- badqat, on 01/02/2009, -6/+39Web share != overall market share. Perhaps we Mac users just spend more time on the net?
- Nephersir7, on 01/02/2009, -5/+18"Web share != overall market share. Perhaps we Mac users just spend more time on the net?"
porn.- cthellis, on 01/02/2009, -2/+8iPorn
- svivian, on 01/02/2009, -7/+2True, but the figures won't be too inaccurate.
- falafelkiosken, on 01/02/2009, -12/+3I guess there's at least some PC users to stupid to get onto the internet
- KibibyteBrain, on 01/02/2009, -1/+5But this brings up an interesting point. Perhaps lumping the whole PC market together into one big monster is no longer really working. There are so many types of uses for PCs that are very unique: engineering design and simulation, art and multimedia production, office productivity, home computers and personal web, kiosks, clusters, gaming, development, the list goes on. Trying to map out market share of all of those and acting like it has some meaning seems a bit absurd to me at this point. It would be something like trying to use CAT's market share of all motored powered vehicles to make a claim about how that company works.
- friday04, on 01/02/2009, -3/+5Your point is exactly why web designers and developers hate Microsoft's Internet Explorer so much. If they would get on board with true web standards and ditch their proprietary ActiveX bull then we could develop applications that work throughout an entire ecosystem of products. When I write code and test it in Firefox it almost always works just as well in Safari or Opera (with some minor tweaking for their rendering engines). Only IE requires me to hack and slash and break rules just so their stupid browser can render the pages correctly.
Their arrogance and anti-competitive practices are finally starting to catch up to them. They're by no means hurting, they still dominate the overall PC market and web share but their numbers are dropping and other OS/browser combinations are growing. That's good for the web. It's good for the future of web development. And I hope IE goes into a death spiral that it can not recover from because that software is a piece of *****.
[/rant] - jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -9/+3"Your point is exactly why web designers and developers hate Microsoft's Internet Explorer so much. "
Hmm most Autocad/designers... 3d artists use MS 64 bit applications and NOT OSX ! Even now Apple has screwed the professional market and people have, if not in the process, switched to Vista 64 to use professional apps like CS4 in 64 bit mode.
"Their arrogance and anti-competitive practices are finally starting to catch up to them."
Um Apple is the one that is actually practicing monopolistic practices and has violated the "copyright misuse" doctrine by inserting sabotaged code into their EFI chip to prohibit the installation of OSX onto other hardware.
MS has no such restricting and even allows you to install it on MACs, this is MS compatibility and not Apple innovation.
I do agree that the browser simply sucks and is an obvious point that MS does NOT restrict the usage of other softeare on their OS. They should probably point this out to the EU and ask for their anti competition suit to be dropped and ask for a refund! - friday04, on 01/02/2009, -2/+5I know you want to have a flame war about Apple but I'm not getting pulled into your flawed logic. You strayed way off topic. This link was about web share and my post was about IE and reasons for dwindling market share. And on that topic, Microsoft is guilty of the most famous monopolistic behavior in corporate history when they litterally drove Netscape out of business.
Stay on topic and relax your Apple-hater rhetoric for articles that are specifically about why Apple sucks. - digitalpencil, on 01/02/2009, -2/+2jabber.. you need a new alias, everyone knows you're a retard troll.
- friday04, on 01/02/2009, -3/+5Your point is exactly why web designers and developers hate Microsoft's Internet Explorer so much. If they would get on board with true web standards and ditch their proprietary ActiveX bull then we could develop applications that work throughout an entire ecosystem of products. When I write code and test it in Firefox it almost always works just as well in Safari or Opera (with some minor tweaking for their rendering engines). Only IE requires me to hack and slash and break rules just so their stupid browser can render the pages correctly.
- DelMonte, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5"Web share != overall market share. Perhaps we Mac users just spend more time on the net?"
Maybe, but don't forget that a good majority of Mac users have to use Windows at work and will surf the web from there.- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -2/+1Also, most people use Windows at work and DON'T use the Internet (or use it very little) while working.
