MTHFR and Vaccines/Immunizations – Contraindicated?

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This topic has 2 voices, contains 29 replies, and was last updated by  Kimberly 42 days ago.

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March 7, 2012 at 3:42 am #1239

Emily

Dr. Ben –

Do you know of any research that you can point me to in regards to MTHFR and vaccines/immunizations. I know it is a stretch considering how little information on this is out there mainstream. I know it generally is thought of as being not advisable in those with MTHFR and my gut tells me not to do it, but I’m having trouble presenting our case to the pediatrician. Our pediatrician outright stated tonight that vaccines are not contraindicated in folks with MTHFR (and PANDAS, our sons other condition). My concern is his ability to detoxify heavy metals and methylation issues (due to MTHFR, Homozygeous C677T) and his compromised immune system/autoimmunity issues (due to PANDAS). Both issues scream to me that vaccines would not be advisable but he stated that neither condition are contraindicated for his upcoming 4 yr vaccines. Urgently looking to see if I can find any studies that might suggest otherwise to send to him. It sounds as though he may be open to testing his antibody titer levels to the vaccines to get an indication of his current level of protection. I plan on pushing for this to help guide the discussion but I’m not sure it will do much to resolve the disagreement. I’m in need of more supporting documentation from sources that he may respect, but I’ll take any research I can get.

Thank you,
Emily

March 11, 2012 at 6:23 am #1297

Lisa

I saw your post and had to respond. I do not have the studies on this topic. I was researching this very topic when I came across your post. But what struck me is that you feel you have to argue and plead your case in how you raise your child. This is YOUR child. The function of a pediatrician is not to stand over you, like a boss, and order you how to raise your child. These decisons are yours to make, not the doctor’s. If your doctor leaves you having to argue with him or her, then you should find a different doctor. Doctors like this will cross the line in many areas. They have God-complexes. You do not need someone who thinks they are your boss, being hired by you. You are the customer. YOU are paying the doctor, not the other way around. The doctor works for you, not the other way around. You are the one who is accountable for what happens to your child. If your child gets sick or ends up with permanent damage from these shots, you cannot run back to the doctor and expect him to be accountable. You are the one your child has to watch out for him, not your doctor. Don’t let some doctor push you around. Remember, YOU pay the doctor to work for you, not the other way around.

March 16, 2012 at 12:29 am #1346

Katie

We have the MTHFR and PANDAS. Our immunologist and our holistic medicine doc said NO VACCINES at least until we get the immune system rectified. You have NOTHING to lose by waiting. Our DAN doc said that vaccines today are not even vaccinating against diseases as they present today. In hindsight, I wish I had not given them in the past. The HINI flu vaccine is what sent my kids over the edge two years ago. I say proceed with caution……you can always add them in later but you won;t be able to undo it if they have a bad reaction. Of course, you know what the situation is better than anyone.

March 16, 2012 at 2:58 pm #1351

Beverly Hennager

You can change doctors. I was told by a person with an autistic son (that she was sure was caused from vaccinations) that you can order shots without the mercury, and space them far apart. But if it were me, I would not even chance that without expert opinion from someone like Ben. Trust your gut instincts.

March 19, 2012 at 5:58 am #1394

Dr Ben

Hi Emily –

I am glad you are receiving some help and opinions from others on this very important – yet heated – topic.

Personally, I would not recommend vaccinating any child with a homozygous MTHFR mutation – unless it was a potentially life-threatening problem or a very high risk infant/child.

The three most important things in an infant for immune support are:
- Vitamin D3
- breast milk
- probiotics
- clean environment (low toxins in the home/baby crib/bath/toys..) I always add more than I originally state ;)

It is not only about thimerosol in vaccines – it is also the adjuvants which stimulate the hell out of one’s immune system – thereby making one susceptible to autoimmune conditions or overactive immune systems in general – such as allergies.

I’ve had many patients – and friends with children – that share stories of how their child shut down after vaccinations.

With that said, I highly recommend reading some of the books found on my recommended reading list. – especially Changing the Course of Autism – as the author goes into great depth on vaccinations.

Keep in mind also that you do not know of other potential mutations your children/infant may have – such as those which amplify the immune system, shut down the ability to detox further or aggravate neurotransmitters. When you combine these possible mutations along with MTHFR and vaccinations – it is a recipe for autism.

March 19, 2012 at 5:59 am #1395

Dr Ben

Lisa –

RIGHT ON! ;)

March 19, 2012 at 6:05 am #1397

Dr Ben

Emily –

I have to side with Lisa on this one.

You have to find a pediatrician that allows you to think and do what you think is best for you and your children.

