although I only spoke with Jean Chretien a few times, I had the good fortune to know some of his advisors. And of course, in politics, there will be hidden agendas, manipulation, control. These people aren't monsters. They passionately believe that it is their duty to do everything possible to give us their vision of the country. And sometimes, to stick it to the other guy. And there has been lots of sticking, by all. It is the nature of the type of personality that is drawn to the political game. Some of us create, build, invent, others prefer a less adventurous life as smaller cogs in larger corporations, and others prefer an argumentative life in politics.

    But one way to look at the current situation is this - a Conservative government promotes one agenda. A Coalition will be far more likely to reflect many voices, because it must in order to survive.
  565. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: quite a day..........a calm fuzzy Pm.........then a late and outta focus whatdoyoucallit ......an alley cat holding a piggy bank......and last and least wind up toy .......walking away from the cameras........gawd am i glad the americans pay us no attention........easy pickings if they could find us on their maps
  566. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: my gawd doug how many coats you got in your closet???
  567. John Doe from Canada writes: I find it hilarious that so many of the CON supporters are accusing the Globe and Mail of a pro-Coalition bias. THE PAPER ENDORSED HARPER A MERE 8 WEEKS AGO!!! FOR THE SECOND TIME!!!
  568. Mr. Justice from Anytown, Canada writes: As the right-wing loonies have pointed out (see above) . . . it's 'different' if conservatives are doing the coalition-building with the Bloc.

    It just . . . IS . . . DIFFERENT.

    What don't you godless heathen libruls understand about all of this ?
  569. Peasinour Thyme from Edmonton, Canada writes: What I would like is for the GG to demur her decision until Monday evening, by which time she will also receive the formal request to form a coalition on the basis of non-confidence in Harper.

    Then, on the basis of receipt of the Coalition's request she can take one additional night to weigh the two alternatives together.

    Then she can come to us with her decision.

    To only entertain Harper's request and nullify the Coalition's opportunity to express their non-confidence, she will not be able to best serve Canadians.
  570. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: mr justice ......you forgot to add...........fargin bastages........
  571. martha stewart from Canada writes: Poor Dion. First his tape was late and then he was out of focus.

    Did Iggy's people handle it 'for' him?
  572. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Doug from TO. Joe Clark- the biggest disaster in Canadian politics. Brian ate his lunch. Chretien the most deceitful politician in history. Great buddies of yours. Now you promote the coalition which is beholding to Gilles and the separatists. Thank goodness the PC party aka liberal lite has disappeared.
  573. Garry BC from livingunderthecloudoftommydouglas'sghost, Canada writes: ive been reading and writting comments here since the weekend.......noticed one
    common thing......a lot of names with Calgary in their tag spouting liberal/ndp crap....since you can count all the liberals in Calgary on one hand and there are no ndp.........where are you people writting from???
  574. Jean Bon from Val des bois, Martinique writes: vive le Bloc!

    Duceppe is actually the best leader out of the 4 leaders.
    Too bad coalition isn't putting him as new PM :)

    Vive le Québec! Nous l'aurons notre pays :)
  575. Geoff Day from Canada writes: Paul Tooker from Canada writes: The Separatists can go to H3LL. Canada does not need the Bloc and what they represent.

    Apparently the Mr Harper has not always agreed with you Paul. He used their support many times in the past two years; wrote to the GG with them in a potential coalition in 2004 etc. etc.

    Interesting how he has changed his view in the last week or so.

    Of course he was very careful in his broadcast tonight to call the Bloc sovereignists when speaking in French but separatists in English.

    So what can ordinary Canadians surmise about the PM's statements and current comments in terms of sincerity and honesty?
  576. Doug R from Toronto, Canada writes: Just one coat Gary - and it's a thoughtful one. I'd be rather embarassed to stay with the same party for decade after decade, just because they have the same name.

    I saw characteristics in the members and policies of the Liberals in the late 1970s-early 1980s that I couldn't agree with. Now many of those characteristics seem more predominent in the Conservative party of 2008. I'd rather offer my support based on what facts I can find time to read and understand, rather than based on images and logos.
  577. Hendrick Larose from Canada writes: What's the Alliance got to do with the current situation. If the argument is that it didn't work then and the coalition shouldn't work now, I agree.
  578. Peasinour Thyme from Edmonton, Canada writes: A lot of unjustified fear out there tonight.

    The Cons are really playing up the Bloc card. It is typical, but so distasteful and disrespectful.

    Just keep hammering out the party line, with no thought or conscience.

    If you had been at Jamestown, you would have passed around the Kool-aid to the innocents, even though many of you would have known not to drink it yourselves.

    What a shameless bunch.

    Canada is a beautiful and great country. Canadians deserve a better government than Stephen Harper and his Reform/Alliance/(and almost Bloc!) cronies masquerading as Conservatives can offer us.
  579. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: It's too bad none of the CON drones on these boards or our PM Harper understand even basic constitutional law or Canadian parliamentary democracy. 1) In previous history (1926), the Governor General rejected an election request BY THE LIBERALS because an election was held merely 8 months ago - the Conservatives were allowed to form government. READ ABOUT IT BELOW: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King-Byng_Affair The recently elected minority Liberals lost the parliamentary majority. Then the Conservatives were asked to govern and faced a vote of confidence. They lost the confidence vote by 1 vote and only THEN was an election called. IE the precedent is that in a very newly elected minority government, if the ruling party is unable to establish the confidence of a majority of the house. The opposition is allowed to form government and must face a vote of confidence - which failing - will trigger an election, but which succeeding will result in a new Prime Minister. 2) According to the constitution, a majority in the house of commons is needed in order to govern. It's got NOTHING to do with which single party has the most seats if you can't establish a majority. It's which party or parties have the MAJORITY support of parliament and the leader of that party is the PM. Therefore, Harper can't be the PM. So all of you save your crying and whining. From the perspective of the law, the precedent has been established and the LAW is what matters - not any of your OPINIONS. As well, the fact that people keep saying that 60% did or did not vote for dion. The fact is that the people who didn't vote for Harper (who are the majority of Canadians) have a lot more in common than those who did vote for Harper. The NDP, Liberals, and Greens (who have backed the coalition) have more of the popular vote than the Conservatives. Therefore, the coalition has electoral and legal merit.
  580. The Bull from Canada writes: 'The Alliance lawyer involved in the talks says he acted alone'

    i suppose that's just a minor detail to everyone with 'Harper-Derangement Syndrome', eh?

    hilarious.
  581. martha stewart from Canada writes: Soup Campbel writes: 'martha - You just sound jealous now: 'except May, who thinks she is vital for the planet'.'

