New MiG-35 OLS video

By Pavel | April 6, 2007 on 5:21 pm | In Aviation Video, MiG-35, Mikoyan, Smotr | 105 Comments

Right-click to download New MiG-35 OLS video.
33,2 Mb, 20:04, 480 x 360, wmv
Amazing material about new Optical Locator System (OLS) of MiG-35. Smotr program from NII PP – Science and research institute of precise instruments, which has won the MiG corporation tender for the new MiG-35 OLS.
Russian language, translation inside the post.

MiG-35 OLS

The newest Russian fighter MiG-35 has become a star of latest airshow “Aero India 2007″. Visitors weren’t able to get their eyes out of this plane. Foreign pilots had felt a big luck if they were able to have a test flight on 4++ generation fighter.

But from the most beginning almost nobody has paid attention to some new features in the overall view of the plane. Only most attentive experts have spotted the new shape of the onboard OLS (optical locator station) and some new elements on the plane. It says a lot for the specialists. MiG corporation team didn’t make a secret out of it – on the airshow in Bangalore MiG-35 has presented completely new Russian product – OLS. It has attracted a lot of specialists’ attention, today in the world there is no similar systems.

It looks like the development of such a system took dozens of years. But current project has started only several years ago. It has begun from the visit of MiG specialists to the NII PP – Federal space agency science and research institute of the precise instruments.

MiG-35 OLS

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “One day we met RSK MiG deputy chief designer and he has asked us a simple question: “Do you know avionics?”. We answered him that in general yes, but never had such developments. He said that it is very good and gave us several technical task definitions to check. And asked us not to discuss it with professional avionics designers.”

Such unusual request was explained very easily. MiG engineers were looking for people who could do OLS development from zero, ignoring existing experience. Only this way it was possible to make a completely new system in short time period.

MiG engineers have defined basic points of the optical locator system development:
- multispectrality. System should work both in visible and IR ranges
- integrity. TV and IR systems, laser ranging system should be united in one solid construction
- system should work on wide angles, up to 360 and identify shapes of aerial and ground targets

MiG-35 OLS

Before this meeting with MiG specialists, NII PP was dealing mostly with space technologies – it was developing devices for the communication and instruments for the space vehicles movements parameters measuring.

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “By that time we had good experience. Our orbit ranging systems for the tasks of mapping were in space for about 50 times already. It was built the net of laser stations to detect changes in space vehicles evolutions. We had a very good progress in laser space communication systems too.”

Right now you may see the newest laser communication system. Soon this exact device will be delivered to the ISS and will provide Russian spacemen with stable wide data channel with Earth. Space devices from the GLONAS (Russian global navigation system) net are equipped with NII PP instruments.
Even on the satellites of the GPS and Galileo systems there are deflectors created here, in the NII PP.

MiG-35 OLS

It is well-known that devices on the unmanned space vehicles should meet two main requirements. The First one is reliability.

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “If some device becomes unserviceable it means failure of all the mission, it is loss of really big money. It is cost of spacerocket, space unit, it’s unfullfilled obligations.”

Second requirement: devices should be built using hi-tech technologies. Besides, it should have maximal functionality, minimal weight, meet extremely wide requirements by the temperature and mechanical influence, and in addition – should work without any service for a long time.

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “We get used to it. We always had to do really reliable high-tech devices. This what starting requirements were again.”

Technical solutions tested on the spaceships were put into basement for the new OLS complex of MiG-35 fighter.
It was announced tender on the new OLS for the MiG fighters and terms were defined.

MiG-35 OLS

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “We have put a task for a very small time limits, it’s very unusual for the development. Besides it was the first time we met business relationships, when it is “now or never”. There is no time to wait. There is nobody to complain to. And there is nobody to ask for additional funds.”

Main competitors of the NII PP in this tender were developers of the first OLS with their huge experience.

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “And then it started. When the first test flights took place, everybody started to believe in us because of results we have shown.”

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “New OLS is much more effective. Two-three times only by range. Old OLS didn’t have TV channel, so it means no picture at all – no TV, no IR. That’s why some of the functions just was impossible to implement.”

MiG-35 OLS

At the end of the story NII PP has won the tender on the OLS complex for the MiG-35 fighter.
OLS, as well as radar, allows to detect targets and aim weapon systems. But, unlike the radar, OLS has no emission which means – can’t be detected. OLS works like a human eye – it gets picture and analyzes it. Usually it’s been said radars are the eyes of the plane. But to be exact, it’s more locator device, like whales has. But OLS is really the eyes of the plane and they are very sharp.

OLS works not only in visible bands. Very important part of “plane vision” is IR picture. NII PP engineers has chosen more short-wave bands for the matrix, which has increased sensitivity of the complex in several times and has increased detection range greatly.

MiG-35 OLS may see USAF stealth planes very nicely as well. Today it’s impossible to hide the plane from the complex of powerful optics with IR vision.

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “Stealth technology today is mostly decreasing it’s visibility in radio bands. But for the optical bands, especially in IR ranges the main parameter is temperature. And you can do nothing about it. Engines have great flow of hot air which can be detected perfectly from the big range if we are behind the plane. If we are going face to face, so first of all we still see some part of this flow and second we can see the front edges of wings which meet air flow and become warm too.”

MiG-35 OLS

NII PP engineers solved one more problem, very well-known among the military pilots. On fast speeds of modern fighters every piece of dust makes great harm to the glass of OLS, the glass becomes blurred. It causes great decrease of all the complex effectiveness. New OLS uses leuco- sapphire to be a second firm material after artificial diamonds. Time of life for such a glass is much longer. Leuco-sapphire is clear for all the OLS emissions and doesn’t corrupt the signal, which is extremely important for the optical systems.

All these innovations have allowed to receive unique results.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “During the OLS tests we got MiG-29 detection ranges up to 45 km from the tail and 15 km from the front. Ranging device effective range for the aerial targets is 15 km, for the ground targets – more then 20 km.”

MiG-35 OLS

New OLS is intelligence system of technical vision to work in realtime of fast combat environment. In air combat complex allows:
- detect not-afterburning target on the 45km range and more;
- identify this target on 8-10km range;
- estimate aerial target range up to 15 km.

For the ground targets complex allows:
- tank effective detection range up to 15 km, aircraft carrier – 60-80 km;
- identify the tank type on the 8-10 km, aircraft carrier type – 40-60 km;
- estimate ground target range up to 20 km.

MiG-35 OLS

Viktor Shargorodsky, NII PP general designer: “First one was the optical-locator system for the MiG fighter, that time it had no MiG-35 designation yet. First of all, we liked to work on it very much, very exciting task and field, besides we were able to use and apply our space experience very effectively.”

When MiG corporation got new OLS, they decided to improve it. So it was born the whole complex of four optical systems.
Besides the OLS it were:
- on the right air intake body – downward-looking station, which in addition to the down hemisphere targets detection and identification can be used for the mapping;
- on the wingtips – two laser emission detectors

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “Object-glass of the laser detector is based on the fish-eye idea, it allows field of view to be even a little bit bigger then all the hemisphere. This device allows to detect the moment when external laser is emitting and to estimate the direction to it.”

And the last parts of complex are two lenses of the attacking missiles detection.

MiG-35 OLS

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer:
“Information about coming missile is being analyzed from the three stages of its progress: the missile launch, the work of main propulsion unit and on the distances less then 5 km missile can be detected by the warm head.”

The effective missile launch detection range is more then 50 km.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “Our system allows to evaluate the level of missile danger – on the distances more then 5 km we need to detect, if this missile is dangerous for the plane.”

New complex consist of many technological know-how’s. In fact, it is an aircraft device built by the space standards. Complex uses unique laser. In the previous OLS it was used laser based on the pump lamps. Its effectiveness was very low – up to 90% of all the energy was lost on the warming, not to the laser beam. In the NII PP for the first time OLS uses laser with semiconductor pump. As a result, laser effectiveness has grown up greatly.

All the units are united into one system with help of interface unit. Complex is checking aerial field constantly and is able to detect dangerous objects by itself.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “In addition, our system has high-level calculation unit. As a part, there are three CPUs of the Pentium4 level. They help to analyze the picture, allow system to work in overview mode, detect targets on long distances and on the sun-lighted clouds background.”

In the first time this complex uses fiber channel for the data transmission. Fiber was adopted especially for this complex. It passes digital signal and the transfer speed reaches 600 Mbit/s – it’s brilliant parameter.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “For example, this is one of the IR detectors. This is narrow-field detector. Here all the data are being passed by the fiber channel.”

Besides, new fiber channel is very reliable – by the words of the engineers it will work even if heavy tank goes over it.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “Actually this is almost the first time when fiber channel is being used in the combat aviation, so we had to go through many doubts of the aviation specialists. It was known that fiber channel is unreliable, that it often brakes down and that plane vibrations affect the data transmission.”

More of it, new complex has totally new optical-electronic flight videoregistration system with a hard drive. It records everything that pilot sees.

Optical electronic complex gives a pilot totally new abilities. From now on not only all the information, but picture of the target will appear on the monitors in several modes by the pilot choice. In general, new complex can provide pilot with picture of what’s going on around the plane in most useful view, which of course will increase the chances of the fighter-pilot in modern air combat.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “Pilot can choose to see the picture from the front OLS in visible TV mode, or mixed visible and IR view. Pilot can change the level of information mixing. From the laser emission detectors pilot receives only coordinates of the emitting objects.”