It is not up to you to dig for research to present to the doctor.

It is up to the doctor to present research to you – that is their job – to educate you.

You know what ‘doctor’ means? It comes from the word, “docere” which means…’to educate’

If your doctor is not educating you – but rather being ‘high horsed’ and arrogant, get the hell out of there before their ruin you and your child.

This one decision could ruin your child for life or for a decade – not to mention $10,000′s of dollars of you trying to get your child back.

Your doctor is wrong here and you are right.

Methylation is seriously defective and if you give vaccinations to your child now, there can be serious harm done.

Get a new doctor. Now.

I should also say that when patients bring studies into doctors to see/read, 90% of them will say, ‘Uh huh’ and trash it without reading. They are busy and have no time to be taught by patients.

I humbly do get taught by clients and people all the time. Doctors are human and do not have the almighty knowledge on every topic imaginable. I don’t.

I know when to say, “I don’t know.” and refer out.

Does your doctor?

March 19, 2012 at 6:54 am #1401

Allison

Hello,

Wow – hot topic!! I am 34 and homozygous for C677T (not sure of A1298C status).

Before I knew about this I consented to having pneumovax to see if I can produce antibodies as I had/have an IgG subclass deficiency.
I’ve had CFS-type problems for ten years of more, the last six years has been rough.

Anyway, pretty sure the vaccination kicked off a CFS relapse and I so regret it – not doing that again!!

I also have a condition called pyroluria which depletes my body of zinc – now my zinc and D levels have improved, my immune system has been great. I wouldn’t be surprised ifthe igG subclasses are fixed now :)

March 19, 2012 at 7:04 am #1402

Allison

I’m really curious about the PANDAS – I came across this condition when researching strep overgrowth in the gut and mental health issues. I couldn’t find anything related to adults – only info about PANDAS which is a pediatric issue.

I have a strep overgrowth, IgG subclass deficiency, seem to have Hashimoto’s thyroiditid, am homozygous for C677T and have panic disorder – I feel like an adult version of PANDAS.

Would love to hear more from those dealing with PANDAS and strep overgrowth. I’m
currently treating the strep overgrowth with erythromycin.

And what is the connection here between MTHFR and the immune issues and strep issues?

March 19, 2012 at 11:18 am #1403

Liz

I have multiple food intolerances, fibromyalgia, irritable bowel and depression which I truly believe was triggered by the hep b vaccine. I just found out I\’m heterozygous for a1298c. I was reading some of Amy Yaskos stuff about how this mutation limits the recycling of something called bh4 which helps you detox substances like ammonia and peroxynitrite. The conversion to bh4 is also hampered by aluminium. This is used as an adjuvant in vaccines. I really wish I hadnt had those vaccine shots but am also grateful I am not homozygous.

March 19, 2012 at 1:31 pm #1404

Barbara

I have two daughters, one 30 yrs old , one 13 yrs. My oldest daughter was raised very alternative for the time. We breastfed for 2 1/2 yrs, had one of the first car seats she was born in a birth home with no medications, we did organic and I made her baby food when we carefully started solids, and we did the family bed. Unfortunately, back then I did not know I could fight the doctor on vaccinations. After her first one she had a seizure. She had hard lumps and got sick after the others. . .and we did not have nearly as many as they have now. My daughter has been sick ever since. After taking the Depoprevara shot for birth control ( against my advice) she gained almost a hundred pounds in less, than six months. My daughter is homozygous for C677T and A1298C. She has fibro, four sleep disorders and other major hormonal problems. She has a long road to getting healthy.

My husband had life threating reactions to vaccinations in the Army twice. . .he eventually was able to leave because he was at one of the Academies.
He has had health problems for the rest of his life culminating in brain surgery last March.
My youngest daughter and my grand son have not had vaccinations and are healthy in every way!
We do think that vaccinations had a hand in health problems even before we knew about the Mthfr gene. I have been searching for years for why my husbands family have so many major health issues.
I spent 30 yrs with doctors who would not listen to us about my husband. Finally found one(who listened and believed us and found the tumor in his pituitary gland. Find a new doctor who at least will be open to you being a partner in your childs health! And listen to your gut!

March 19, 2012 at 2:00 pm #1405

darcy moseley

i have just recently been diagnosed with homo/C677T, which led me to test my 16 yr old daughter, who is as well homo/C677T….when she was 5 , we lived in Belgium and she received a Men.C vaccine.. literally 14-20 days later she began having absence seizures… i was convinced, then as now that it was directly related to the vaccine…( her paternal uncle has autism which developed shortly after vaccines…)
my daughter took zarontin for several years , was weaned off and has never had another seizure… she has never had a flu shot, nor have i given her the Hp vaccine…now having this new information, i encourage every new parent i know to have their infant tested before starting immunizations…
i have been shocked to learn how many parents in Louisiana are telling me that their doctors have never even heard of this gene mutation….i encourage you all to get the word out….