    What? Sorry Soup but you're not making any sense here. The only person who might be 'jealous' of Elizabeth is Dion or some wannabe Sumo wrestler.

    'But seriously, maybe you should get into politics. I'm sure you and your common sense would be a huge asset... '

    Maybe. Our cat, dog and one of our chickens formed a coalition against us the other day when we were a little slow to feed them but once we did, we knew it wouldn't last. Even though a mouse, which was hoping for some scraps, supported them.

    Same for the Three Stooges Coalition, with the opportunistic Greens.

    R.I.P.

  582. bob saunders from Belleville, ON, Canada writes: Still Learning at 78 from Canada writes: Under the constitution the coalition is a perfectly legal instrument to protect the citizens from a runaway leader. Case closed. Get over it Harper, you made your bed now sleep in it. ------------------------ you are absolutely correct if they are voting on a budget otherwise forget it. As far as whether another election would make a difference- lets find out. Since both the Liberals and NDP said no to a coalition throughout their campaign what would they say that would be believable. Run as a coalition during an election and see what happens- perhaps the ABH crowd might win this time. Glad I only have 2 years left in this country before I retire to a warm banana republic- that is far more a democracy than Canada.
  583. The Centrist from Canada writes: I plead with people to stop with the bashing of the west and the bashing of Quebec.

    This is what Harper wants. He wants to divide us, and will use any means to attain power. Ditto for Dion.
  584. Still Learning at 78 from Canada writes: Why does Harper think he is at war, he is a minority government, but he is causing more damage to the citizens then anything anyone has seen in the last 100 years. Get over it Mr Harper.
    Under the constitution the coalition is a perfectly legal instrument to protect the citizens from a runaway leader. Case closed. Get over it Harper, you made your bed now sleep in it.
  585. J M from Calgaristan, Canada writes: I like Mr. Williams idea that Dion and Layton should refuse to give a single penny to anything in any riding that voted for the criminal conservative element. Harper has siphoned off the wealth of the country solely for the benefit of his supporters. Vote Conservative and your road gets paved. It's time for payback but lets go further and stop funding hospitals and the like in these ridings until the $50 billion/yr subsidy that Harper gives Big Oil and his friends is paid off. What's a few less rednecks other than house cleaning.
  586. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Peas, were you lucky enough to vote in Edmonton-Strathcona?
    How would you interpret Gilles stating that the deal was good for the separatist cause.
  587. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: A suggestion that a coalition could be considered is a long way from a signed coalition. Although whats up with sleazy jack - yesterday he said they had a signed deal, today its a proposal. Yesterday he was a dip and thot the libs were evil - today hes a dip. Dion talks of a coalition of the ndp-lib. He does not mention the bloc when its inconvenient. If it was the dip-libs only he would be toast. Either your in a coalition of three or you're not.

    Sleazy and dion say that will enter the hoc with a feeling of cooperation and then is caught on tape admitting he has been scheming since the election was over.

    Lies - lies - separtists in the senate and 24 billion debt. Sounds like a great deal sleazy.
  588. Peasinour Thyme from Edmonton, Canada writes: Woops, I was referring earlier to the infamous 1978 'Jonestown' tragedy. I wrote 'Jamestown' by mistake, but I believe Kool-aid is safe to drink there.

    The the analogy still holds, though. Conservatives are still deceitful, and their pitchers have lots of Kool-aid left.

    (pun totally intended)
  589. Will Cardinal from Nanaimo, BC, Canada writes: Since this is as close as we get to having a say, do you think we should refrain from repeating ourselves? And, if you have to disguise your identity, it kind of invalidates your point, like the KKK pretending to stand for something! This fiasco, in my opinion, is the result of voting/thinking 'Party' politics. Choosing a label over a personality makes no sense! We just keep bouncing back and forth like a ping pong ball, complaining about the other side of the net and then ooops, there we are in the opposite court, complaining again! Multi party coalitions would offer us opportunities for positive growth that the 2 party system we have can't, and please don't tell me it isn't! The system is weakening because it isn't a good system! One leader, how often does that lead to embarrassment or disappointment! Look next door, same story! Maybe this time it'll be better for them! When is it our turn to have a great leader? Maybe we need to devise a new system that doesn't need 'one'!!
  590. snow lander from Edmonton, Canada writes: Tooker - the Bloc are NOT members of the coalition. They only agreed to support a Liberal-NDP coalition. You know sort like the way they supported Harper and the CPC in 2006-2008. No different. Except the egomaniac of a PM we now have will have to sit across the floor in parliament.
  591. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: JM, so now paving roads and building hospitals is a federal responsibiity.
  592. pole cat from Canada writes: Hey any of you liberals in here lose a cellphone with a built in camera cased in a brown bag.
  593. Warron yu from Canada writes:

    Some Seperatist!
    Duceppe spoke to the MODEL North American Parliment held in Quebec City hall this spring. (fina-nafi.org)

    Fact is Jack Layton spoke there as well. (although his website omits this appearance.)

    Speakers at the meeting this year include Former Premier of Québec, Pierre Marc Johnson, Leader of the Bloc Québécois Gilles Duceppe, Dr. Ruby Dhalla Member of Parliament (Liberal Party) Member of the Canada-United States Interparliamentary Group, and Jack Layton, Leader of the New Democratic Party....

    http://www.infowars.net/articles/may2008/270508Integration.htm
  594. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: snow, how can they not be members? Without their vote the lib/dippers could not pass any legislation.
  595. Warron yu from Canada writes: The board of directors of NAFI includes Stephen Blank, a member of the Council on Foreign Relations and Robert Pastor, vice chairman of the CFR Task Force on North America and professor and director of the Center for North American Studies at American University.

    Pastor has previously testified before the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations on the idea of merging the United States, Mexico and Canada in a North American union stretching from Prudhoe Bay to Guatemala.

    Pastor, one of the architects of the plan for a regional government, has also authored a book titled 'Toward a North American Community,' and speaks at confabs in front of governmental officials, promoting the adoption of the amero as a common monetary currency to replace the dollar and the peso.

    In his role at the CFR, Pastor oversaw the publication of the 2005 CFR document called 'Building a North American Community' which bragged that its recommendations are 'explicitly linked' to SPP. The document called for establishing a 'common perimeter' around North America by 2010, the development of a biometric North American border pass, and the adoption of a North American tariff.'
  596. John Doe from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: How would you interpret Gilles stating that the deal was good for the separatist cause.
    _______________________________

    Political posturing that allows the Party to justify its continued existence. It feeds the base, just like Harper is doing with his base by wratching up separatist fears. Duceppe will fight for his base in Parliament, but he has no intention of actually leading a separation.