Mac users will typically be heavier technology/Internet users than the average PC users (for many reasons, but in a nutshell most people who have a computer and use it for limited things will have a Windows machine).
Those two factors swing the web usage share heavily into Mac's favour over the actual market share figures (which are around 5% Mac, 94% PC and 1% Linux/other) for actual computer ownership/use. - fugazied, on 01/05/2009, -0/+2Thats true for me at least. Mac user forced onto windows at work. Unless you are working for a design company, video production, audio production, most paper pushing offices are on windows still. Yeah business don't use the internet?
- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -2/+1Also, most people use Windows at work and DON'T use the Internet (or use it very little) while working.
- jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -8/+4Lets forget all the Businesses that have internet access as well.
Most people at work do not surf the net all day... mac users do. - MWeather, on 01/02/2009, -5/+7"Web share != overall market share. Perhaps we Mac users just spend more time on the net?"
Perhaps most people spend most of their web browsing time at their XP workstation at work. Apple users would need to do a lot of browsing after 5 and on the weekends to skew their numbers higher than they actually are.
If anything, this figure undercounts Mac owners.- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -1/+2No, this overcounts Mac owners.
1) Mac owners will typically be heavier Internet users due to the young demographic among other things. Most of the people who own a computer and don't use it heavily will be Windows users (by default - think of people who check their email every day but do limited surfing except for Facebook). Mac users tend to be heavy technology and Internet users (just look at Digg). Macs are expensive. Anyone who doesn't specifically decide to spend more for a Mac will go to the store and walk out with a Windows PC. If you're gonna buy an expensive Mac, chances are you plan on using it quite a lot.
2) At work, most people will have limited Internet access and/or will be busy working rather than accessing the web all day. Most workplaces are using Windows. So millions of people are using Windows computers all day without accessing the Internet much.
At my workplace, all the PCs run Windows XP or Vista, and most people are using them for work purposes most of the time.
Are the stats worldwide or US? FWIW I don't recall the last time I saw someone using a Mac in Australia (if ever except when they had those crappy slow ones with one mouse button at my university. Nobody ever wanted to use them). I see computers and laptops every day, but they are always running Windows.
- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -1/+2No, this overcounts Mac owners.
- Blitzenn, on 01/02/2009, -6/+1Do you know the difference between a web browser and an operating system? Apparently there are some confused Apple users in that regard.
- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -1/+3No one is confusing it. This isn't showing market share; it's showing which OS is being used to browse the web. That's the best you can do. Mac and PC users probably both have approx. the same percentage of people who don't browse the web. If it's 10%, that's another 10% Mac users and another 10% PC users. The overall percentages remain the same.
- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1@mylestaylor
There is obviously a larger percentage of PC users who don't access the web. PCs are used in more workplaces, and used by a more diverse range of people. Most Mac users are young(ish) and interested in technology.
The marketshare stats are around 94% Windows, 5% Mac and 1% other. Most of the change in market is XP losing marketshare to Vista and things like smartphones (particularly the iPhone) being used to access web content that was previously only practical on computers.
- poxonyou, on 01/18/2009, -0/+1Nice try. It's true these market share comparisons are misleading, but they're more misleading in regards to the popularity of Windows (and IE) than Macs. PCs own corporate environments, most colleges, which gives them a massive natural advantage in most of these market comparisons. A larger percentage of the Mac users are people who actually bought the computer for themselves, rather than using it because they have to for their job. This translates into more than 1/20 of your friends/coworkers likely having a Mac (more like more than half the people I know have one, I don't). The same goes for Firefox usage. Anyway, it's best to just look at the trends for each separate market share comparison. It's clear that since they've started tracking Macs, the percentage has continued to increase. That's what matters here.
- Nephersir7, on 01/02/2009, -5/+18"Web share != overall market share. Perhaps we Mac users just spend more time on the net?"
- googlegods, on 01/02/2009, -17/+7Doubtful... playing games is considered 'being on the web'
lol.- chillymanilli, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5err Mac? Playing Games?
Now I'm very confused??????????? - jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -5/+2um playing games is considered being on the internet?