March 19, 2012 at 3:03 pm #1409

Cassie

I’m sorry, but this topic is where I digress from your advice, and why I am very hesitant to point people to your site, even people with MTHFR. I agree that there are a very, very small majority of the population who should avoid some vaccines. Those with known immune system disorders/response issues come to mind, like the ones who have commented above with previous reactions and those with disorders like PANDAS. I could totally see why those people would need to avoid (or delay) vaccines. However, for the other 99.999% it is dangerous. The tiny amounts of what you call toxins in vaccines are not at toxic doses. Any substance can be lethal if given in high enough doses. Take iron for instance. Iron is necessary in the human body but you can also get toxic doses of it. Many minerals are necessary for proper body function but in high doses, they are toxic. The dose is the toxin, not the substance. So I have to digress with your advice to avoid vaccines.

March 19, 2012 at 11:11 pm #1413

Dr Ben

Hi Cassie –

Tiny amounts can cause serious issues – especially in those with PANDAS or genetic disorders.

Estrogen levels must be tightly controlled otherwise they lead to blood clots, heart attacks and cancer to name a few.

A physician at the last medical conference told us all something I’ll never forget.

‘Next time someone tells you that a little bit of a toxin or a substance is ok, tell them this:
The amount of total estrogen in 200,000 women adds up to 1 teaspoon.’

The amount of active ingredient in many pharmaceutical drugs are tiny amounts.

There are some parts of the world that demand vaccines and I totally support that.

There are many vaccines here in the USA that I do not agree with – why give an infant Hep B vaccine? Why give a child Hep B? They are not sexually active.

This will always be a heated topic and there is no right or wrong answer.

It simply depends on the individual’s susceptibility and weighing the odds.

What is worse for the specific individual?
- the vaccine
- the potential illness

I respect your opinion.

No one doctor has all the answers and there is not one doctor that you will agree with 100% of the time.

I want to leave you with a video from Ken Cook of the Environmental Working Group. Please start watching at the 1 minute mark.

  • This reply was modified 79 days ago by  Dr Ben.
March 20, 2012 at 2:01 am #1421

Melissa

To Cassie and people of like mind….have you read active ingredients of vaccines? inactive ingredients? Purposes of those ingredients? Carcinogenics of those ingredients? Have you looked at statistics about immunity that results for vaccines? The science behind herd immunity? Do you know that the viruses used in vaccines are grown on sometimes cancerous, tumorous cells that can not be completely removed from the vaccines because it will kill the actual virus to be sterilized to that degree?
http://www.fda.gov/biologicsbloodvaccines/scienceresearch/biologicsresearchareas/ucm127327.htm
Before you weigh your pros and cons on vaccinating vs. not vaccinating read the CDC’s own statistics regarding vaccines as well as the FDAs you will certainly be surprised. I myself will wait until the FDA has the technology to provide adequate quality standards and remove neurotoxins from the vaccines. To me the off chance of catching a disease that was already on the outs before the vaccines and letting my body naturally fight it are better odds than injecting cancer cells along with toxins that will undoubtedly cause health affects that will impeded the quality of life I see for myself and my family. Even provax people will tell you that there are genetic predispositions for vaccine reactions….MTHFR is one of them! Do a couple of searches for HELA cells and vaccines as well as what the aluminum’s purpose as a adjuvant and its connection to allergy. Combine that with a predisposition to hold onto toxins and its kind of scary! I hope you will look into it further before completely ruling out the benefits to second guessing vaccines!

March 20, 2012 at 5:58 pm #1431

Cassie

Melissa. Thank you for your concern. I researched vaccines years ago when I had an 11 week premature baby. He was immune suppressed to a degree because of respiratory infections and being intubated at birth. I looked at “science” on both sides of the argument. I just could not find anything to convince me that getting a VPD is better than getting the vaccine. For him to have contracted a VPD as an infant would have been devastating to his low immune system. He’s gotten all of his vaccines so far and so have my other 2 children. I have no regrets.

Consider this. How much more toxin are you ingesting through your lungs and digestive tract everyday! How many days or hours would you have to breathe to ingest the same amount of ingredients in a lifetime fo vaccines. It’s a matter of perspective and weighing the pros and cons. As a mother, I want to protect my children from deadly diseases. Spacing them out is understandable if you choose, but totally avoiding them, to me, is life threatening.