    What's shameful, as another poster mentioned, is the stoking of regional divisions at a time when we need to be working together as Canadians. Give the Coalition a chance before branding them anti-Western and stop stoking separatist anxieties. Inciting fear and loathing for any one group of Canadians does not show the true, inclusive leadership we need right now.
  597. david gates from Toronto, Canada writes: Sounds like some kind of joke. News Bulltin: The Liberals won the 2000 election with a majority. There could be no alternative government. The Canadian Alliance does not exist anymore. Day is not a Leader of any party. Harper was not involved with the CA until he ran for Leader in 2002.

    In other breaking news, Progressive Leader Thomas Crerar and Conservative Leader Arthur Meighen met secretely to discuss their favourite type of brandy yesterday...
  598. Mike Horner from Canada writes: An Open Letter sent to the Governor General:

    Excellency;

    I am writing to you out of concern for the current confidence crisis in the Canadian Parliament. It appears probable that you may be called upon to resolve the growing dispute between the Canadian federal political parties. As a mature and knowledgable Canadian citizen, I appeal to you to give careful consideration to the risks associated with the options you consider, and in particular, to consider that, if asked to prorogue parliament, a favourable decision may establish a very damaging precedent which will enable all future governments to evade clear expressions of non-confidence by preventing confidence votes. I value our Canadian parliamentary system, with its traditions and practices. A majority of parliamentarians have expressed their lack of confidence publicly, and must certainly be given the opportunity to express this in the house. The recently elected government has not withstood a real test of confidence as yet. Our system does not place party allegiances above the importance of securing majority support from elected members. Arguments which would encourage you to permit this present prime minister to prevent a confidence vote on his finance minister's economic statement, which he himself introduced as a matter of confidence, seem to rely upon a logic that favours the will of a minority of the members of parliament over the majority, due to their party affiliations. These arguments hint at two classes of parliamentarians, a view which cannot be permitted to prevail, in particular when it disenfranchises the majority of Canadians. I implore you to not allow this logic to prevail. I fear it will irreparably impair the traditions and protections within our parliamentary system for the short term benefit of one prime minister.

    Respectfully;

    Dr. David J Paterson, PhD, PPhys
  599. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: John Doe, Gilles is not posturing. He really means to get all he can out of Canada for Quebec with separation being the goal. He was praised by Parizeau today for promoting the cause of separatism. To put one's head in the sand and keep pretending that separation is not their real intent is foolhardy.
  600. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: Hendrick Larose from Canada writes: What's the Alliance got to do with the current situation. If the argument is that it didn't work then and the coalition shouldn't work now, I agree.

    Poor Hendrick, can't seem to digest that his buddies tried to slip into power by aligning with the Bloc. First it was "Wetsuit" Day and then it was Hareper in 2004... The point, my man, is that the Conservative/Reform/Aliance Party just can't work with anyone. They believe they have a "divine" right to rule without any explaination or rebuttal of any kind. Take the word minority, derived from the word minor, meaning not major. So, militarily speaking, Harper is a sargeant who thinks he's a major but comes off looking like a PFC. Had he acted like a minority PM this would not have happened.
  601. Peasinour Thyme from Edmonton, Canada writes: Hey Ravensbud, no I couldn't vote there. I traded off my vote on the Facebook Anti-Harper site. Woops, I guess that gives away my bias!

    I don't have a problem with Duceppe. I didn't hear or watch the speeches, so I don't know the context, but basically I would agree with his sentiments.

    You see, love 'em or hate 'em the Bloc are destined to be kingmakers. This type of a situation, the formation of a coalition will always improve their bargaining power.

    Had Harper just behaved himself, the Bloc would not have had this opportunity as there would have been insufficient motivation to form the coalition. As it is we can be quite sure that Harper would gladly make the same deal with them, if he could.

    As far as separatism goes, I find the Western separatist rhetoric equally distasteful. Is an Albertan who advocates separatism better than a Quebecois who does so? Sort of a double standard, don't you think?

    In my heart, besides my great love for Canada, is a special love of Quebec, its music, its culture, its spirit, its language and its people. That culture must be preserved. We can choose to help preserve it in Canada or they can choose to preserve it out of Canada. The former is by far the preferable option. If you learned more about French Canadians, and learned to love them, and shared the love, then they could sustain a separate culture within Canada, and we would all be the better for it.

    Don't let fear rule your heart. Feel the spirit of Canada and resist the force of cynicism, anger and hatred that keeps you bound to malignant ideologies.
  602. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Mike Horner - "a mature and knowledgable citizen". That makes it fact? Did you read historian Michael Bliss's presentation that stated that the Bloc cannot be considered as part of the coalition because separation is its main reason for existance?
  603. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: snow lander from Edmonton, Canada writes: Tooker - the Bloc are NOT members of the coalition. They only agreed to support a Liberal-NDP coalition.

    Then it would appear that the coalition truly does not have more support than the government does by seat count or by popular vote.

    Lies - lies - lies
  604. Phil H from Kelowna, Canada writes: Alan S from Calgary, Canada writes: C[BC and Globe keep you archeology skills honed, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, dig, I am sure you can come up with more juicy dirt on the Conservatives. For example when short term cooperation, with BLOC, NDP to bring down the Liberals for an ELECTION, a few years back, is equated to a coalition created to take over power WITHOUT an election.]

    Did you read the article? But you're right. On a separate occasion, the Conservatives attempted to bring down the Liberal government with Bloc support in order to force an election.
  605. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    The GG should tell Harper to be a man and stop hiding ..............

    Harper challenged the opposition to move non-confidence just 4 months ago ......................
    ................ and now all the Harperites are scared of a vote.