Young specialists of the institute took very active part in the development of the new complex. Actually this NII PP project for the MiG-35 is the first one after USSR fall, where main part of the development was done by young specialists.

Viktor Sumerin, NII PP deputy general designer: “Our success was supported by the fact this development was handled by the very young team. There is a backbone of very experienced space engineers and there are young people with clean brains. They have no fear to use modern technologies and solutions.”

OLS created in NII PP is not just another modern instrument. This is the totally new device which completely fits the idea of 5th generation combat plane. Already today parameters of the OLS are about ten times better then the ones of old systems. But NII PP is not going to stop. The next stage of the development will be to upgrading the optical complex intelligence level and to combine it with onboard radar.

Using high technologies engineers are going to improve their OLS. “Space-born” eyes of the newest Russian MiG-35 fighter will become even more sharp.


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  1. Man oh man, that thing’s super cool!

    It’s nice to see MiG making a strong comeback with all this new technology.

    I bet the 35 could give the Raptor a run for it’s money in medium/close AA combat.

    Comment by Steve — April 6, 2007 #

  2. Very interesting report!

    PS: nice translation

    Comment by Buran-Pilot — April 7, 2007 #

  3. Yea ,now it can see stealthy planes.
    As i got it right that little thing is covered with sapphire glass, to prevent scratches at high speeds.
    Man, the 35 looks awesome!!

    Comment by nameless — April 7, 2007 #

  4. I am Indian

    Hope they buy the MIg 35… looks sexy
    is sexy :)

    Comment by kaRadi — April 11, 2007 #

  5. its is best plane developed by russia in recent times.cheers to the people build it,i personally feel india will purchase this aircraft than american one.because it has every thing to beat the rapture.built to kill.

    Comment by I.rajenekanth — April 21, 2007 #

  6. I don’t know how will the OLS help in close combat (I might be proven wrong, though) but man! That stuff multiplies the beauty factor of MiG-35 10-folds.

    Hope to see RMAF having one of these in their air fleet =3

    Comment by Angel Mutsumi — May 7, 2007 #

  7. Oh man! This optic device slaps every western equivalent!

    Comment by Littlehui — May 12, 2007 #

  8. I am also glad to see the Russian aircraft industry coming back. But I dont know about it taking on the F-22 Raptor though. AS an american I love the aricraft! But I do think that it can be taken down by the flanker series of aircraft. And I also think that if you use stealth in an fighter you are doubting the pilots ability to fight like a true pilot and not some panzy who needs stealth!

    Comment by Devildog — May 16, 2007 #

  9. Man, are you guys for real? Take another look at detection ranges and realize that the Raptor will be engaging the Mig35 long before deciding to blow it out of the sky in a WVR engagement… Come on, people… This little gadget is nothing better than our old Lantirn pods, which are 2 generations before the Sniper pod, which themselves can’t touch the sensors on the Raptor… Realize now that no amount of “baggage” slung on a Mig or Sukhoi makes a 5th gen fighter… Why do you think the US long ago decided not to waste the time and money improving the F-15 any more (STILL unchallenged after 30 years!)… We experimented with these little cockpit canards, and thrust vectoring long before the Russians did (Hell, we were experimenting way back with forward swept wings like on the “Berkut” – It was called the X-29… X for EXPERIMENTAL)… Calling it a 4+++ gen fighter is ridiculous, but if it makes you feel better, fine… It can’t hold the Raptor’s jock strap!.

    Comment by TIZ — May 26, 2007 #

  10. Littlehui: Back in the 70s the F-14 was carrying an IRST/camera package with a range of >80 miles.
    Devildog: By your reasoning, I guess we should throw the missile into the trash because you don’t trust a pilot’s gun abilities… And then I suppose we should throw the gun in the trash because we doubt the pilot’s ability to intimidate the opponent by screaming at him through his cockpit as he zips by at 700 mph! What’s wrong with you!… The Russians are pissed because we’ve developed a tool (like speed, like a missile, like a jammmer) that they don’t reckognize for what it is, which was developed because they didn’t read their own physicist’s notes, and for which they do not have an answer for. Use your head! If stealth is such a panzy weapon, then I guess all the Russians who visit this site should be real pissed off at you, because guess what they are trying to develop for their Pak Fa? If you don’t understand what stealth brings to the game (I do think there are some of you out there that truly do understand it, but don’t like to admit it) then don’t speak about it.. People like myself are just waiting for you to make statements like you did.

    Comment by TIZ — May 30, 2007 #

  11. … The Raptor is not going to have a problem with these ridiculous ‘toys’: It’s like putting a scope on a pistol… Even if you could see your target, you’re STILL using a pistol… The Raptor uses a sniper rifle…Good luck with that !

    Comment by TIZ — May 30, 2007 #

  12. TIZ I agree with you that Mig 35 against F 22 would have very small chance and that this system is very similiar to the LANTIRN at least in the concept. F 22 stealth technologie is very complex and radars are useless so far against it (S400 missile system radar guaranties to detect 2 (two) square centim Radar Cross Section (RCS) target flying at 2.5 mach at 15 m altitude from 50 km, this is so far the only radar in the world that should detect stealth aircraft. F 22s’ RCS should be 1 square centimeter when not useing its APF-77 radar when this radar is turned on F 22 is not stealth in certain wavelenght as antena is uncovered and it has around 1 square meter thus increasing F 22 RCS 100 000 times! However it is very hard to guess exact wavelenght in which it is opearating as this is frequently changed on each one of 1500 T/R segments). So different approach had to be chosen in order to challenge F 22.

    I think cleaver approach was chosen by russian engineers (they did exactely what I was thinking about for years). They identified the weakest points of F 22. These are:

    1. Its primary weapon AIM-120 AMMRAM.

    2. Its Infra Red signature.

    AMMRAM “issue”

    1.1. There is couple of key tasks regarding evading any attacking missile (AMMARAM included):

    1.1.1. To detect its start (that it was fired) – this is provided by SOAR system (System of missile start detection). Start of the missile is detected as far as 50km from Mig 35 from any direction. To determin where it was fired from and what is its predicted flight path. This is also provided by SOAR system.

    1.1.2. To follow the missile approaching Mig 35. This can be provided by SOAR system up to 50km when engine is still working or up to 5km when flying only from persistence with engine burned out by detecting missile body itself. In the front hemisphere also powerfull ZHUK-AE active array radar offers an option of active defence against closeing AMMRAMS (its RCS is around 40 square centimetres). It can detect multiple missiles (up to 30) and six of them can be followed and attacked useing R-77 missiles. F 22 has 6 (six) AMMRAMS Mig 35 8 (eight) R 77.

    1.1.3. Mid course position update (without it EFFECTIVE range of AMMRAM is around 20km only) of the target for AMMRAM can be detected by L-150 radio warfare device which deliveres that information – this is the best moment for Mig 35 to start to maneuvre and change position rapidly as next 10 seconds approx. AMMARM flies by inertia as pre-programed by transmission from the launching platform F 22.

    1.1.4. 10 km from the Mig 35 AMMRAM turns on its active microwave millimetric readar seeker, its work is detected by L-150 receivers in the wing tips of Mig 35. This can jammed with the stand off towed jammer if Mig 35 flies in subsonic speed. There are in russia alternative jammers of AMMRAM under development with heavy funding from INDIA and IRAN.

    1.1.5. APG 77 radar (from F 22) ilumination of Mig 35 can be detected by L 150 system or developed sytems that we do not have details of but it was anounced that they are under the intensive development soon to be finisheds.

    1.1.6. ALL SIMULATED fights between F 22s and F 15s, F 16s lacked ALL of above mentioned
    symptomps of REALY FIRRED AMMRAM – flash of the start, burning engine, flying hot object approaching attacked aircraft, midd course update of AMMRAM and millimetric microwave radar of the radar seeker in the last phase of AMMRAM flight.

    So WE CAN THROW OUT OF THE WINDOW ALL THE RESULTS OF THIS TRAININGS when we talk about Mig 35 if we are clever. They are just IRRELEVANT against Mig 35.

    Infra red signature.

    2.1. OLS-UEM/OLS-K system can detect aircraft in fully passive mode from 45 km in rear hemisphere and from 15 km from front hemisphere against NON AFTERBURNER aircraft DURING THE NIGHT when useing Thermal Imager. During the day with the TV camera it can easilly be OVER 200Km from any angle depending on air condition! For afterburner aircraft it is at least 2 x longer (30km resp 90 km). For this unknown (it is not known wheather cooled or uncooled) of unknown generation of unknown wavelenght with sensor matrix from 320 x 256 points (only detail I know) it is good result. This sensor will be replaced as well as optics and software. I have personal experience with the 2nd generation cooled Thermal Imager 640x 420 points with laser rangefinder made by SELEX England (now there is 3rd generation which is even better). I detected car from 25 km in the night despite it should be only possible up to 10km. Many producers claim very conservative parameters to avoid further complains of the customers. If such advanced TI would be used (and once it certainly will) it would increase performance of such a system by approx 50 to 200% (I do not know russian detector in TI).

    There is one significant disadvantage that could possibly increase the reach of this system against F 22 in front hemisphere of F 22 in the night! It is APG 77 radar active antena – if this thing would not be cooled down constantly by liquid cooler it would melt down – active antenas generate enormous heat, it is their only technical dissadvantage – other is their price.