March 20, 2012 at 6:09 pm #1432

Melissa

I guess having a daughter who had an adverse reaction to a vaccine at 2 puts things into a different perspective as to what is life threatening and what is over kill. If you did the research years ago then you probably were dealing with a different schedule as well. I am 30 and when I was getting my vaccines there were 10 shots, not there are in the 30s. That is a huge leap and one that has unfortunately come with a great increase in many conditions and chronic illness.

March 20, 2012 at 6:20 pm #1434

Cassie

It was only 7 years ago, so I would say he has probably had about 30 vaccines as well, including all the flu vaccines. Delivering a 2 pound baby gives you a different perspective to life threatening as well. I feel that vaccines were part of his protection.

I’m truly sorry for your daughter’s reaction. I don’t know what happened but I would truly continue to look into it. I read a story just a couple weeks ago of a child that they thought had a vaccine reaction and years later it turned out to be a rare genetic disorder that coincidentally made its appearance right after a vaccine. I will try to find the story again if you are interested.

March 22, 2012 at 9:06 pm #1471

Dr Ben

Cassie –

This is exactly my point: “I read a story just a couple weeks ago of a child that they thought had a vaccine reaction and years later it turned out to be a rare genetic disorder that coincidentally made its appearance right after a vaccine.”

Genes turn on and off due to methylation.

Vaccines interfere with methylation – especially when they contain harmful additives, heavy metals and potential allergens (egg).

This genetic disorder may not have reared its ugly head if the child did not get vaccinated.

This ties into my article about Methylation and why MTHFR is now becoming a hot topic.

I do want to say that there are instances where vaccines are needed – absolutely – I’ve said this before but want to emphasize that point.

In your child’s case, they appear to have been critical.

In 3rd world countries, they appear to be life-saving.

And there are other times to vaccinate as well –

But there clearly needs to be an exception to everyone being vaccinated as genetics vary tremendously.

When we know a child has a methylation defect or any defect which predisposes him/her to serious adverse effects from the vaccine, then it absolutely should be avoided if the costs outweigh the benefits.

  • This reply was modified 76 days ago by  Dr Ben.
March 22, 2012 at 10:38 pm #1473

Allison

I am not well researched on the topic of vaccines, I only have personal experience of reactions – the pneumovax kicked off a CFS relapse and a travel vaccine for hepatitis left me with a really weird big/wide grey area of raised skin on my inner thigh. Who knows what happened internally that my eyes couldn’t witness.

I think some vaccines are absolutely necessary but there is definitely an element of overkill – an attitude of let’s vaccinate for absolutely everything and combine vaccines into one big dose. Its the latter two approaches that I have a problem with. Until we know for sure that vaccines are safe, it pays to err on the side of caution and only get the vaccines that are absolutely necessary.

March 22, 2012 at 10:39 pm #1474

Allison

Would really appreciate some input about me strep/MTHFR/PANDAS question above if anyone has thoughts :)

March 22, 2012 at 11:07 pm #1475

Dr Ben

Allison – please post your PANDAS question in the appropriate place – it needs to be a new question or posted in an area that is already discussing PANDAS –

Thanks!

April 4, 2012 at 2:08 pm #1795

Marie

Great Topic. We are currently dealing with this exact issue! Without a doubt the vaccines triggered this mess for us. Our two year old was diagnosed with autism when he was 20 months old. He received the hep b vaccines then after that we opted against further vax’s. Bring us to his diagnoses we had a genetic test run and methylation panel to reveal that he has one c677T and one A1289T, his meth panel is all off. low glutathione high oxidized stress,low homocysteine etc.. After our bout with mb12 injections we have since moved to andrew cutler chelation. It appears our son has heavy metal issues and his not detoxing them properly. He is an undermethylator. We are also using NAC also. The alpha lipoic acid is doing wonderful things for him but I still feel that he needs more meth support

Dr. Ben… The chelation is revealing great results and we use supplements to support replacing his minerals and antioxidants. He gets epsom salt baths eats all organic foods and probiotics. but what can i do in regards to the b vitamins to get him on track. Language is progressing but anxiety is crazy he is terrified of children.

April 5, 2012 at 9:42 am #1806

Dr Ben

Marie –

Low homocysteine may mean he may have a CBS mutation. The sulfur supplements may be great but be careful with how many you give.

This is a complex picture that I cannot readily give complete answers to without more history and time. – but I’ll do my best.

Some children do well with straight glutathione – and others do not. You may want to increase his glutathione levels directly.