    Harperites are uneducated and don't understand the parlimentary system. They should just move to the USA where they will fit in just fine with the Bushites.
  606. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Peas, the bottom line is that they want to separate. There is no Alberta separatist party, other than a website. No Alberta separatists are in the HOC. Read Gilles text which again includes " the deal was good for the separatist cause". I believe him. Do you think he was telling a lie?
  607. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: (8 weeks ago) Harper: Don't worry people there's no recession. This is a fabrication concoted by the oppositon parties. (4 weeks ago) Harper: We are in a bit of a slow down, but if there were a crisis it would have hit by now. (3 weeks ago) Harper: Ok we are in a "technical" recession. I mean it's just techical no biggie - not as if your jobs, savings, and pensions are at risk right. (2 weeks ago) Flaherty: Yup we expect to keep a balanced budget for the next four years. We will have a very modest surplus (after we sell all of Canada for rock bottom prices ). (1 week ago) The entire opposition: Ok fellows we are totally sick of these idiots. We have more people than them - let's just get together and throw them out and in the process let's pledge to put our partisan differences aside for the next 18 months so we can focus on the economy and provide some stimulus for ordinary Canadians to tide over the rough patch. (2 days ago) Conservatives: The fact that majority of the parliament refuses to support us means that we should suspend parliament indefinitely aka prorouging. We can't lose power if there is no vote of confidence ha ha ha ha. Con borgs: duh parliganetary dimocricy is cimpal. Stevin Herper is PM til the nd of tyme.
  608. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: snow lander from Edmonton, Canada writes: Tooker - the Bloc are NOT members of the coalition. They only agreed to support a Liberal-NDP coalition.

    Then it would appear that the coalition truly does not have more support than the government does by seat count or by popular vote.

    Wassup, take note of the makeup of parliament and you might figure out that you lied without being told that you did. the CPC's (read Harper because it's a one man 142 puppets party) have 143 member support. The opposition votes are counted together in any motion and total 165, thereby eclipsing the government by 23 votes. I hope this lesson in math is helpful to you... LOL I can alread her your brain asking "wassat, wasst"?
  609. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: This arguement is so weak it is pitiful that the mop and pail have brought it out. Alliance is dead. A suggestion that there could be discussion is alot different than a bad deal that gives the keys to the separatists. The dips and libs have put one more nail in the coffin for Canada and they are so arrogant they spread these lies to cover their power lust.

    How much does the coalition care ? Well, their leader whom they agreed was no leader at all is --- well he's good enough for a few months.

    How many in your alliance by the way? How could the dips and libs have a legitimate coalition without the bloc? But yet you speak of a coalition of two. Lies Lies Lies -- A coalition without representation from the party with the most seats. The list goes on and on to show this is about entitlements, power grabs and the inability of the lib and dips to understand the population said no to dion - to sleazy jack and to the green shaft.

    Show some eggs - take it to the people. You know your toast sooner or later.
  610. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    In a parlimenary system a coalition is a perfectly legal instrument to protect the citizens from a runaway minority leader.

    Case closed.

    Quit whining Harper, you made your bed now sleep in it.
  611. Denis Love from Victoria BC, Canada writes: Somebody is lying. Day's comments were on CBC this evening, in the streaming section saying he knew nothing about a deal with the Bloc way back in 2000. That's two leaders who have lied. Harper and Day. I tend to believe the Liberal and NDP getting together will be beneficial to Canada right now
  612. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: So what is it Bill - a coalition of the dips and libs or are the bloc in ? If your lieing with separatists - have the nuts to admit it ? Wassup widat - are you a coalition of 3 or a group of 2 letting Duceppe lead you by the nose?

    You bill are supporting separatists in the senate and I would love if you would justify that to me please
  613. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Peas, the bottom line is that they want to separate. There is no Alberta separatist party, other than a website. No Alberta separatists are in the HOC. Read Gilles text which again includes " the deal was good for the separatist cause". I believe him. Do you think he was telling a lie?

    Excuse me Ravensbud, but Alberta does have a seperatist in the HOC. His name is Stephen Harper, and even after he bought leadership of the Aliance he said that he'd still reccomend that Alberta build a firewall against the rest of Canada.
  614. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: snow lander from Edmonton, Canada writes: Tooker - the Bloc are NOT members of the coalition. They only agreed to support a Liberal-NDP coalition. Then it would appear that the coalition truly does not have more support than the government does by seat count or by popular vote. Lies - lies - lies ---------------------------------------- 1) Greens Liberals NDP have more of the popular vote than Conservatives. Greens have also supported the coalition. 2) Bloc is NOT part of the coalition because they weren't given any cabinet seats. However, they are SUPPORTING the coalition from outside the government. This happened even with the Conservatives. In fact, when the house voted with the Conservatives on any confidence motions, they were voting with the government and by that act (ie voting with the government on a confidence vote) the consensus of the majority was established. 3) In order to determine who governs, there HAS to be a parliamentary majority achieved. To determine that, there is a CONFIDENCE VOTE. If the Government falls, then the coalition can form government and ALSO has to face a CONFIDENCE VOTE. If they win that vote, then BY LAW, they have the support of a majority of the House and are entitled to form government. If they LOSE then that triggers an election. Go do your homework and stop crying wolf.
  615. Billy Rayner from Canada writes: I'm sick of this left media bringing up old stories about what happened with a party that is gone to divert attention away from the scam the Liberals are trying to pull. Maybe Mr Harper should have came out and looked into the camera and said screw it let them have the east and announced he is leading a revolt of the West. I talked to auto workers 2 weeks ago in Montreal that didn't get a raise this year and thought it was unfair. I got a small raise out here in the West but I still don't make $40hr and have my industry asking for billions in handouts and my union not giving anything in return. We've played by Ontario's rules long enough and it's time to cut our loses and say it's time to go before another NEP program that gives our wealth to the east.
  616. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Harperites are uneducated and don't understand the parlimentary system. They should just move to the USA where they will fit in just fine with the Bushites.
    ----
    Yet the only alternative is to press for two viable national parties that can govern for the good of majority of the people of Canada.

    The conservative party has been hijacked and the Liberal is about to be.

    I'm sorry, I don't want to have to hold my nose and vote for either the looney bins of the far right nor left.

    And my savings are decimated as is.

    Cheers from TO
  617. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: John Peterson, has the recession started in TO? I live south of Ottawa, no recession here or in Ottawa. Stores are packed, help wanted signs everywhere. My contacts across the Prairies and in BC see no major slowdown. NFLD is now have instead of have not. Lots of hype from the opposition. Where should we throw the money? Certain industries are in a downturn. Forestry when housing starts are down. Automotive when car sales are down. We are tied to the US economy. If we do not wait to see what the new administration in Washington does we are guessing and throwing money in the wrong direction.