    The most important about Mig 35 is that for the first time in history there is on the market for enemies of the USA aircraft that under certain conditions can challange F 22. I mean when it was possible with basic Mig 29 in 1999 over Serbia to evade 8 AMMRAMS just useing pilots eyes old RWR and terrain it would certainly be easier withe the systems instaled on Mig 35 – no doubt about it. And from Serbia another example this F 16s or F 15s that were shooting at Serbians Mig 29s were like F 22 for Serbians Mig 29s they never knew where they were, just brif warnings of RWR and than maneouvres.

    Also when used within the proper integrated Air defence network with good communication and passive detection devices in defender friendly terrain it could posses big threat against F 22. I am talking mainly about IRAN that is surrounded by mountains offten 4000 metres high, ideal for setting the traps for attackers.

    Comment by Alexander Pokryskin — May 31, 2007 #

  13. Just typical american babbling. Their being russian aircrafts and technologies doesn’t necessarily mean they are inferior to those made in the US of A. You guys just couldn’t accept the fact that the very people you so fondly call “inferior” just bested the technology used by your most advanced fighter. C’mon guys, just accept that fact and grow up!

    Comment by khu_khu — June 1, 2007 #

  14. Alexander: How does the fact that a radar is “Active” mean that it produces more heat than a “Passive” radar? The answer (for those who were impressed by Alexander’s BS) is that it doesn’t… A well-designed Active radar(like the apg-77) CAN produce less “heat signature” than a Passive radar (why do you think it IS liquid coooled, because it’s in the nose of a Stealth aircraft) – It’s all about how efficient the radar and cooling systems are. The fact that it is “active” has almost nothing to do with it, especially when the heating of the aircraft surface itself would overpower any effect of a radar warming up inside the nose cone(unless of course you also use an IR-reducing coating, which IS used in the Raptor)…

    Comment by TIZ — June 2, 2007 #

  15. TIZ, guys, I would really recommend you to move your discussion to the appropriate section of the forum:

    It’s much more useful and many people will join you there.

    By the topic I could say, that it is not only (and not at all, actually) in heating of radar, but the radar emission that makes plane shine like a star in active mode.

    Comment by Pavel — June 2, 2007 #

  16. Pavel…. As far as the heating not being an issue, that was exactly my point!…That Alex was talking out his a@% (Read the posts again)…And you also seem to think that because an array is an “active” array, it means that it somehow “shines like a beacon”… Active is not a “mode”! … An active array is much different from and far superior to a PESA or mechanical array because of its LPI capabilities, which KEEPS IT FROM SHINING LIKE A BEACON, unlike every other radar out there!… Any suggestions on where I can find someone who REALLY knows what an AESA is, what LPI means, why an IRST is not a wonder-device, why an F-16 can’t (and never will)compete with a Mig-35, and why Russia knows it must develop the Pak-FA while people like yourselves sit in a forum like this and claim that a gadget like this slung on Mig-29 somehow “under certain conditions can challange F-22″ (quoted from Alex)- I leave the forum members with this little tid-bit: “Under certain conditions”, I will entertain people who obviously don’t know what they are talking about… But NOT today… Go to Newsvine, talk to Bozzor, and then we’ll all chat… not about “theoreticals”, but about facts.

    Comment by TIZ — June 2, 2007 #

  17. TIZ, I already told you where you may find KNOWING people. Who wants – will find. Who doesn’t want – will claim.

    It’s up to you and only to you, whom to talk with and whom to listen to.

    And it’s quite different, if you want to hear something new and to discuss, based on facts, or you want to hear that you are right and brilliant.

    TIZ, you know something? You want to share some information? You don’t afraid your facts will be put under discussion? Welcome on forum!

    No more buzz comments here.

    Comment by Pavel — June 2, 2007 #

  18. The Weapon Paylod of Mig 35 is lesser then Hornet & Mirage 2000.This is a significant shortcoming if nuclear warheads are to be carried and particularly the central pilon should carry 3-4 t

    Please eloborate

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — June 6, 2007 #

  19. There is no comparison between Mig 35 & F-22
    The aircrafts are in different classes.

    Much depends on the situational awareness of the pilot and the Air Defence network components -comprising of the AEW aircrafts and EW & jamming systems in the dedicated ELINT/SIGNIT type aircrafts.

    In a tactical situation a Mig 35 ‘may’ have a chance but no one foregoes the early advantage.
    The Mig 35 will be detected much in advance unless in a networkcentric mode the F22 ‘s bearings could be continuously updated by a sattelite based thermal detection systems-SBIRs

    Lastly for the typical American Bullshit– They Bark more than they Bite AND They (F-15 & others)
    comprehensively lost to Indian pilots with SU-30 MKI because of not only the superior pilot skills but superior aircraft as well

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — June 8, 2007 #

  20. Russians can get the opder provided the payload
    is superior or equivalent to F-18/F-16
    The mig 35 should be able to operate truly
    in a multi tasking mode-Air superiority /BAI/CAS/
    arially refuelled long range attack capability–
    without any HW/SW changes.
    Ofcourse the prices have to be significantly lower

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — June 8, 2007 #

  21. Just what the Hell is wrong with you people in comparing a Mig to an F22? Come on, the Mig-29 is a 4th generation fighter whereas the F-22 is 5th gen – Hello! A good comparison should be the PAK-FA and the Raptor. The Mig-35 is a plane built to compete in the global market against F16′s, Gripens, F/A-18′s, Rafales etc. Face it, the Mig-35 would probably destroy the latest F16 in air-to-air combat with its Araamski-BVR Missile, no kidding pal. It is never intended at all to go up against American 5th gen fighter in the first place, although it never hurts to have some features to help detect them.

    Comment by Lil Nog — June 10, 2007 #

  22. Its not like everyday an Air Force from so and so country would be launching Nuclear weapons off of aircrafts anyway. They got Ballistic and Cruise missiles to do such a job. And people please stop comparing the Fulcrum to the F22…cmon one’s a 4th Generation fighter and the other is 5th gen. It would be so unfair, kinda like comparing a Pentium-3 to a Core 2 Duo, uh Hello!

    Comment by Bear — June 13, 2007 #

  23. Well, have to say that Polish pilots, during NATO training exercises made admirable performances. For example Dariuz Gardas, achived in Red Flag trials, 8 “kills”. His Mig 21Bis, based at Malbork Air base in Poland, exhibited a beautifull color scheme… Golden paint all over the aircraft and sporting 8 red stars for his achivements! (this was 3 years ago, because the entire Mig-21 fleet is retired, and polish now fly the F-16 under NATO re-organization structure)

    All this will impress anyone (the same as in the so publicised Indian F-15 trials) if it weren´t for the fact that Darius din´t achieve his mark riding a Mig-21 over american soil. He rode an american F-16 or perhaps an F-15. What ever the case, a well trained pilot will certainly achieve remarkable performances, no matter what air force he comes from or what aircraft he rides.

    You are trying to compare oranges with apples here in this forum. You have to be objective in your appreciations. Yes the Mig 30MKK beat the F-15 in India exercise. But… one needs to consider, that the F-15 is a 30 year old plantform, like somebody here said: Americans got tired of inproving with gadgetry on it… it was time to move to another level.

    F-15 is still unbeaten in combat, a record that, for better or for worse, is one of the most remarkable in aviation history. (150 vs 0) in real combat scenarios. What has maintained the F-15 reliable for so long, was his design and later, when better opponents arised, it was its avionics, improved weapons systems, reliable defensive platform and better pilot training.

    The Sukhoy 30MKK its truly superior to the F-15, you don´t need to say it, its at plain sight…. more powerfull engines, high ceiling, longer range, heavier payloads, better armed, more maneuvrable and sporting the latest russian techologies.

    But something most people don´t comprehend, is that in todays battlefields, maneuvrability alone doesn´t count much. You need improved BVR (Beyond visual range) capabilities, integrated weapons system plantform all over the plane and beyond (the entire squadron), permanent aerial warning control system over the field, reliable, comunnication network, early aerial warning system, supermaneuvrability, super cruise regime, vectorial nozzles trust, anti radar absorbing tecnologies, stealth doctrine implementation, stealthy capabilities, councealed engine design,
    internal weapons system, satelite guidance technology, integrated weapon delivery system.

    The same exercised in what Dariuz Gardas made his “tremendous” achivements, the F-22 “raptor” was tested recently, if my memory is right, it was at the Holloman AFB in western United States. What they did was por lack of a better word: Perfect!

    This exercises are unique, day by day, hour by our, entire flets of “Agressors” fight an electronic war with “electronic” missiles againts designated “Deffenders”. The rules are quite simple, the battle scenarios are arranged in determined positions with certain objectives. In general, “Agressors” are up againt more numerous a better armed “Deffenders”.

    At the end of the day, a pilot may end up with 3, 4 or 5 “kills” in to his personal count, during an entire week of exercise, Australian, German, Malasyan, Israeli or Polish pilots like Dariuz Gardas, may end up easelly with perhaps 8, 9 or 10 “kills”.

    The same goes with the so called “Indian exercise” of the F-15 debacle. Yes I admited that the Sukhoy beat the F-15, I ask, how many times the Su30 beat the F-15 (downed) during those trials? more over, how many times the Su-30 was downed too?

    You need to bring those figures first, before commiting in to a war of words here, talking non-sense with out proven facts of the so called F-15 debale.