True - if playing ONLINE games... geesh another mactard!
- chillymanilli, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5err Mac? Playing Games?
- lovemorgul, on 01/02/2009, -1/+5historically maintained or grown its share following the holiday spike and often uses the season as a platform for further gains.
- FireXtol, on 01/02/2009, -11/+14In other news Vista is over 17%.
- Commodus, on 01/02/2009, -4/+11That's actually pretty BAD. Think about it: Windows 7 is due in less than a year. In other words, the majority of Windows users will be running XP almost three years after Vista was released and will probably skip an entire OS generation if they don't just keep to XP as long as possible.
- FireXtol, on 01/02/2009, -2/+2Not really. XP 'downgrade licenses' are popular. 2001-2002 Was the (start) era of the Athlon XP/P4. Systems that still out-power some portables(netbooks). And with a decent AGP card(which are dirt cheap) and 1 or 2 GB of RAM are capable of even most DX9/DX10 games.
That was huge for Windows XP. It had upgraders. Vista... not so much. Most people, afaik, as well as most businesses decided Vista was not the upgrade for them(failure to ROI?). There was a leap made technologically that software still hasn't caught up with. Substituting eye-candy for functionality and/or innovation is not a winning plan.
They did it once with XP(2k+candy). They tried it with Vista(XP+candy-drivers+drivers+bloat++) and their adoption rates are about 1/3rd of XP's. - MWeather, on 01/02/2009, -1/+1Vista needs more ++ and less #
Then again, so does Gnome.
- FireXtol, on 01/02/2009, -2/+2Not really. XP 'downgrade licenses' are popular. 2001-2002 Was the (start) era of the Athlon XP/P4. Systems that still out-power some portables(netbooks). And with a decent AGP card(which are dirt cheap) and 1 or 2 GB of RAM are capable of even most DX9/DX10 games.
- jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -2/+8"That's actually pretty BAD. Think about it:"
When MS came out with XP, people were even slower to migrate from windows 98 !!!
But then again, every generation seems to thinks they are the only statistic in history.
- Commodus, on 01/02/2009, -4/+11That's actually pretty BAD. Think about it: Windows 7 is due in less than a year. In other words, the majority of Windows users will be running XP almost three years after Vista was released and will probably skip an entire OS generation if they don't just keep to XP as long as possible.
- glitchbit, on 01/02/2009, -14/+9it is only a matter of time before all Microsoft IIS servers lay down the ban hammer on those rebels.
****************************************************************
ATTENTION: You have been banned from the internets!
You must use a Windows OS, preferably with IE7
*****************************************************************- ajhaji, on 01/02/2009, -7/+3That would be the day I stop visiting all IIS websites. Linux/Apache are way better at serving up websites. IIS is slow, a pain to set up, and a royal pain to keep secure.
- MtheoryX, on 01/02/2009, -1/+5Actually, there are other servers that are considered even better than Apache or IIS. Like lighttpd, for example.
- Blitzenn, on 01/02/2009, -0/+1Interesting that you believe you can tell the difference from a consumption end. lol interesting actually.
- MtheoryX, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1@Blitzenn: That's a very good point.
However, when I see a page ending in "aspx" I can be pretty sure it's not running on Linux/Apache.
- Nightlurker, on 01/02/2009, -5/+14That would be the day mac users gets locked out from 0.2% of the web..
- mrBitch, on 01/02/2009, -1/+5Zing!
- chillymanilli, on 01/02/2009, -5/+4still 100 times the number of mac servers
- gcnaddict, on 01/02/2009, -0/+1Netcraft claims, as of December 2008, that Microsoft servers held 33.81% market share.
That's more than 1/3 of the internet.
- bentman78, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4I run several IIS servers and Apache servers here at my job. IIS in 2003 and 2008 are very secure. They are a pain to keep secure for inexperienced admins I'm sure, but I've been using IIS since NT 4 days and Apache about the same time and I've never had problems on any of the servers where I've had full admin access.