  618. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Bill, you sure reached back for that one. So Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Is that what you believe?
  619. Billy Rayner from Canada writes: Let's make no mistake this it's all about the Liberals losing their $1.95 a vote taxpayers free money. The Conservitives seem to have financial support from the grassroots and said they didn't need they 10 million in taxpayer funding so why was 8 million such a big deal to the Libs. We've all seen how the 700 billion economics package has boosted the US economy right give the party that won the election a chance to table a budget.
  620. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: So what is it Bill - a coalition of the dips and libs or are the bloc in ? If your lieing with separatists - have the nuts to admit it ? Wassup widat - are you a coalition of 3 or a group of 2 letting Duceppe lead you by the nose? You bill are supporting separatists in the senate and I would love if you would justify that to me please Wassup, do you not understand symantics at all. I'll type this very slowly, please read it slowly so you will understand at least a tiny bit. Many times between January 2006 and September 2008 Harper passed bills in the HOC with the support of the Bloc. By your definition you would have to say that the CPC was letting the Bloc lead him by the nose.. Harper would have been defeated without the support of the opposition. Yes, the Liberal/NDP coalition will have less members than the CPC, but, as was the case with Harper, the Bloc has pledged to vote with the coalition thereby giving them a majority of the HOC. This is not any different than what occured between 2006 and now. Now, if the GG does the correct thing and allowws the coalition to proceed, and they do indeed have a plan to help Canadians through this recession would you expect Harper to support or reject it, and why?
  621. John Doe from Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: How many in your alliance by the way? How could the dips and libs have a legitimate coalition without the bloc? But yet you speak of a coalition of two. Lies Lies Lies -- A coalition without representation from the party with the most seats.__________________________________

    A coalition of two, with the support of the Bloc on confidence motions is more than Stephen Harper has right now.

    The Coalition of two has the demonstrated, written confidence of the majority of Parliamentarians for the next 18 months. Harper too requires support from either the Liberals, the NDP or the Bloc to govern - it's a minority Parliament. He hasclearly demonstrated his disinterest in compromise or action on the economy and as such has lost the confidence of the House. He cannot continue to govern under such conditions and proguing Parliament only further demonstrates his willingness to thwart the Canadian democratic process.

    Rather than spend another $300 million dollars on an election likely to result in a very similarly divided House, that money could be better used to invest in Canada and Canadians as directed by the majority of Parliamentarians who were duly elected by Canadians only eight weeks ago.
  622. martha stewart from Canada writes: I was just having a snack when it occured to me...

    What's the difference between this coalition and a bowl of mixed nuts?
  623. Elaine Hall from Canada writes: I hope everybody can remember that the WESTpulled the EASTout of the trouble they got into in the 80s. WE are not about to do that AGAIN. If Quebec can have a separatist party (English version) so can Alberta and others. I think it's about time all provinces were separate idenities and meet once a year and have drinks. I'm sure all would get along better. It's a travestry for this country--how the world and our soldiers are seeing this. Mr. Dion, You are not our PM.
    Jack You are not our PM. Duceppe,you are not our PM. Harper is our PM. We need another election and a reformed system or everybody separate. We already have treaties with our Western neighbors.
    What does the Eastern provinces have with their neighbors?
    We don't need a GG to tell us what to do.
  624. Billy Rayner from Canada writes: EJ , No that's not what I believe Mr Harper wants but the power grab from the Eastern parties tells me the West better watch their backs. The election was called and votes counted and Harper won .Why didn't Dion and the others save us the time and money and do this before the election call rather than plan the coup the night after the election.
  625. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: Bill, you sure reached back for that one. So Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Is that what you believe?

    Yes, unless you wish to say he lied about it, and EJ, 6 years is not a long reach.
  626. dan vanman from Canada writes: Please Billy...the CPC has support from the "grassroots"? You can say that with a straight face?

    The CPC has support from Bay St. Period. Full stop. This was nothing more than trying to Americanize our political system, and allow venal lobbyists more access to the halls of power.

    The whole point of the subsidies was to prevent that.

    Cretien did a good thing. Quit trying to cloud the issue with half truths...grassroots indeed.

    Funny how Tory supporters can go from arrogant braggarts when they are on top, to whiney poor sports when faced with adversity.
  627. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Billy Rayner from Canada writes: We've all seen how the 700 billion economics package has boosted the US economy right give the party that won the election a chance to table a budget.

    You are absolutely right Bill - the dips and libs feel if they throw money out fast, the public will be foolish enough to think its good business. And some of the people on this board are naive enough to buy this bull. These parties are all about deficit financing and frankly I am tired of passing debt on to the grandkids.

    The arguement they say is that the cons have not made a move to support the economy. A 33B dollar program already announced, and a 2009 April target for economic stimulus - well thought out, planned and organized with provincial and municipal governments. Sounds like very reasonable time lines to put that kind of a plan in place. But not fast enough for sleazy jack and dion.

    This countries economy is doomed with this kind of fiscal mismanagment.

    Still have not heard Bill Woodstock explain how he can justify suporting separatists in the senate ? How about you Will - can your 60 years of experience justify giving the keys to Quebec?
  628. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: People for the record, Liberals have 27% of the popular vote. NDP has 18%, Conservatives have 38%.

    Liberals NDP = 45% of the popular vote

    45% > 38%. I was previously saying the Greens were needed but in fact I was reading the NDP's popular vote numbers wrong. So Green support is not required even though they are supporting the coalition along with the bloc.

    BTW, for the record the if the Governor General does prorogue parliament in order to prevent a vote of confidence. THAT would be the true hijacking of democracy. The government must face a confidence vote to decide it's fate according to the laws of our country.

    I call on Harper to respect the democracy of Canada.
  629. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: John Peterson - how many elections have been won by popular vote in Canada? Its about seats John - you know that.
  630. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: martha stewart from Canada writes: I was just having a snack when it occured to me...

    What's the difference between this coalition and a bowl of mixed nuts?

    Answer::: The mixed nuts are on the other side of the house LMAO
  631. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Garibaldi III from Canada wrote:
    The conservative party has been hijacked and the Liberal is about to be.

    Really Garibaldi III,
    who hijacked the conservative party ?

    was it the Alberta hillbillies ?
    ......... or the Saskatchewan hillbillies ?
  632. EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: My question was for Bill Woodcock who had raised that old canard. Sorry for the mixup Billy Rayner.
    Bill W, so you say Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Wow, when do you think this will happen?
  633. Ed Op from Canada writes:

    Spencer C:

    You don't know why this is important? Because Harper is shrieking at the top of his lungs that making a deal with the Bloc is making a deal with the devil. You don't detect a whiff of hypocrisy there? Nothing fazes you in this? You're a tool.

    Martha K.:

    The Globe endorsed Harper for PM prior to the election. Don't think they're going out of their way to shoot him down now. Just reporting the facts ma'am.
  634. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: dan vanman from Canada writes: Please Billy...the CPC has support from the "grassroots"? You can say that with a straight face?

    You should read some of your libs propoganda dan and you will understand that the situation is EXACTLY that. The CPC have done extemely well with grassroots support. Bay street is in Toronto dude and Bay street has been running the LPC for years.