    During Red Flags exercises and a like, almost all pilots are downed in one way or another during that week. Aggressors engage deffenders, usually “aggressors” are better aircraft than “deffenders”, lets say, F-18 against F-5 or A-4. Fewer F-18, better armed againt more maneuvrable, more numerous F-5. The exercise puts the “Aggressors” in to uncomfortable situation, the are no let to refuel, land or rearm, whilst the F-5 are allowed to land reequip, refuel and rearm. The are trowed again in to the fray with the F-18´s until, “Aggressors” run out of weapons, and they had to rely on maneuvres, pilot skill and strategy.

    The results are something like “aggressors” 34 “kills”, “Deffenders” 18 “kills”. And that proportion gaves the military generals the killing ration for a specific weapons plantform (the aircraft in question, F-18, F-15, F-22, etc)that is been measured in the exercise.

    With this example 34 will be divided by 18, resulting in a killing ratio for the F-18 od 1.8

    In the recent F-22 exercise I mentioned before, the whole thing was an astounding feat the kill ratio, went 241 vs 1 for the F-22 over Alaskan territory Fighting squadrons of F-15´s. The F-15 pilots mentioned that it was the most frustraiting exrercise the were involved.

    later they made a Red Flag exercise at Holloman, to harden things on the F-22 and the figure drpped to 39 vs 1. Stiil that accounted for the highest killing ration and aircraft had ever made in the history of trials.

    The F-22 simply got rid of all missiles before the first went down, that aircraft went down, not before taking himdelf 3 of the opponents.


    Comment by Alberto — June 20, 2007 #

  24. Guys can somebody enlighten me. I search for Mig-29 OVT in wikipedia or somethin’ and it pops-up Mig-35.
    So what’s the story between Mig-29OVT & Mig-35 (especially in terms of the powerplant-engine, TVC, maneuvrebility)??

    Comment by Aggelos — June 22, 2007 #

  25. the supposed indian pilots downing the f-15 were not done under real life situations. our pilots were not allowed to shoot at the distance of 105 km’s which the real misslies are capable of but at 45 km’s and they were not allowed to fire and forget either but had to track the missle the entire way. the indian pilots also used awacs to track the american pilots….let’s face it the f-22 will dominate the skies for many years to come

    Comment by witbred — June 24, 2007 #

  26. Aggelos – yes, Wikipedia was creating slight mess about MiG-35 for the certain moment I’ve edited it :)
    When I came there it looked like this:
    Now it looks more exact, like this:
    Thanks to Sergey Kuznetsov for his photo and his Smotr programs.

    In general, MiG-29OVT is just a demonstrator, there is no any warfare there. MiG-35 is complete, full-functional combat airplane.
    They use the same airframe, MiG-29M2. MiG-29OVT use basic RD-33 engines, but with vectored thrust engine nozzles. MiG-35 is using RD-33MK (navy modification) engines without any OVT.

    Comment by Pavel — June 25, 2007 #

  27. Thanks for the info. However here at the “powerplant” section you say that Mig-35 has TVC.

    Comment by Aggelos — June 25, 2007 #

  28. F15c and F15E are not 30 years old they are almost the same vintage as the SU-27 from which SU 30mki has been derived.F15s have had one engine upgrade(23000lb to 29000lb thrust) and numerous electronic and weopon system upgrades.

    I have always maintained that you canot compare the Mig35 and Raptor-They are decidedly different.

    What I am trying to emphasize was that in a complex network centric enviornment some times an
    inferior aircraft can shoot down the superior aircraft
    due to EW techniques/Jamming and early detection by AWACS/AEW SIGNIT aircrafts
    and SBIRs(Space based IR sensors) etc

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — July 16, 2007 #

  29. THE threat perception and Indian Geopolitical situation is different.
    The techtical aircrafts are the part of the “triad”- IRBM/AIRCRAFT/SEA BASED -That’s why
    the need for a quasi-strtegic aircraft with areial
    refuelling capabilities.
    THAT’S WHY THE TENDER IS FOR MRCA(Multi role) and not an air-superiority aircraft

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — July 16, 2007 #

  30. you don’t think that the engineers @ lockheed martin and in the U.S. defense industry (the us spends the most money on defense, period) know about infra red detection? They’ve been developing methods to shroud engines since the 80′s! The B-2 and the F-22 most likely can only be detected via IR directly from behind. They spent significant time on the F-22 shielding its IR signature. Trust me, the public and Russian intelligence don’t even know 20% of the F-22′s capabilities especially in regard to the stealth work (IR included) Lockheed has done. Optical, however is very unique and cannot as of yet be countered. But it would be like trying to find a jet painted in cloud scheme with an extra wide scope. He can be anywhere in 3d, very hard to find. Imagine being a submarine and having to look not just above and around with your periscope but down and around as well. Your plane blocks certain angles off and you cannot completely see all angles without using mult. viewers -> increasing drag and your own radar cross section

    Comment by Alex — July 22, 2007 #

  31. ungg…B2′s “Advanced” Propulsion system has been Noshir Gowadia..its designer

    Comment by ust Pass.... — July 28, 2007 #

  32. What stealth technology from USAF,what happen with F-117(they don`t talk about that shine beacon anymore,now is F-22,just wait for that beacon LOL)during agression over the Serbia 1999,you US&A “boy`s” think about that,how the hell that happen,so much money and pooooffffff….

    Comment by pop — August 2, 2007 #

  33. IR is not all that simple . Any object regardless of the heat’s direction can be detected.The detection is done by SBIR or Dedicated Signit /AEW aircraft.
    Much depends upon the sensors sensitivity and the DSP techniques.

    Regarding what an F22 can or cannot do is a classified affair and it is a sheer pleasant surprise that you are privy to such info???????

    Comment by Bhushan Sharma — August 3, 2007 #

  34. the prince!!! i feel deep love fooooooooooor him!!!!

    Comment by mann — August 7, 2007 #

  35. Yea right so why they don`t go and attack Russia with their f22 and not small country`s like US&A always do, so we can finally see how strong there f22 is and what nuke do they got,because i think it`s about time for WW3 so u all can stop posting here and see the result or maybe “not”………

    Comment by pop — August 8, 2007 #

  36. TIZ, you are full of $%^%$# i am an american too, know this, before you write something dont be so ignorant and do a little search for knowledge, wright know in a dog fight a mig or a sukoy can take down the best of what U S has and not only that the Rsuskies has developed misiles that you only as a pilot have 2 seconds to realize that you are fried with your f22 or the f15 needeless to say that f35 is a piece of garbage. shame to say TIZ even for an example an ak47 sells more tan the m16 plastic toy and an ak is more powerfull too. so TIZ read more usefull info and dont cocoon in ignarance OK its just and advice because the way you express info you need to research harder.

    Comment by joe — August 10, 2007 #

  37. I’m definitely not an expert on aircraft conception but I think the Americans are over estimating there aircraft superiority again. Like some one said here, the F22 was never faced with an actual real threat. I do believe that the F22 is maybe the best dam fighter airplane due to its early warning/detection. But the F22 it also insanely expensive. Some one only need to find a fatal weakness and that new expensive technologies has to be rethink again, again and again.

    Comment by Chris — August 25, 2007 #

  38. lantirn is no IRST kids. what this Mig35 has done is it connected the optical targeting pod to its IRST. its a very compelling design.

    if you guys look at the history of aircraft design usually planes that were design to fullfill a particular mission is the most successful design. like the almighty F-15 for example.

    the F22 is a answer for a question that never exist at the time it was created.thats why its like that.akward.for all its sophistication itdoesnt even have a link16!!

    Comment by pedro — September 2, 2007 #

  39. F_22 raptor is a child’s toy,MIG and SUKHOI is the best!!!

    Comment by stax-serbia — September 11, 2007 #

  40. Well well, we have heard it once already didn’t we? The famous guarantee from US aviators: “We are able to kill enemy fighters from such a long range that they do not even realise they’re under attack. Yes they will be dangerous from close in dogfight, but this doesn’t matter since noone will ever come close to us.”

    This guarantee was told all over the place when the mighty F4 phantom II came to scene. It seemed that with it’s powerfull radar, long range, scary speed and a large supply of SARH and IR missiles it will indeed dominate any future war.

    Until Vietnam, where MiGs way to often found their way to enter the F4 “privacy sphere” and engage it in a classic dogfight in which MiGs had the upper hand (especially the -17).

    Something tells me history is about to repeat.

    Comment by Unit — September 19, 2007 #

  41. No kidding, F_22 is going down!!!

    Comment by Aks — October 3, 2007 #

  42. EF owns the Raptor, and EF have big problems with jas grippen The swedes rule the skies!

    Comment by Amerigo Russki — October 12, 2007 #


    Comment by MAG — October 13, 2007 #

  44. The Indians at COPE2005 didn’t use AWACS, it was pure dogfight and the USAF lost bad. The USAF and Indian AF had two exercises, one at Gwalior in MP, the later one at Kalaikunda, WB, both cases Indian Su-30 and Migs proved superior, thats it, learn to live with it and accept gracefully. That way you can weed out your weaknesses. The Top Gun school at Miramar was made to address the US pilots weak dogfighting ability. I don’t understand with the US public, if they are whupped, instead of accepting humbly, they will go on a tirade against their opponents. Of course, real war would ulitmately prove who is better.