They both serve a certain customer base. I work in a place that uses the .Net platform extensively and the servers we have perform well and do their job fine. Same with our Redhat servers running Apache. It's the admin and rarely the software that is the problem.
http://www.infoworld.com/article/07/06/29/26OPseca ... - mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -0/+1No way they could get away with that these days.
- ajhaji, on 01/02/2009, -7/+3That would be the day I stop visiting all IIS websites. Linux/Apache are way better at serving up websites. IIS is slow, a pain to set up, and a royal pain to keep secure.
- orlyfactor, on 01/02/2009, -4/+3Justin Long has been getting around.
- glitchbit, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5with your mom.
sorry someone was/had to do it.
- glitchbit, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5with your mom.
- opticsnake, on 01/02/2009, -8/+3Net Applications results != all results. Check the results at w3schools http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_os.asp
- eatrains, on 01/02/2009, -0/+8The W3Schools stats only measure visitors to the W3Schools site, so their stats are pretty much worthless.
- homercles337, on 01/02/2009, -23/+9I do not understand religion. I dont come to Digg for religion. Cant all macophiles in the Church of Apple just make appleinsider.com their homepage and leave the rest of us alone?!
- MtheoryX, on 01/02/2009, -1/+7Not all of us fit in that mold. I dislike them as much as anyone; they make the rest of us look bad.
- djgreedo, on 01/03/2009, -0/+2Nah, they don't make the rest of you look bad. They make themselves look like idiots, but most of us have the brains to realise they are just a subgroup of Mac users (a particularly vocal, dogmatic, unintelligent, immature subgroup).
- Misogyny, on 01/02/2009, -4/+22I don't understand bitching. I don't come to Digg for bitching. Can't all the little bitches just block the categories they don't like, or go to Reddit and leave the rest of us alone?!
- falafelkiosken, on 01/02/2009, -4/+5you don't have to click everything on the front page
- MtheoryX, on 01/02/2009, -1/+7Not all of us fit in that mold. I dislike them as much as anyone; they make the rest of us look bad.
- aserer511, on 01/02/2009, -10/+2we'll win em back with 7 :)
- Fubarepublic, on 01/02/2009, -3/+6You mean Vista ME
- Warom, on 01/02/2009, -3/+2I don't understand, for Windows 7, Microsoft is rewriting lots of Vista code to make it more optimised and adding some new features. Isn't that exactly what Apple does seeing as though 10.4 and 10.5 look incredibly similar but with a slightly different colour and different dock?
Oh but ofcourse it is so hip to laugh at Microsoft.
This is just like when all the OpenSource folk started saying Zune sucks and Opensource is better before finding out the code that was bad was infact OpenSource.
I'm not a Microsoft Fanboy , I am merely stating that they aren't so bad. - aserer511, on 01/12/2009, -0/+1I mean you're a moron
- Warom, on 01/02/2009, -3/+2I don't understand, for Windows 7, Microsoft is rewriting lots of Vista code to make it more optimised and adding some new features. Isn't that exactly what Apple does seeing as though 10.4 and 10.5 look incredibly similar but with a slightly different colour and different dock?
- Fubarepublic, on 01/02/2009, -3/+6You mean Vista ME
- DangerCollie, on 01/02/2009, -9/+9Trend seems to be picking up steam. I'm guessing the Windows fanboyz will be in denial all the way to the ground.
First it was the smug "We have 97% of the desktops out there."
Still pretty smug at 95%.
Today IE has dropped below 70% and Windows below 90. Considering the size of the pool, the numbers are changing pretty fast. A single percentage point represents a huge amount of money for MS.- FireXtol, on 01/02/2009, -3/+1Yea... because 89.6% is so far before 90.
A single percentage point [of paying customers]* represents a single percentage point of money.
But that's not even really true. Most of MS profit is made from OEMs. So as long as PCs still come shipped with Windows on them, Microsoft has little to worry about.
Buy a new PC? Remove Windows.... Install <other OS> MS still banks. It could even be helpful! Lessening the support calls and such. - DigitalisAkujin, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4lol smug?
facts are facts
You're getting 10% share during holidays cause no one i at work and a bunch of people just got new computers (of which more then 10% are macs). Plus you have IPhones now adding to the OSX market share. - jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -1/+2While I agree with the browser bit.