    Funny the LPC is broke so shortly after having the check book taken away from them. What a freaking coincidence that after all these decades, within a couple years of losing control of the money laundering system for LPC , they are broke. Good fiscal management - maybe they can run some deficit financing and let the next generation pay for their folly
  635. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes:

    Still have not heard Bill Woodstock explain how he can justify suporting separatists in the senate ? How about you Will - can your 60 years of experience justify giving the keys to Quebec?

    Poor Widat, still can't figure out Wassup, can you. I have not said that I support seperatists, be it Gilles Duceppe or Stephen Harper. I have said that the coalition is legal and that I support that idea. My answer is difinitive to those able to comprehend what I have said. It is you who have failed to say whether or not Harper and his speechless puppets support the seperatists because they also have had bills supported by the Bloc. Please expain how the two are different?
  636. John Doe from Canada writes: Wassup, six months to wait for a stimulus package is an absolute lifetime when we currently stand at the brink of a worldwide recession. That is not responsible government, just like it isn't responsible to prorogue Parliament for two months because you are going to lose a confidence vote.
  637. Billy Rayner from Canada writes: Dan Vanman, Yes we are very arrogant in your eyes but we do give facts to back up our statements. Here you go this is 2007 donation info found though CBC the Conservitives raised 18.6 million to the Liberals 9.1 million. Here's the shocker the Conservitives had 108,000 individauls donate 20-25 bucks over four times the indivdaul donates the Liberals received so no it's not Bay St money.

    Cretien did a very Liberal thing and said let the taxpayers support us they can afford it.

    Grassroots support is what the Conservatives have and the facts show it even the bais CBC shows the numbers.
  638. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    EJ Ravensbud wrote:
    Bill W, so you say Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Wow, when do you think this will happen ?

    EJ,
    Alberta conservatives have been threatening the separate ever since the Trudeau years.

    Alberta is just like Quebec ....................... whine whine whine
  639. by the beach from Victoria BC, Canada writes: The West must go!

    There is such a great divide in this country and the Bloc/Lib/Ndp Separatist Coalition have just put oil on the fire. Quebec is the spoiled child in the family and no it is time for it to move out and be on its own!
  640. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: John Doe - I would disagree with any rush to finance questionable industries owned by foreign nations. That is bad business. And to think that throwing money at the auto industry is good business is folly. It matters greatly what the US 700B dollars will do so that overlap is avoided and synergies are attained.

    To just throw 24B$ to ill planned projects because you feel you have to do something fast is folly
  641. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: EJ Ravensbud from Canada writes: My question was for Bill Woodcock who had raised that old canard. Sorry for the mixup Billy Rayner.
    Bill W, so you say Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Wow, when do you think this will happen ?

    Probably shortly after he loses control in Ottawa. Funny thing is that I have asked the question of whether Harper meant it when he encouraged the Premiere of Alberta to build a firewall around the province and insulate it from the rest of Canada and no one has given an answer. There can only be two. A. If he meant it, he's a seperatist, or B. If he didn't then he's a liar.
  642. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: John Peterson - how many elections have been won by popular vote in Canada? Its about seats John - you know that. ----------------------------------------- Yes of course it's seats - I mentioned that number because someone has mentioned that Conservatives have greater popular vote than the coalition. To determine seats in a minority government - in most cases the party with the most seats forms the government. And of course Conservatives did initially form the government according to the rules. However, in order to stay in power, a minority government has to establish majority consensus on matters of confidence. If a confidence vote fails there are two cases. Case 1) The government is very young and there has just been a recent election. In this case, the opposition party can try to form a government. In order to be successful, there is another vote of confidence and a majority of the house (inside or outside of governing party(s)) have to support the opposition in order for them to be successful - that vote failing triggers an election. Case 2) The government has been in power for some time (usually more than 1 year). In this case, if the governing party falls that automatically triggers an election. Why are there two cases? The reasons are practical. Elections are expensive and during an election no legislation can be considered or passed. So for practical reasons, to avoid an indefinite political stale mate - if there has just been an election and the ruling party is really unpopular - the opposition is given a chance. This has got nothing to do with partisanship, my opinion, or anyone else's opinion. The laws are there so we can have orderly resolution to disputes and according to the law - although the situation is certainly unique - the coalition has the legitimate right to attempt to win a vote of confidence and if successful in the vote - to govern.
  643. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    EJ Ravensbud wrote:
    Bill W, so you say Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Wow, when do you think this will happen ?

    EJ,
    Alberta conservatives have been threatening to separate ever since the Trudeau years.

    Alberta is just like Quebec ....................... whine whine whine
  644. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: Billy Rayner from Canada writes: Let's make no mistake this it's all about the Liberals losing their $1.95 a vote taxpayers free money.
    etc. etc
    ---------
    No, the real problem is that Steven could not handle being told He was the best of the worst.

    He is still the best of the worst... but we deserve better!

    Steven got the bright idea that if He became the only game in town than by default he would be the best.
    The other losers said no way and demanded the ball.
    Steven wants to delay giving the ball.

    The clowns that finished worst than Steve think that by combining they become better than Steve; see Steve cannot add; these clowns cannot multiply; a loser times 3 is 3 losers; not any better.

    Steven is going to the principal demanding another contest.

    The real problem tough is that even with a new contest we could end up exactly as we are minus 300M.

    and that is the problem

    Cheers
  645. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Bill Woodcock writes : Please expain how the two are different?

    First off Bill, by supporting this coalition you are supporting blood payment to Quebec and the price is separatists in the senate. You should be able to find that in print on line except in the mop and pail because that is inconvenient information.

    Secondly, my smart azz friend, voting in a similar fashion as another right wing party should not surprise you. Voting with a party is a far cry from handing the keys to the enemy. If you cannot hear from Duceppe that this is great for Quebecs cause, I cannot make you hear. You sleep with dogs, you wake up with fleas. And someone who talks down to people the way you do , is the biggest dog in the room
  646. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Garibaldi III from Canada wrote:
    The conservative party has been hijacked and the Liberal is about to be.

    Really Garibaldi III,
    who hijacked the conservative party ?

    was it the Alberta hillbillies ?
    ......... or the Saskatchewan hillbillies ?
    -----
    More like Brian Mulrooney IMO..... ask Kim C.
  647. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    EJ Ravensbud wrote:
    Bill W, so you say Steve wants Alberta to separate from Canada. Wow, when do you think this will happen ?

    EJ,
    Alberta conservatives have been threatening to separate ever since the Trudeau years.