    Comment by Arup — October 23, 2007 #


    The MAPO-MiG enterprise claims the new fighter would be able to outperform the F-22 Raptor, the most advanced US air-superiority fighter. Although the primary mission of the MFI is air-superiority, unlike the F-22 the MFI is also capable of performing strike mission, and thus in both conception and configuration is more directly comparable to the similar multi-role EFA2000 Eurofighter. Like the American F-22, the MFI has a thrust vectoring system that allows it to make sharp turns. It also has similar stealth capabilities, with the canard, wing and fuselage structures incorporating carbon-fiber and polymer composite materials. Other stealth features include radar-absorbing covering, screening of radar-visible structure elements, and reduced heat signature. The fifth-generation pulse-doppler radar has a phased-array andtenna with electronic scanning to simultaneously attack over 20 targets. The aircraft can carry long-range air-to-air and air-to-surface guided missiles, and it is armed with a 30-mm cannon.

    Comment by Arup — October 23, 2007 #

  46. the russia 35 is able to out perform the advanced us f-22 or americans just grow up and adopt to the new russian it advance fighter aircrafts or father of all bombs.

    Comment by jameel — October 30, 2007 #

  47. i think that india has to purchase MIG-35 because of its lethality. and offcourse it is product of Russia our greatest strategic partner.

    Comment by himanshu trivedi — October 30, 2007 #

  48. The MIG 35 is going to beat the Raptor? Probably not, remember the F-15 is 131-0 over 25 yrs against the best Russian fighters. The Americans electronics and radar technology advantage is over-whelming. It won’t be a fair fight. The Russians are good a making fast manureable jets but lag far behind in the cockpit and weapons systems. MIG pilots would be at an extreme disadvantage. The MIG does look great.

    Comment by Marcel — January 31, 2008 #

  49. Theese comments are stupid. The Mig-35 can’t out preform a F-22. It doesn’t have the weapons, the supercruise, the stealth or the range. OLS is just a fancy name for a IIR/TV cammera with a computer attached to it. The first time the mig realises that an F-22 is there is when the F-22 launches an Amraam from a 100Km away. A detection range of 10km for missiles coasting means that the Mach 4 Amraam gives the Migs one manuvere at the most before impact. The F-22 simply won’t take the risk of WVR combat.

    Secondly MAPO-MIG must be having a wet dream about the MFI. Out performing a F-22 with a 30mm cannon, the A-10 has the same size cannon. The US tried a 30mm cannon variant on a F-16 in the 70′s. Have you seen any F-16′s with 30mm cannons, it was a complete failure. You simply arn’t going to put a big heavy 30mm cannon and its ammo on a high performance aircraft. Not to mention it would render the cannon usless for air to air and cause serious CG problem.

    Addrressing the question of the stealthy MFI. Stealth just doesn’t occur due radar absorbing materials, it is an all encompasing strategy which has found RAM coatings to be the weak link in stealth (Remeber the B-2′s with hteir ram paint which washes off in the rain.) Stealth must incompasses shape, RAM, Emmission Control, IR Signature and Vissual Apperance (Have you seen the LOW vis paint scheme on F-22′s and the JSF).
    (and Yes i know it mentions IR Managment, im just listing all the important parts of stealth.)

    Long range air to surface missiles are, large, they are going to increasae the MFI’s RCS massivly as the won’t be able to be carried internally unless the MFI is built like a bomber (Not the Goal of the Russians). The F-22 carries long range missiles just like the MFI. The Amraam AIM-120C-7 has a range of 67 miles at Altitude and the AIM-120D will ahve 120 miles of range at altitude. Not to mention the upcomming Dual role AAM/HARM missile america is developing that will most proberly give even more range and lethality.

    The claims of the superduper pulse-dopler, 5th gen, Phased array radar with electronic beam steering are already being acheived by american AESA radars. 20 targets these days is a pittance. the Active Electronically Scanned Array radar has no moving parts use beam steering with a field of regard of 120 degrees as well several different search modes that can all occur at the same time. This is not to mention. The multiple atg modes leveraged from the AN/APG-81 including Synthetic Aperture Radar (SAR) mode, Inverse Synthetic Aperture Radar (I-SAR) mode and ground moving target indication and track (GMTI/GMTT). To finnish it all of, the raptors radar use LPI tech nology, scanning on very narrow frequency bands that will change randomly thousands of times a second The F-22 also has prehaps the most comprehensive elint suit ever put in a aircraft (Better then a RC-135 rivet joint). THe computer that runs the show has the equivalence of two cray super computers.

    Lastly the MFI has been compared tot he EF2000 in both “Conception and configuration”. This means that the MFI is being based on 4th gen ++ fighter. THe EF2000 is also not a stealth fighter sand never will be with external ordance. if the MFI is to have room for external ordance only, their is no hope of a Stealth MFI.

    I know that the MFI hasn’t been built yet and is just a concept and that the russians could get their act together, however, they are fundementably behind in stealth, avionics and sensors. In fact behind about 30 years considering that russias behind america in stealth whenits building it first aircraft in 201X while americas first stealth aircraft was flown in 1981.

    In conclusion of the ramble the MFI has a tall order to topple the Raptor and due the technology gap russia has with america, it is unlikely that the MFI will acheive its goals with much success.

    On the issue of the Mig-35, its unlikely that a mig with OLS will turn the tables on stealth, it just a novelty for a legacy aircraft.


    Comment by cough — February 11, 2008 #

  50. ever heard of wind jammers??
    mount one in a su47 and send a bazzilion of f22s
    there just flying buckets hahahaha
    and you really think that a 20 year old f22
    plane in development can take everything on
    then youre just plain naive!!

    Comment by jimmylovesjammers — February 24, 2008 #

  51. give me mor information

    Comment by berhanu tadesse — March 7, 2008 #

  52. It is fun to read the yankistani chest thumping and keep stright face.

    If some read more carefuly about the capabilities of the new OLS, he will be pleasently suprised by it’s posibility not only to DETECT AND RECOGNIZE USING ADVANCED IMAGE PROCESSING TECHNOLOGIES STEALTH junk miles away, but also the missiles they fire from over 20 KM distance.

    The OLS RELIABLY recognizes incomming missile at 5 KM distance. Say bye to the ynkistani “stealth superiority”.

    In terms of close combat, GERMAN pilots clearly prefer MiG to any yankistani junk. Testimony is all over the web. Indian AF made the USAF look funy TWICE, using SU-30 and ANCIENT MiG-21 “India Bison variant”. Russia made mock combat with the yankz in Canada and make the USAF cry like babys too :)

    Comment by reguser — March 9, 2008 #

  53. I know I have posted someting similar in another thread but here goes…
    Optimising a fighter is no easy feat. During the 70′s and 80′s the “uncompromised fighter” was the F-14 and F-15 due to the tecnology available at the time. A more capable radar at any given tecnology-lavel will always be larger than a less capable radar at the same “level” That is why AWACS are always larger than fighter and the radars tend to improve alot during the service life of the airfram carrying it as the latest technologies improve and mature.
    Speaking of optimising… The mission of the airframe tends to dictate the speed, range, payload and if its’s a fighter, the requiremnts of the radar/ews will dictate the size of the airframe wich dictates the “size” of the engines wich in turn dictates the fuel-ammount etc, I think everyone here sees where this is going.
    A great advatage of AESA-radar technology is that it’s much easier to incorporate Low Probability of Intercept features in the system since it consists of multiple transmitters and recievers so you could spread the transmissins over a very broad spectrum. I read in some book by Yefim Gordon that the MIG-29 had such a radar, or was it perhaps fitted to a prototype… In either case, the russians do know that technology.
    The sensor fusion that Lockheed brags about in ragard to the F-22 and F-35 is old news in Sweden as the US is only now (F-22 generation) catching up with the level of “sensor fusion” and “cockpit presentaion” already implemented in JAS 39 Gripen.
    The capabililies of the sensors in question is another matter. Not to mention the datalinking employd and developed since the 60′s.
    All military procurment organizations will strive to maximize the effetct of what ever they purhcase while keeping the costs down!!! Lockheed did never need to worry about costs, they knew Oncle Sam would pick up the bill. It’s just how things work in the US. MIG on the other hand, if I’m not missinformed, has developed the MIG-35 on their own. So don’t accuse the russians of being “behind” as we do not know if it’s due to incompetense or lack of money. As far as I know the US developed stealth-aircarft, and all others for that matter to attack whomevere with impunity vs the russians developed the MIG-29 MIG-25, MIG-31 and SU-27 as airdefence fighters. That is why the F-22 probably is the best fighter in existance today.
    USA developed the stealthconcept to circumvent air-DEFENCES. If USA needs a defence they don’t need stealth figher as any attacker would know they are out there. They need stealth to “protect” their interrests overseas by bombing unsuspecting innocent peopole!
    The F-22 is according to USAF going to be used in the war on terror, kind of like using STUKA’s and Ju-88′s againts partisans or the resintance….
    My main point besides critizising US foreing-politics and comparing them to the Nazis is that USA pays however much it takes in $ to dominate other nations without the unnecessary cost for the families of the men and women in the military who actually does the job. Those families could actually vote for some other guy in the next election “so we better not get thier sons and doughters killed in action” Ironic, realy, how much does it cost to kill a hundred people, a thousand people or even a million?
    Maybe Russian politicians figure they don’t need the likes of the B2, F-117, F-22 or the F-35 to defend themselfs from civilians with AK’s.
    How come an american can own an M16 but no-one in Iraq is allowed to own one? They are ruled by the same thugs in suits… Now I remember, USA attacked Iraq for no appearent reason.
    You americans better go further develop stealth so you can smack some more technologically impared pepole around with impunity… Commit what ever atrocities you damn well please, just don’t get cought doing it!!!