Moves like this are almost nothing especially with Apple trying to market the web as much as possible.
Most machines are in offices which restrict internet usage while mac users almost exclusively use their computers to surf the internet and do email. - t3hbagel, on 01/03/2009, -0/+4Apple computers are extremely trendy right now, there's no denying that. They know their target audience (young adults) and their marketing has definitely been effective. Ever seen that picture of a college lecture hall that's 90% Macbooks?
These college-aged kids are also the ones using the internet most heavily, which skews these numbers in favor of Apple.
- FireXtol, on 01/02/2009, -3/+1Yea... because 89.6% is so far before 90.
- cameltoenail, on 01/02/2009, -19/+6The numbers are skewed by all the hipster dufus authors surfing the web at Starbucks.
Plus, what else can you do with a Mac?- piradians, on 01/02/2009, -2/+7I make my living on mine.
- AzzX, on 01/02/2009, -2/+3Pretty sure the source "Net Applications" are on a few spyware blacklists. This would explain why.
- theberlindoctor, on 01/02/2009, -5/+6This has to be because of the Iphone.
- s0ny, on 01/07/2009, -0/+1The iPhone is .56%, for comparisons sake all of Linux is .72%
- WombleSlayer, on 01/02/2009, -3/+8But if the numbers keep on rising, how will people be non-conforming by buying a Mac?
- Warom, on 01/02/2009, -1/+1Use Haiku :)
- gordigor, on 01/02/2009, -1/+3See Ipod
- DelMonte, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4They'll stop buying Macs, just like they stopped buying iPods when they got popular... Oh wait, they didn't...
- jabberwolff, on 01/02/2009, -6/+5Backlash agaist Mac followers has turned to an altime high... because Apple now has a decent profile... people are actually looking at its utility and comparing.
When they do this, this is when people start switching back to PCs.- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4Who is switching back to PCs? There are people who know people who have switched back. Not enough people are switching back to actually notice. A few here and there maybe. If people actually were, we'd see tons of people returning their Macs and we don't see that; at least not where I work.
- intellimouse, on 01/02/2009, -2/+1I switched back to a PC.
- t3hbagel, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1Apple is really trendy right now, it's up to the actual product to keep people coming back for a second or third computer from them.
- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -1/+2Yea, that's what I'm wondering. It used to be something special when you met another Mac user, but now it's so commonplace that people look at you weird if you get excited. Time for the market share to stop growing. :P
- chillymanilli, on 01/02/2009, -5/+2What difference does it actually make to the 10% of mac users or anyone for that matter?
- Commodus, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4More web share means more Mac users; more Mac users means web designers and app developers have to consider the Mac much more than they did in the past.
- intellimouse, on 01/02/2009, -2/+1We don't have to consider the Mac. Nope, we don't have to. Especially since the developer tools are retarded compared to what you get on Windows.
- fugazied, on 01/05/2009, -0/+2Actually the reverse is true unless you are developing for ASP.NET. Python, PHP, Ruby all have multiple IDEs on mac and are easily installed and configured on mac. Why do you think so many sys admins run around with macbook pros? Remember it's a unix backend in OS X, it's great for plugging into other unix systems quickly and most of those unix commands are already in place.
I code in VIM, I don't use expensive proprietary software locked down to windows. Besides I can't think of a developer tool you are referering to? Eclipse is available for mac? You are probably talking some craptastic drag and drop .net 'developer' tool made for noobs by microsoft?
- Commodus, on 01/02/2009, -1/+4More web share means more Mac users; more Mac users means web designers and app developers have to consider the Mac much more than they did in the past.
- Mockylock, on 01/02/2009, -1/+6This isn't related much to the story, but it still makes me laugh to think back... I worked in the same building as an Apple development office. When they first moved in (last year), they had your obvious Apple workstations and some servers. Behind those boxes were over 20-30 Dell Poweredge servers that were to be installed into the server room. Irrelevant, but funny.