    Last Honest Conservative, I appreciate your info on the ASM and your post.
  648. Tor Hill from Canada writes: The affairs of state are just like the affairs of individuals - messy and immature and worse. States are just like human beings, only they do damage on a bigger scale. States are just like us and that is why they do so much damage. That is hardly an excuse for states' behaviour. They responsible for their behaviour just as we are. There are always ways to act like adults.
  649. Wassup Widat from Canada writes: John Peterson - I gotta hit the sack so I guess I will get the last word in (as far as my read anyway.)

    I fully understand the mechanics of the minority situation as well as the legality of coalitions. I do not understand why the coalition will not admit to being a coalition of 3, why this talk of a coalition of 2. That is why the question of seats is important.

    The price the bloc is asking you John, is separatists in the senate. A signed deal with the devil is a far cry from a suggestion of potential discussions, and frankly the mop and pail could have pointed this out had they believed in non biased journalism.

    We will have to disagree on this John but I do appreciate your respectful and intelligent tone
  650. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Bill Woodcock from Canada wrote:
    I have asked the question of whether Harper meant it when he encouraged the Premiere of Alberta to build a firewall around the province and insulate it from the rest of Canada and no one has given an answer.
    There can only be two.
    A. If he meant it, he's a separatist, or
    B. If he didn't then he's a liar.

    well Bill,
    Harper is certainly a proven liar

    But that does not prove that Harper is not a separatist.
    Harper has embraced both Alberta and Quebec separatists.

    Don't expect CBC, CTV and the rest of the media to ever mention that..........
  651. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: Bill Woodcock writes : Please expain how the two are different? First off Bill, by supporting this coalition you are supporting blood payment to Quebec and the price is separatists in the senate. You should be able to find that in print on line except in the mop and pail because that is inconvenient information. Secondly, my smart azz friend, voting in a similar fashion as another right wing party should not surprise you. Voting with a party is a far cry from handing the keys to the enemy. If you cannot hear from Duceppe that this is great for Quebecs cause, I cannot make you hear. You sleep with dogs, you wake up with fleas. And someone who talks down to people the way you do , is the biggest dog in the room See, typical CPC name calling. which is better than talking down I suppose, but I would like you to tell me the huge difference between the Bloc voting wit the CPC and voting with a coalition. Historically there were the Progressives and the Conservatives. Eventually they formed a coalition, then merged to one party. This could be the beging of another such movement. But once again I ask, If the Bloc is voting with a coalition, how is it different than Harper calling Quebec a nation within a nation to get the Bloc's support himself?
  652. The Angry Left from Canada writes: Only 30% of people who vote Bloc actually support Quebec separation. Most are Quebec nationalists who vote Bloc to look out for the interests of Quebec. This PM has destroyed any chances his party will ever have in Quebec for the foreseeable future. All of the Conservative's talk of "treason" and "sedition" is causing a sigh of relief all across Quebec from everyone who voted Bloc to avoid giving this demigogue PM a majority. Could you imagine if this guy had been given a majority and the damage he could do.

    As for letting the auto industry and manufacturing whither and die, you people out west must really love paying into equalization, as you would be doing alot more of that if you let that happen. Every auto job with the Big 3 created 7 more in the larger economy. Take away all of the revenue that that generates and the taxes that that generates, and Ontario will be pushed even further into "have not" status and Alberta will have to pony up even more to the rest of Canada. Save a few pennies now by letting the auto industry die today, pay much, much more later because of lost economic potential.
  653. The Bubble from Canada writes: Looks like everyone is tiring out, man that horse has been flogged beyond recognition. I knew this was all coming and have acted accordingly, I'm good for at least the next four years. Life has never been better. This whole country can go down the toilet now, makes no nevermind to me. I have dropped out, you can't change the nature of things. Next up: we haven't had a real big natural disaster in a while and the big ones usually happen around this time of the year, while our parliament pro rogues. Get ready folks, things are just getting warmed up, no one is dead yet.
  654. Bill Woodcock from Canada writes: The Angry Left from Canada writes: Only 30% of people who vote Bloc actually support Quebec separation. Most are Quebec nationalists who vote Bloc to look out for the interests of Quebec. This PM has destroyed any chances his party will ever have in Quebec for the foreseeable future. All of the Conservative's talk of "treason" and "sedition" is causing a sigh of relief all across Quebec from everyone who voted Bloc to avoid giving this demigogue PM a majority. Could you imagine if this guy had been given a majority and the damage he could do. As for letting the auto industry and manufacturing whither and die, you people out west must really love paying into equalization, as you would be doing alot more of that if you let that happen. Every auto job with the Big 3 created 7 more in the larger economy. Take away all of the revenue that that generates and the taxes that that generates, and Ontario will be pushed even further into "have not" status and Alberta will have to pony up even more to the rest of Canada. Save a few pennies now by letting the auto industry die today, pay much, much more later because of lost economic potential. Hey, Angry Left, don't forget that if the auto industry dies there will eventually be far fewer cars and the fewer the cars the smaller the gasoline market, the less money Alberta has, the less Canada has, we all lose and suffer, just some faster than others. Bed Time, night all
  655. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    Angry Left from Canada wrote:
    Only 30% of people who vote Bloc actually support Quebec separation. Most are Quebec nationalists who vote Bloc to look out for the interests of Quebec. This PM has destroyed any chances his party will ever have in Quebec for the foreseeable future.

    Good point Angry,
    Talk radio shows in Quebec are replaying tape from talk radio shows in Alberta............ Harper has lost all of his Quebec MPs.

    Harper is toast .................
  656. The Bubble from Canada writes: These comment are unnecessarily inflated by people reposting others' long winded posts, but I guess that's probably deliberate. Makes everything cancel out.
  657. Garibaldi III from Canada writes: The Angry Left from Canada writes:
    Could you imagine if this guy had been given a majority and the damage he could do.
    ------
    That is the only and real problem..... devisive.

    Fact:
    Majority of Ontario voters have always voted for the most stable and competent leader while penalizing bad behaviour of incumbents (Kim C., Martin).

    Last time was no different; Harper got majority

    Mulrooney won Toronto...... and give it away. But Cons were getting close again.