    Comment by freddan — March 16, 2008 #

  54. For any fighter jet the real technology is hidden in particular fighter jet and it is only between the supplier and the enduser.

    The myth regarding the oversize and other things of SU-30 Mk was well proved in Air exercise with USAF. Indian did’nt used the most advance version of SU-30MKI mark III which is most leatherl in every sense.

    Russian are working on AESA and othe passive phased arry radar with over ranges of 350 – 500 kms and with this rage they can detect and target F-22. Russians are working with india for ATA missiles over the rage of 400 kms and other sophesticated missile. Present SU-30MKI mark III Radar is not known to anybody and its range but it works as mini AWACS for other IAF jets.

    My view is that we are let us know more about the technologies in fighter planes. Russians are also working on 5th generation figter plane with India and those technology may be incorporated in the fighter plane in future when the supplies.

    No supplier will be short of technology and most of the technology will be hidden to win the tender of magnitude of $10-12 billions. So keep your mind well open till the last card is open.

    Comment by Manish Bagdi — March 21, 2008 #

  55. We do tend to overlook the different philosophies of military intentions of the US, and the Russian forces. The US optimizes it’s strategies, and hardware to attack other countries. The Russians are more oriented towards self defense. That said, when you combine the new capabilities of their war planes like the MiG 35, and the SU-35 with their enormous air defense infrastructure (powerful ground radars, space based radars, and their optic electronic sensors, advanced SAMS like the S-400, etc), it’s moot to argue about which jet can take the other down in a BVR, or MVR engagement. The truth of the matter is, if the West ever made the stupid mistake of trying to invade Russian air space, it would learn a painful lesson real fast when confronted by such a huge air defense machinery that is poised to create new widows in wholesale quantities! That MiG, or the SU, is just a tip of the iceberg representing a military system that is committed to protecting a proud nation’s sovereignty. Let us pray that reason prevails over aggression. Oh by the way, I am an American and proud of it…but not a hater of any other nationality.

    Comment by Edward — April 4, 2008 #

  56. Well said!
    By looking at all recently developed fighters/strikefighters and what they are optimized to do, one can only come to the conclution that the F-22, B-2 and F-35 are developed to attack far from US-borders/airbases. The Eurofighter, Rafale, Gripen and most Migs are airdefence fighters, not airdominace fighters (as in dominate other nations from the air) Though Rafale is leaning more towards strike capability than the Eurofighter. Gripen was originally developed to do airdefence, strike and recce/survailance but do do all this within Swedish airspace and defend Sweden! Not to fly halfway across the globe to rob some underdeveloped nation or tell some them what to do with their own natural resources.

    Comment by freddan — April 18, 2008 #

  57. Raptor can do this and raptor can do that bla, bla, bla, (seems like F-14 tomcat, too much talk and no conformation kill). Raptor lovers you forget something about stealth, F22 have to use radar to make lock and radar signature is pretty visible.

    Comment by Serbian_SPIRIT — April 19, 2008 #

  58. It’s the man, not the machine dude.
    Remember the famous “Colonel Tomb” of the NVAF in Vietnam? He flew with a Mig-17 and scored numerous kills against f-4 Phantoms and f-105 Thunderchiefs. Does Mig-17 have radar, BVR missiles, ECM’s?
    And remember f-14′s in the hand of Iranians during the “imposed war” that slained over 100 Iraqi warplanes. Despite “Top Gun” training, USN pilots never matched the Iranian’s scores.
    Oh ya, f-22? its very cool indeed. But the Yanks should reduce their arrogance over this machine. Stealth is a man-made technology, and history dictates that another counter-technology will be discovered (or probably had).
    And one shouldn’t forget the regime that boasted their strength through technology, and ultimately defeated by its numerically superior foes. Remember that regime, the one that was led by the guy with a chaplin-moustach?
    Remember Me-163′s, Me-262′s, Tiger Tanks, StG-44 Assault riffles, V-2 ICBMs. And remember who won World War II .

    Comment by damar triadi — April 23, 2008 #

  59. people firstly i would like to say that a sukhoi30mki can out perform a F-22 raptor in a dogfight thought is is unlikely that a fight between an F-22 and sukhoi 30mki will come to an end is a dogfight(it will mostly end wit the F-22 spoting the sukhoi and taking it out long before the pilot realises wat hit it)but come on a
    a mig-29fulcrum wit am blind pilot can take out a F-22 so imagin wat a mig-35 will do to it.but the mig is required to have the following stuff
    +highly advanced raders which is capable of actullly stopping the F-22(F-22 has a radar signature of a small bird but newer and more advanced raders anr currently under devalopment jointly by the russian and the indian government)
    +long ranged massiles
    +a really good pilot(the blind pilot was a joke)

    Comment by rishov sen — May 1, 2008 #

  60. Is the Raptor invulnerable? Obviously…as was stated in another comment…no… it is man-made. That being said… on to relity. In a hypothetical conflict, the Raptor will not perform in combat against a comparable airframe. Admittedally, it takes much more than a good plane to win the “fight”. The money poured into training and sustainment of the modern USAF is a very viable threat to any would be aggressor air force. The hardware considerations of the F-22 can’t be ignored either. The new AMRAAM not withstanding, there is the new all aspects AIM-9X ..the latest addition to the proven “SideWinder” family of Infrared guided AAM’s. The Pilots will be datalinked to each other, have highly advanced helmets to allow heads to be out of the cockpit. The supercruise capability will allow for more fuel to be on hand for combat increasing survivability. The datalinking can not be ignoed either… imagine a flight of 30 SU-30′s, and MiG-35′s headed towards a reported flight path of F-22′s, when suddenly they realize that atleast 16 AMRAAMs have been simutaneously volley launched and they are headed straight for them. CHAOS ! and individual training will have to be relied upon.

    Comment by Cavalry Scout — May 21, 2008 #

  61. To continue with my comment, I would like to satte my real point. Money, it makes the world go around. that being said, who can afford to PRODUCE, TRAIN, and SUSTAIN a airforce capable of dealing with Raptors? The Russians? I think not… consider the fact that their pilots use wood and cables cockpits to get their training time due to there being no money to sustain and maintain the planes, fuel them, PAY the pilots, and feed the family. Anyone remember what happened to most of the old Soviet Navy? It’s ships and subs, including nuclear missile subs, are all rusting away or being sold for hard currency. Could a few squadrons of MiG-35′s and SU-30′s be fielded? Surely it can be done. I would even concided that the SU-47 Berkut could be fielded…. in VERY limited numbers…one or 2 squadrons. Combat attrition and worn out crews would take care of those numbers rapidly. Finally, as a suggestion to the old back and forth comparisons between airframes… only war will truelly tell the tale… and if it comes to that… rest assured that there will be no replies to this message due to the nuclear wweapons taking all of us out… there is little doubt in my mind about the capabilities of either US or Russian ICBMs.

    Comment by Cavalry Scout — May 21, 2008 #

  62. rusia es lo mejor en aviacion si no porq todo se copia los amburrientos de usa ellos siempre se valen de si mismos y no engañan al mundo como lo hacen los gringos mal nacidos q se averguensan de sus origenes

    Comment by arturo — June 27, 2008 #

  63. firstly every one knows f-22 raptor is truely 5th gen, eventhough the new jsf of us is lesser than capable in terms. now we are taking about mig35 it is truely 4++ only ,not 5th gen. mirage 2000-5,sum30mki,mig35,typoon,f-16 block50/52 are almost equal and has little difference. the major difference between f-22 vs mig35 is Aesa 79 radar & air to air and its long range capables. if mig35 is upgraded to aesa with longrange missiiles surely it could match with f-22. but now no other countries have f-22 except usa because of its price.

    Comment by njs — July 30, 2008 #

  64. Some people here are so ridiculous. Mig 35 is 4th generation people come on. It is a widely accepted fact from military analysts, if you go to war with the U.S., the U.S. will control the skies. Everyone (at least those with a brain), knows it. Come on, even putting the Iraq war aside, the U.S. spends over 10 times what the Russians do on their armed forces. What do you think we are so inefficient and Russia is so much more so, if anything the opposite would be true. And NJS no other countries have F-22 because U.S. law forbids its export you moron.

    Comment by J.T. — August 18, 2008 #

  65. ols 35 is better than pirate on typhoon,
    and why typhoon is that costly since it provides capabilities of rafale which is half of the price of typhoon.

    so why not buy rafale or go for su 35bm

    or wait for some years for pak fa

    Comment by abc — September 2, 2008 #

  66. povo viciado demais……..
    acho que quem merece o f-22 seria um sudao da vida.. pra limpeza etnica ser invisivel tbm..

    Comment by Juliano — September 8, 2008 #

  67. mig 35 simply rocks. if it satisfies all the requirement of being a 5th generation plane, then y is the mig 1.44 project being taken, and how is it better than mig35

    Comment by vikas — September 13, 2008 #

  68. The Indian Air Force did not fly the Su-30 against the F-15. In fact, the plane that beat the crap out of the US Air Force’s highly praised F-15 is the MiG-21. The Indian pilots are not only superbly trained, they are also highly motivated. Add to that superb avionics that are a feature of a technology-driven nation and the peerless airframe of the MiG-21. If the Indians use the Su-30 in full mode, the Americans don’t stand a chance.

    So far the Americans have fought wars against weak nations like Iraq, Grenada, Panama! It’s when you come up against a proud military like India’s that you know what war is. Proud nations like Vietnam and Serbia made the Americans sweat. Hell, they can’t even win against a bunch of mullahs in Afghanistan.