- chillymanilli, on 01/02/2009, -3/+1HA! very funny you david Letterman?
- phill, on 01/02/2009, -0/+4The reason they have all those Poweredge server is because Linux works much better as a server than anything else.
I use Mac's for all my desktops, and Linux/FreeBSD for all my servers.- t3hbagel, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1Exactly. Those XServes are overpriced and underperforming.
The Mac OS is terrible as a web server because of its inefficiencies at delivering content. Price and performance are huge in the server world, and that's why there are about 10 Mac servers in our datacenter, but it's full of HP / Dell / Supermicro servers.
- t3hbagel, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1Exactly. Those XServes are overpriced and underperforming.
- mdude85, on 01/02/2009, -3/+2"Both Apple's computers and cellphones were responsible for much of the erosion of Windows' share."
Can this little morsel of fanboyism be proven quantitatively? I mean, I like Apple as much as the next guy (a little less than 10% of the time), but Windows lost 1 point and Apple gained .5 points, so I'm not sure how "much of the erosion of Windows share" can be attributed to Apple. It seems like, at the very very best, half of the erosion of Windows share can be attributed to Apple.- Blitzenn, on 01/02/2009, -1/+1The article mixes up browser hits with Operating system ownership. How much validity can you bet on with that mistake up front?
- mdude85, on 01/02/2009, -0/+0Well, not very much...and the article being from AppleInsider doesn't help either.
- Commodus, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1Do you know basic percentage math? Good!
Microsoft's share went down about 1%. Apple share went up several tenths of a percent while everyone else saw much smaller gains. Think about that for a moment!
- Blitzenn, on 01/02/2009, -1/+1The article mixes up browser hits with Operating system ownership. How much validity can you bet on with that mistake up front?
- mrbusinessnews, on 01/02/2009, -9/+1And Apple is just getting started!
- adbo, on 01/02/2009, -2/+4Just getting started? They've been around since the 70's.
- camilos007, on 01/02/2009, -7/+1Inaccurate! Everyone knows Mac users are too cool to spend time on the internet.
- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -0/+1I guess I'm not a Mac user than?
- Retsep, on 01/02/2009, -5/+3I work at a Fortune 500 company and we are seeing around 5%. I think these figures are bogus. We're an ordinary enough service (insurance) that we shouldn't be that under represented. Also it has been at 5% for a very long time, moving up and down at most a few tenths of a percent.
- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -0/+5I doubt people just sit on your website browsing around over the holidays. You're watching one website and these figures are from millions of web sites. I think I'll trust them over your one website traffic.
- Blitzenn, on 01/02/2009, -7/+3I draw a more correct conclusion than the author does. Why are the web browsing numbers disproportionately high for Apple users (less than 2% total CPU ownership versus 10% of browser hits)? Because there isn't much useful software for their local machine. Duh! They have to browse the web because there isn't anything else on the machine to use.
- mylestaylor, on 01/02/2009, -0/+2You know, the funny thing about people arguing about all this stuff. Is it true, is it not true, what does it mean? Who cares? It doesn't really make any difference. Reality doesn't change just because it got reported. Just because some article says that Apple has more market share, it doesn't magically give them more if people believe them or make their market share drop if people don't believe it.
- zaskar, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1I dont care !
But I am clearly confused because I do care that other people care. - nitewing98, on 01/03/2009, -0/+3Funny, Windows users always feel the need to argue the numbers downward. Why is that? After also reading today that IE usage fell below 70%, I'd say it's pretty clear that Mac, Linux, and open source software like Firefox are definitely making a dent in MS's share of, well, everything.
You can argue a specific story away, but when you look at the larger picture, you'll be able to discern the actual trend. - kreatre2007, on 01/03/2009, -0/+1This is great... although I have always been very dubious of using internet access as a true measurement of market share.
- ratsg, on 01/04/2009, -0/+1marked as inaccurate. I don't think that it is anywhere this low.
- dcolley, on 01/04/2009, -0/+3I was in an Apple store this weekend. Unlike all the other empty stores in the mall, the Apple store was packed. It's always packed. At least, one computer maker is doing things right.