    If they win it or lose it next time; it's always same reason; leadership

    Cheers
  658. The Last Honest Conservative from Western, Canada writes:
    The Bubble from Canada wrote:
    I'm good for at least the next four years. Life has never been better. This whole country can go down the toilet now, makes no nevermind to me. I have dropped out, you can't change the nature of things.

    congratulations Bubbles.........................
    ........................................ for collecting nuts with the squirrels
  659. Fog Hat from Canada writes: Bye bye Harper
  660. John Peterson from Toronto, Canada, Canada writes: Wassup Widat from Canada writes: John Peterson - I gotta hit the sack so I guess I will get the last word in (as far as my read anyway.) I fully understand the mechanics of the minority situation as well as the legality of coalitions. I do not understand why the coalition will not admit to being a coalition of 3, why this talk of a coalition of 2. That is why the question of seats is important. -------------------------- Yes let me clarify this important point. In a government, the operational power is in the hands of the Prime Minister and his appointed cabinet. The prime minister and the cabinet (ie ministers) are the ones that actually handle the operations. For example, ministry of finance, ministry of defense, ministry of natral resources, education, health, etc. etc. So the PM and the Ministers are actually the ones doing the operational governance - calling the shots on the ground and running the various branches of government. The opposition and non-governing parties can only VOTE on legislation. They don't have direct control over the ministries. In a coalition, the ministers come from more than one party. So for example, the NDP and the Liberals are sharing the ministerial positions. The Bloc DOES NOT have any ministerial appointments. Therefore, they are not part of the coalition. What is the role of the Bloc? In the past, when a minority government puts forth a confidence motion - like the budget - the house votes on that budget. The Bloc have signed a document where they have promised to support the government on major confidence motions like the budget - but retained the right to vote however they please otherwise. So the Bloc is not part of the coalition - because they don't have any cabinet positions but they are supporting the coalition from outside the government - IE promising to VOTE for the government on matters of confidence for a minimum of 18 months. I hope that makes sense.
  661. joe kelly from Canada writes: Dion pals around with terrorists (seperatists).

    Conservative ridings are the Real Canada (TM).

    Duceppe has fathered French-Canadian children.

    Layton is a Socialist (ditto).

    The Dow was up today, the TSX was DOWn! Proof the Coalition is creating a globally Canadian (Seperate) financial crisis.

    Be afraid. Be really afraid! (G-d, can I get a refund on my CPC membership?)
  662. P C from Vancouver, Canada writes: Harper has pulled a Mulroney. He has stage managed a meaningless crisis.

    The coalition are still clowns. Dion, whom one no one wants. Layton, who's drooling for power.

    Only winner is Duceppe. Whatever the outcome he wins. After this fiasco what exactly is federalist argument other than feeding Bay street?
  663. Regular Joe from Canada writes: Let's punish Harper for what he had lied to all of us, Canadians. Kick him and his cronies out of office. The earlier the better. Good riddance .
    We were very lucky that he did not get a majority last time. Otherwise, Canada is like hell right now. We have learned our lesson.
  664. jim slade from canada, Canada writes: Where is the signed document? there isn't one signed?- THEN SHUT UP. you can be half pregnant!!!!!!!!!!!!
  665. David Setter from Los Angeles, United States writes: So the Globe and Mail is in the tank for the Conservatives. Big surprise! This post-facto scare-mongering only shows how ridiculous the right wing's arguments have become. The boogie man of coalitions past is all they have to offer. Be afraid, be afraid!

    Canadians have rejected Harper twice. Take the hint Steven and get outta the way! It's time for some positive ideas and energy going forward. If it takes the form of political adversaries being forced to deal with each other in order to get the nation's business done, then I say it's worth a shot.
  666. J Birch from Hamilton, Canada writes:

    Did Stephen Harper Lie? Watch the tape..
    A 4 minute explanation.

    Watch the tape

    A 4 minute explanation that says it all.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pb1hmuauyfg

    .
  667. Rick Jones from The Rock, Canada writes: Why don't the Conservatives dump Harper and then they too can join with the other coalition partners?

    We could call it "Parliament" and they could work together for the health, wealth and prosperity of all Canadians?
  668. Rick Jones from The Rock, Canada writes: Why don't the Conservatives dump Harper and then they too can join with the other coalition partners?

    We could call it "Parliament" and they could work together for the health, wealth and prosperity of all Canadians?
  669. J Birch from Hamilton, Canada writes:

    Clearly this week has proven beyond doubt

    Steven Harper - Not a Leader

    Time for the conservatives to ask themselves can they really afford someone this reckless and divisive

    .
  670. JMFT S from Canada writes: Constitutional democracy is working when we can implement a provision like the one that allows for a coalition when there is a loss of confidence in the government. We are really in trouble when that provision is not allowed or thwarted. This is how our parliament works when the government doesn't. This could be a turning point for the good for relations with Quebec sovereigntists. The more involved they are with the workings with the federal system the stronger the ties.
  671. joe kelly from Canada writes: STEPHEN HARPER: Angels on high; loves children; best apple crumble ever; Christmas morning; Wii; 18 year-old Scotch and 21 year-old swimmers; crisp fall mornings in the country; the Rockies; The Rockettes; Team Canada beating Team USA; bbq; ice cream; higher state of consciousness; sleep in tomorrow; dbl dbl; very fast car, no cops; big raise at work; Tims.

    THE COALITION: teachers' pets; curdled cream in coffee; pro gay everything; french speaking; housework; crowded bus in summer; serial killer; tofu; politicians; on government welfare; shovel snow from driveway @6am; Azameezajahada-what'sname; Toronto; devil cult; bq, no bbq; nagging; cbc; subtitles; tax increase; really big tax increase; bay street; beezelbub; yellow burn spots on lawn; gas; gas tax; dark winter night.

    Brought to you by the CPC Reach Out Program Keeping Canadians informed.
  672. Sarah Mahal from Calgary, Canada writes: I am concerned that Harper has been shouting illegitimate, coup etc etc about the coalition why has not the media defended the legitimacy of the coalition it is perfectly in accordance with the policies and procedures of parliament. Cons feed on the naivety and fear of people. Albertans are notoriously ignorant on many political issues. And the oil wealth has done nothing for the province, the oil companies just needs the labour here. The media is a shame in this province. This is a good learning experience for the public to get the facts and use their own judgement and not listen to this propaganda party.

Join the Conversation, Leave a Comment

This conversation is semi-moderated What is moderation? | How do I report a comment?

You must be logged-in to submit a comment — login now!

Not registered with globeandmail.com? Register now. It is quick and free.

close

Alert us about this comment

Please let us know if this reader’s comment breaks the editor's rules and is obscene, abusive, threatening, unlawful, harassing, defamatory, profane or racially offensive by selecting the appropriate option to describe the problem.

Do not use this to complain about comments that don’t break the rules, for example those comments that you disagree with or contain spelling errors or multiple postings.

Back to top