    I’ll advise the US Air Force to keep prescribing drugs to their pilots, that way they won’t fly their planes into the ground at the sight of the Sukhois.

    Comment by Rakesh Krishnan — September 20, 2008 #

  69. I dont have much to offer in terms of technicalities, but i can say my opinion.

    Firstly, the MIg-35, and Also the Su-35, are two great and awesome aircraft. Honestly, their isnt much that differs them from the F-22 other than stealth, which isnt saying much.

    In all respects, a 5th gen fighter isnt really saying much, when you can take a 4th gen fighter, with half the cost, and retrofit it to be comparable or if not better than a “5th gen” fighter. More or less that is what Russia has decided to do, and that is what America shoudve done.

    The cost, dosent really suit the purpose of the fighter. And congress knows it, and im sure, the military leaders appointed over the F-22 program know it as well.

    Hence the reasons why the F-22 possibly didnt participate in the 2008 red flag events, at Nellis AFB, Nevada this year. The competitors/comrades ivolved were many nations, one of which was india. FLying Su-30′s equipped with the OLS. Ionno, jsut seems strange that the military leaders oppointed over the exerices didnt want to include “americas” newest fighter, against fighters that were claimed to be inferior to it. Against one in particular, that russian engineers themselves put a challenge out years ago, saying their fighter could best the F-22.

    But whatever. The Russian designed jets IMHO, are no bit inferior to the american develped f-22.

    Oh and btw, yall need to do a little bit more research into some technologies. Russia had a functional fighter with thrust vectoring well in the late 80′s early 90′s. Whoop dee doo, yea its just thrust vectoring, but i find it funny, that ppl say america had it first, and our pilots are the best, blah blah, when our pilots are the ones taking lessons from the russians on how to fly their own jets…lol, silly stuff…

    Comment by Terrance Askew — October 26, 2008 #

  70. A lesson for american ‘intelligence.” The Russians are easily capable of kicking American ass. Seems the chinese have come up with stealth aircraft as well. The US isn’t, (not that it ever was) the sole superpower in the world! The US can only win if it cheats. It can’t even win in Iraq and Afghanistan. Lot of talk, no action. Alliganary. (alligator mouth, canary ass!)

    Comment by tedbohne — October 28, 2008 #

  71. Hello from Romania! First of all I would mention that I never liked the childish comparisons between two aircrafts, done by kids that should be in bed and not in front of the computer.The MiG-35, the Su-30 and Su-35 are nothing but upgraded versions of the Fulcrum and respectively Flanker.These aircrafts are serving in very small numbers in the Russian Air Force( the MiG-35 is only for export), and their main purpose in Russia is to help the Russian pilots to get used to certain 5th. gen. features that will be disponible on the PAK-FA.They are only filling the gap between the standard MiG-29/Su-27 4th. gen. aircrafts and the future PAK-FA in the Russian Air Force.So the russians will never use them in large numbers, but they will export them to their partners who need an aircraft capable to at least hold its ground against upcoming 5th gen. American aircraft.The MFI and the Su-47 are just experimental aircrafts on which the Russians are testing features like stealth, forwarded swept wings and new engines.So I like to believe that the following generation of aircrafts that will replace the MiG-29/Su-27 in Russia will be a heavy air superiority fighter probably developed by Mikoyan upcoming after the MFI and a lightweight/medium-weight multirole from Sukhoi, probably the PAK-FA.

    Comment by Dracula — November 10, 2008 #

  72. And regarding the American aircrafts, the F-15, F-16,F-18, until this moment they have proved themselves to be unbeaten against third world countries that can barely find money for the gas and pilot training……but to fight against the US:)))That’s why I get pissed off when I hear statements like ” the F-16 has never been downed in air to air combat” or “the F-15 is invincible” or “the F-22 can’t be matched by any known or projected aircraft”.Don’t misunderstand me , I love the American aircrafts for everything that they are, but that doesn’t means the Typhoon , Rafale, Gripen, or MiG and Sukhoi shall be trashed just because they don’t come from the US.So I demand the Americans to continue being proud of the aircrafts they make (they worth it) but ALSO to show respect to the other aircraft manufacturers that may be at any moment capable to develop same good aircraft.

    Comment by Dracula — November 10, 2008 #

  73. And since nobody posted yet I will just continue my comment with a question/suggestion (hopefully Pavel having more knowledge will enlighten me) : Is it possible to detect a conventional/stealth aircraft by the turbulences it creates in the air?

    Comment by Dracula — November 19, 2008 #

  74. If to talk not about turbulency by itself, but about broken natural airflows by the hot jet exhaust – then definitely, it is possible. I will not tell you if it is been used already, but the idea is so on the top, that I’m sure it was at least reviewed and analyzed.

    Comment by Pavel — November 22, 2008 #

  75. Is there any stealth fighter for the Russian so far? Your comment please!!!!

    Comment by Mohd Isa bin Jamaluddin — December 17, 2008 #

  76. Wouldn’t Mig35 be a toast in BVR that the raptors are much capable. Why are people here talking some of this OLS?

    Comment by saik — January 14, 2009 #

  77. Well, many of you guys say that MiG-35 is better, others say the Raptor.
    The matter which I’m certain bout is that none of you -including me- has a real life experience about this stuff, most of it based on wiki, picture and some video games…
    But from what presented, The MiG-35 is a nice sweet upgrade, and if mass produced, The Russians can recompensate its lack of advanced avionics on its fighters so…yes, I do love the MiG-35 :D

    Comment by Kommandant — January 27, 2009 #

  78. As for the romanian guy, you have lotta knowledge but yer demands worth nothing frate, si americani nu au respect pentru nimeni breeh

    Comment by Kommandant — January 27, 2009 #

  79. Buttom line:
    The Russians beat you guys to the moon, they mastered
    rockets, americans had to relly on germans to get to the moon, and develop nuclear weapons.
    In any fight weather it’s with guns or a good old naked fist, there’s no way of knowing who will win until the other guy it’s on the ground bleading begging for mercy.

    Comment by Doug — January 31, 2009 #

  80. F-22 is 5th gen aircraft.(only)
    China – JXX, (Russian+INDIA) – PAK-FA,
    Russia- Mig 1.44 are underdevelopment 5th gen aircrafts.
    Also all aircrafts that u all talked above like eurofighter, mig 35 are not 4th gen but 4.5 Gen aircrafts.

    Comment by Rajan — February 8, 2009 #

  81. For AERO INDIA shown in video MIG-35 took only 3 hours from Russia to India

    Comment by Rajan — February 8, 2009 #

  82. Didn’t read the whole post, and only a few comments, but there are a few things which people have to realize:

    In the cold war the 2 Super Powers (USA and Soviet Union) spent a lot of money on their military. After the fall of Soviet Union USA was the “big guy”, and still is, but i don’t know how long.

    They have a lot of advanced weapons, jets, tanks and a lot of other military equipment. BUT, don’t think that Russia is just going to sit on his a** and do nothing. They have a lot of advanced weapons as well.

    And what about stealth technology??? In 1999 an F-117 was shoot donw from the sky by a prehistorik Soviet AA missel (S-125 Neva with some modifications). I think after this, the stealth technology isn’t such a big stuff, off course its not some bullshit, but you know “There is always someone, who is tougher.” And this goes to all sides.


    Comment by noob — February 18, 2009 #

  83. yeop, You’ve forgotten the F-35 Lightning II, Rajan

    Comment by Kommandant — February 20, 2009 #

  84. No point selling to India. Crap pilots and even worse maintenance.

    It is a shame how Russia’s finest is wasted on a bunch of amateurs.

    Comment by Vadim — February 21, 2009 #

  85. To Kommandant
    If you want to see the respect of the americans at its best you just have to put a flower at the tomb of Teo Peter (romanians know what I’m talking about).

    Comment by Dracula — February 28, 2009 #

  86. Well I can see the Russians have built an out of date piece of crap like the Eurofighter, I just wish they would have looked at what Americans have built Which is something for the short-term future, and tried to compete on those lines,… Yes they can always sell it to stupid Indians or Pakistanis,.. they’ll buy any old shite, but my point is, if they did try properly to emulate the Americans the sooner they’d go bust, because that’s what has happened to them. End of any War.

    Comment by VINCE — March 5, 2009 #

  87. MIG35 is the best thing the indian money can buy

    Comment by anikethana — March 18, 2009 #

  88. Excellent jet fighter the Mig-35 Ecuador should
    purchase this aircraft why don’t you offer this
    aircraft the Mig-35 to then. The price for each
    unit about how much? (i was for the aerospace industreis for 21 years)



    Comment by George Gutierrez — April 7, 2009 #

  89. how easy we forget,1990 iraq war.
    i remember the newspapers comparing u.s.a to iraq
    military,how they said iraq was the 4th largest
    military in the world and u.s.a should think twice
    about taking iraq on.(we all seen the outcome).
    united states walked all over iraq.
    and as far as the f-22,f-35,b-2,cruise missiles
    they dont want to dogfight(you guys focus to much on the exception then the rule)f-22,f-35 will use
    their biggest advandage,(to attack at night almost
    undetected)and doing as much damage as they want.
    until there is very little military left on the ground,and no country can truly defend against it.
    the only question is how many weeks before this happens.