Increased anxiety may be due to COMT mutation. Niacin helps with this. Consider giving him 25 mg of nicotinic acid or a 1/20th of a tablet of Niacin by Seeking Health. Have to balance the niacin though with further methyl groups as niacin depletes methyl groups – tricky business.

Have you tried a little bit of Sublingual Active B12 with Methylfolate? Consider giving him 1/4th a tablet directly by mouth.

Did the B12 injections go awry? If so – using cyanocobalamin?

A consult is needed here Marie to get somewhere in depth.

I am glad he is improving!

April 10, 2012 at 2:54 am #1859

Denise

My daughter (12) has PANDAS (currently in third severe exacerbation and we\’re not seeing good improvement with IVIG this year), an immune deficiency (IgG in 500\’s & IgA around 30 – these are without IVIG), GERD, Migraines, Reactive Hypoglycemia and we just learned Friday, is homozygous for MTHFR A1298C. Our Pediatrician is still waiting for results from the heavy metal & dopamine labs… we also need to discuss what else needs to be checked in labs.

Historically, she\’s had bumps up in her hepatic panel (AST around 70 – 170), elevated urine porphyrins, elevated B12… I\’m starting to see the pieces fit together.

What other labs would be appropriate to run related to the MTHFR A1298C for her and what supplementation would be applicable for her?

Thank you!

April 17, 2012 at 2:34 am #1914

Denise

Can anyone answer the post I made above, last week, please?

Thanks!

April 18, 2012 at 1:56 am #1921

Melba

I usually dont reply to this kind of contraversy, but I felt I Must. 4 years ago, my daughter reacted badly and very concerning to her 2 month vaccines, my wonderful Pediatrican was concerned and took some items out of the next round at 4 months………. She reacted worse, he said he will never vaccinate her again….then she developed allergies to everything, 30 foods!!…Diareaha, she distant/no smiles, stopped developing. I freaked and hit the ground running…… with the interventions of my ND, Methly b-12 shots,compounded multi, antifungal, epsom salt baths etc, …….this all made sense when I discovered she was Positve mthfr 677/1298 one each……….. MY POINT IS- If I would of known about her genetic mutation…..I would not of vaccinated her!… SHe is a now heathly, smarty pants 4 1/2 year old as i continue my ongoing protocal. We need to take to appropriate precautions regarding our families.

April 20, 2012 at 4:51 am #1938

Marie

Melba, you are so right!! i think it\\\’s terrible that kids are being vaccinated with a \\\”one for all\\\” approach when clearly not every kid can process the vaccines accordingly.

How often did you administer the MB12 shots? What exactly was compounded in your multi.

High five** for reacting promptly to your daughter’s needs. So happy she is progressing wonderfully!

Dr. Ben I will try out our recommendations.

They were Methyl B12 shots and we didn’t see any positives or negatives. I will look into the subli MB 12 with methylfolate. I will keep you updated. Thank you!

April 21, 2012 at 3:42 am #1948

Melba

We did her methyl b-12 w/follinc acid shots twice a week (but stopped follinic 2 years later, started giving folate),but continued on with her methyl b-12 shots she was put her on neocate)(amino acid based non dairy) until 2 1/2 years. She ate kinda like the paleo diet as an infant (alot of fruit veggies and protien….. Epsom salt bath every night, and epsom salt cream applied night and day. Compounded vitamin: I think the actual compound of the vitamin mattered ie Vit A palimate vs Vit Acetate. We chose them all carfully. vit A Acetate, selenium yeast, vit e succinate, thiamine, riboflavin 5 phos, 5-mthf, methyl b-12, biotin, cal citrate, mag citrate, ferrous sulfate, co q10, niacinmide, panthenol, zinc sulfate, p5p, vit K. Not everything works for everyone, but I thought I would relay what I did. this and methyl b-12 shots, and GFCF and feingold diet, enzymes, probiotics …has fingers cross helped her grown into an amazing little sassy, smart talkin gal! If you have a ppo and a compounding pharmacy. This was covered under my insurance, just call insurance and ask for ins compunding benefit.

April 26, 2012 at 2:41 pm #1993

Kimberly

I’m homo c677t. When I was vaccinated as a baby,it caused my leg to swell up. My mom says it was huge, bright red and hot to the touch. I was very ill and had to drag that leg around for weeks when I crawled.

When my daughter received vaccinations at 6mos. and it made her so ill that she cried for 3 days straight(until she was hoarse), she was limp like a rag doll, had high fevers and didn’t eat much. That was her last one…I said never again. I have to fill out special paperwork every year for school and I get ridiculed a lot.
I was told that the “ingredients” in vaccines now vs. when I was a baby (70′s) is like 5x..is this true?

“Love them. Protect them. Never inject them”.

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