    Comment by dave — April 22, 2009 #

  90. Looks cool. Features are rock solid..built to kill.

    Comment by Sayan — May 10, 2009 #

  91. To VINCE: when I’ll see a true fight between the Typhoon/Su-35BM and the F-22/F-35 with the F being the winner then I’ll believe all the propaganda about their alien stealth tech performance. But it’s just that the Americans don’t have balls to go in a simulated fight either with the Typhoon or Su-35BM.Why? Because if they loose then all the possible customers of the F-35 will consider canceling their orders for it.And the Alaskan Red Flag exercise is irrelevant. How do I know if the F-15 pilots were/were not demanded to loose just to demonstrate the invincibility of the Raptor to the American taxpayers, and not the F-15′s true capabilities?I agree that the F-22 is a great fighter and the stealth capability is a good step forward but let’s just not start jerking off in front of the F-22

    Comment by Dracula — May 16, 2009 #

  92. ” It won’t let me put a weapons system on it,… even when I can see it through the canopy. Annoys the hell out of me…” What a good joke

    Comment by Dracula — May 23, 2009 #

  93. I find all of this very amusing.It reminds me of old movies.You know,like “The Hunt For Red October”.Americans simply won’t accept that russians can make a plane that can chalenge most of their planes.They are ready to eat you alive if you even try to say that Mig 35 can give a hard time to their F 22.
    I am from Serbia.I remember the year of 1999.Our Air Forces were simply out numberd.We used old Mig 29.This planes were not repaird for ten years because our Air Force lacked spear parts.Two years before war started all of mig’s were put out of service.Our pilots still used them when the war started.They haven’t shot down any of american planes,but their capability to lose american planes that fired on them from 120+ km and then chase them off,away from Serbian air space because american almoust never went in a real dog fight whit any of our planes.Many good pilots lost their lives that year and only 5 out of 16 mig’s that we had are still being used today,the rest were shot down by american long range rockets,or destroyed while still being on ground.Althoug our pilot did’t do much,their flying becamed legendary and a true proof of this plane capabilities.Being able to evade several enemy rockets from several enemy planes and live to fly another day is a legacy of mig 29.Now imagine that those planes were brand new,packed whit new technology.Imagine that serbian air force had Mig 35,that would have made the difference.And as for the stealth technology,in 1999 we shot down american F-117 Nighthawk whit S-125 Neva rocket system.S-125 Neva,not S-300 or S-400.So if they haven’t improved their stealth technology,american should be very,very worried about their precious F-22,because if they haven’t improved their stealth,when F-22 meet’s the new S-400 it will probably meet his maker.

    Comment by Sam Fisher — June 3, 2009 #

  94. hello there, some people deeply astonish me…i’m all for russian planes, but everyone should agree that the raptor is the best thing in the air and in service as of 2010! still doesn’t mean it’s unbeatable,as i think no star-trek technology has been implemented into it :) romulan cloaking device or warp drives…:)) From the technical point of view it’s definately superior to the Mig/Su 35, still you can’t bring down an opponent with the apg77,or the cray computers put into it or all those sensor fusion techniques… you’ve go to fire something.. and i think these are it’s weakest points AIM9/120, and the price 350M, for that $$$ you get 5-6 Mig/Su…
    also, don’t forget the plane might be protected from IR radiation, but the exhaust air is still hot!!!and the OLS definately can see, them. by tracking and mapping those exhaust tracks,the AESA radar can be cued onto a small scan box, and the power of the 20kw radar can beef up the marble sized RCS of the f22. moreover if the f22 is supercruising at m1.8 it is likely to be less maneauvrable and couldn’t be able to pull many Gs, therefore more easily targeted, anyways i don’t think that anything else other than a tv guided missile would be able to lock onto the raptor…i’ll stop here but consider that the use of the OLS depends on how integrated it’s with the radar,albeit fusion techniques.
    one more issue, the rcs of aim-120 thousand fold greater that raptor’s, so it’s can be tracked and targeted by another AAM,if the raptord had to play that game AAM killing AAM, then russian planes more likely to win, due to numbers puchased and AAMs carried,though raptor can quickly egress engagement through supercruise, as a merge would be too risky for such a plane, dogfight ussualy = M.A.D.
    i think people as TIZ and other american patriots should accept tha fact that the plane isn’t invincible.
    i’d like to recall on history fact…the americans spent hundred thousand dollars to invent a pen that could be used in no gravity for space exploration. the russian used pencils… it worked perfectly!!

    Comment by tomish — June 23, 2009 #

  95. as for the teen series USA planes flying against modern Migs and Suhoi, usaf clearly understood that the sole thing that could avoid them being decimated, was to have at least one AESA equiped fighter per squadron, that’s what happening right now… luckily you have the F22 in service.

    Comment by tomish — June 23, 2009 #

  96. Good god, learn how to write in english. This reads like a chinese tech manual.

    Comment by Joe — August 10, 2009 #

  97. The greatest winner in all this would be our poor Indian politician and compatriot defence brokers who will wait for their palms to be greased. The idea of a delayed buy could mean this. Also it may be true that they really have their sights on a plane which can withstand the next 40 years of service. But having known India, money seems to take the higher priority.

    Just rewind back to our infamous howitzer purchases of the ‘80s or the submarine purchases made in the ‘70s. The Bofors was not even in contention and stood 4th. But it still won.

    So India, don’t be surprised! It can throw a parliamentary election like surprise. We may end up buying something which may not even be part of these tenders. :-) )

    Comment by Kishan — August 23, 2009 #

  98. Hey Guys I Recommend F 35 Or Mig 35 For India’s Latest MMRCA ( Multirole Medium Range Combat Aircraft ) Deal.
    If, U.S.A. & Other His Project Partner Contries Allow F 35 Joint Strike Stealth Fighter to Sell To India. I Recommend It For IAF To Take A LIFETIME
    Chance To Buy This Superb Stealth Fighter Aircraft.
    I Reviewed All The Specifications It Has Like AESA
    FLY BY WIRE SYSTEM & It Also Pubicised As A Fifth
    Generation Fighter & MIG 35 Is Only 4 ++ Generation If USA Don’t Sells F 35 To INDIA Then
    MIG 35 Would Best Choice For INDIA.

    Comment by Sanketbhai — October 16, 2009 #

  99. Well if you people think that russian planes are bulshit and US planes are great then let me remind you, US has never fought a hitech war after the WW2. Its acting police every where or attacking poor nation. Remember Iraq, just look at the pictures of its cities and condition of people before the Operation desert storm 2 and look at then now. If US were doing good to people of iraq then why is that the country has become a mess and economy has stalled and by the way wheres all its oil going..It was selling its oil to many south asian countries which they dont get now. If F-15 are so good why were they lost 2 of them to very much inferior Iraqi Army. American say they make weapons so that there can be no war and there is peace evry where then why is that US marines are always in fight with some or the other nation in the world, who gave it the right to be police of the world. Can it control china?no.Did it rightly condemn iraqi dictator?no. reson for attack and reason to hang were different.
    F22 or F35 are good no doubt. but tell me one thing why are they both boasted so much when they are not in such a quantity to sustain a long war and F35 why is it boastred too. Its not yet in sevice and in resent ED air show one F35 had a problem and a replacement was needed. for F35 the vertical take off the system was soled to them by russia. R-77 are more manuverable than Aim-120. Aim-9x is still not as good as the old R-73 so one can think what magics upgrads will do. Aim-120 can shoot a fighter from a range of 20 kms only, thats when is propelant is burning.
    And people read about the OLS specs then compare with the plane that can fire aim-120 and aim-9x. I think they will be evaded. and ya remember R-27ET highly manuverable and silent kiler. Sorry for criticizing US but its true.

    Comment by Hiren — November 17, 2009 #

  100. The United States and India just reached a deal to sell India fighters which according to Defense officials from both countries as one of the biggest in the last 15 years. So much for India buying Migs.

    Comment by skipper — January 27, 2010 #

  101. Take a look at an optical package that we had in the 1950′s mounted on the F-101 Voodoo. It was an optical and tracking system to be used in any weather condition to both track optically and in the infrared spectrum to track, lock and blow Soviet aricraft out of the arctic skies. Maybe we should take two steps back and rejuvinate that system. I bet the whole world will be salivating at our genius. Hey! I got a better idea. Let’s just buy them from Russia comrades!

    Comment by jayz — January 27, 2010 #

  102. one joke about USA & Russia comparison of aircraft – of cold war vintage.Russian defense minister meets USA defense secretary. US defense secretary expounds the superiority of the F-16. Russian minister replies : F-16 is the lowest bidder option selected as a business proposition. MiG 29 & Su-27 are a result of umpteen scientists & Engineers working with vast resources, at the behest of the Russian govt( and its ego) in order to survive for themselves.

    Comment by m s bhave — April 22, 2010 #

  103. Again repeating the old joke : American Defense secretary met Soviet defense minister. America defense minister BRAGGED ABOUT f-16.rUSKY REPLIED : f-16 IS THE LOWEST BIDDER OPTION & A COMMERCIAL PROPOSITION.The Su27 is a result of unlimited resources spent by an egoistic government, and made by Scientists & Engineers in order that they survive the wrath of the so said govt. Now friends, You decide what would be superior

    Comment by m s bhave — April 27, 2010 #

  104. I get a chuckle out of all these Russians and Chinese who try to criticize and downplay American technology and hardware. If your Russian/Chinese technology is so good then stop sending your spies to steal American technology and start designing fighters which don’t look like cheap American knock-offs!

    Comment by Beavis — September 5, 2010 #


    Comment by abheraj jaswal — December 15, 2010 #

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