There are some concepts of Game that still take me aback when I use them in the field and their awesome power is demonstrated. Asshole game is one. Negs are another. And to this day I’m surprised how admitting a vulnerability about myself (true or not), in the right context, can instantly strengthen an emotional connection with a girl.
Her: I was hiking in the Amazon and this parrot flew right up to me and tried to eat an apple I was holding in my hand!
Me: Wow, that’s cool. I think I would have ducked for cover.
Her: Why?
Me: Ahh, this is embarrassing to admit [pause... look down... look up... half-smile], but I have a weird fear of parrots ever since one tried to bite my ear off at the zoo when I was six years old.
Her: Awww! Really? That’s so cute!
A few points regarding Soft Underbelly Game:
- Don’t reveal more than one vulnerability about yourself. You may be tempted to do this when you see the positive reaction you get as your date’s eyes light up, but the persuasive confessional power of Soft Underbelly Game is quickly lost with repeated use. “Oh, yeah, I forgot to mention I’m afraid of toy dogs and old ladies, too!” “Um, OK, that’s… strange. Listen, I’ve gotta go. [whispering to herself] beta.”
- Don’t ham it up. Act like you’re ashamed to admit your weakness, don’t wallow in it like it’s a badge of honor. If she starts asking you questions about it, gently dismiss her probing. “You know, I’m not keen on reminding myself how parrots make me their bitch.”
- Don’t run vulnerability game when you first meet a girl. Trying to capture a girl’s interest by sheepishly owning up to a secret fear is known as forced rapport. Emotional connection is effective only after sexy dominance has been established. This is one reason why rock stars can get away with crooning love songs like emo betas without suffering a hit to their sexual market value.
- If you don’t have a vulnerability, make one up. As a perfect specimen of Sith Lord masculinity (pre-prequel version), this is what I have to do. My favorite is to “confess” a fear of small, harmless furry animals, like gerbils or floppy-eared rabbits, because “one attacked me when I was a little boy”. The odder and more off-beat the fear, the better. “I still wake up sometimes. I wake up in the dark and see the flopping of the ears.” What she’s thinking: Only an alpha male would feel comfortable admitting to such a quirky, ridiculous fear.
- Wait for a pretext before confessing your vulnerability. Like so much of social dynamics and face-to-face communication, the influence we have over people is proportional to the natural-soundingness of our delivery. Budding pickup artists often stumble badly in this regard, because tactics, tricks and routines blurted out irrespective of the flow of conversation sound incongruent (i.e. creepy) to the listener’s ears. In the example above, my date talked about hiking in the jungle, which gave me the plausible opening I needed.
- Have a VMD (Vulnerability of Mass Destruction) in your arsenal. For some girls, particularly creative field types who get high on their own emotions, going hardcore by admitting to a really intense fear or sadness will leave such a strong impression on them they’ll masturbate to thoughts of you. Be careful deploying a VMD. Vibe matters. If your rapport is intense, and her demeanor serious, you can talk about how you couldn’t walk down a certain street for months because you once saw a man get killed by a mugger there.
- Contrast is king. The goal of rapport is to take a girl on an emotional adventure, through highs and lows. You want to whisk her to those zeniths and nadirs, not follow her there. (If you let a girl lead the conversation, the highs and lows will disappear in favor of a monotonic conversational plateau. Kiss that vagina goodbye.) Don’t play “Battle of the Vulnerabilities” with her and try to one-up any secrets she reveals about herself. Instead, mirror her when she’s upbeat, but force the downbeat when the groove is right. Learn the art of the segue.
So there you have it. Let your weak flag fly (in brief, measured unfurlings).
One of my favorite tricks. Like you said, it’s very important to pull this one out at the right time. Acting the stoic bad ass alpha all the time can on occasion cause women to question your authenticity… combating this with a heart felt confession that I can’t handle even looking at cockroaches has driven it home for me more times than I can count.
In a way, I think this skirts the edge of getting her to want to “mother” you (sex vibe killer and the way “we’re just friends” is born), but if you have already established that you are a bad ass mother f-er and you don’t want or need mothering, this will work BIG TIME in your favor.
“Let your weak flag fly.” That’s good.
If you don’t have a vulnerability, make one up … My favorite is to “confess” a fear of small, harmless furry animals, like gerbils or floppy-eared rabbits, because “one attacked me when I was a little boy”. The odder and more off-beat the fear, the better … What she’s thinking: Only an alpha male would feel comfortable admitting to such a quirky, ridiculous fear.
Exactly. Admitting to a commonly held and not entirely unreasonable fear would be totally un-Alpha. A fear of flying is a perfect example. Millions of people share that fear, and while the dangers of flying are often exaggerated they’re not completely nonexistent. A true Alpha would be able to overcome any misgivings he might have about flying and certainly would never admit them to a girl.
Peter
can’t it be too weird, though? for example, a fear of ketchup.
I definitely think these work better when they are made up.
“If you let a girl lead the conversation, the highs and lows will disappear in favor of a monotonic conversational plateau.”
So true. Girls can rip the life, blood and guts out of a story like no other.
- MPM
the problem is the day after. since you create fears once any girl talks about something “fearful”, how could you remember in the next day the name of the girl, what she does, where she studies/studied ANDthe fear you confessed?
I’m ashamed to admit this… but I’m afraid of stank-ass unkempt vaginal canals. You don’t have a stank-ass unkempt vaginal canal do you?
Look at that shit… straight MONEY. Not only did I utilize a VMD, I also tossed in a little qualifier as well.
Bitches don’t even see it coming.
oh yeah, bust inside comrades… bust inside
I fear GNP. (shudders)
Too Jimmy Carteresque for me, I’m afraid. (The bunny rabbit bit.) But then Carter was in the Navy, so he could pull it off.
Even though you’re a total vapid dick, you’re right about the vulnerability game. Don’t neglect the fact that girls can fake that shit too… and we often do. More men need to learn the art of the segue, and more women need to stop pretending they actually give a shit.
Yeah, this reminds of “The Breakfast Club” where Judd Nelson’s patheitc version of a rebel suddenly gets Molly Ringwald all wet by making up some story about getting a carton of cigarettes for Xmas.
Emilio Estevez’s character says it right. “That’s just part of his act.”
Still got him laid, though. Although I never thought Ringwald was any prize.
Good call on “The Breakfast Club.” I rememebr that Emilio Estaves’ character (the jock) ended up banging Ali Sheedy’s character (the wierdo chick) who turned out to be pretty good looking once Molly Ringwald’s character (the stuck up princess) fixed her hair and make-up a bit.
I don’t recall what kind of game Estaves’ ran on Sheedy.
very true.
probably the most common rookie mistake is to think that, because X is good, 2X must be twice as good.
in fact, this is the same attitude that leads athletes from small, beneficial doses of steroids to large, catastrophic ones. and too many other examples to count.
and let’s not forget that you MUST continue to cement “sexy dominance”. it should be interspersed with emotional connection, and should also precede and follow that connection.
neglect this at your peril; it’s not entirely coincidental that a huge proportion of rock-star marriages crash and burn in a very short time. offstage, a lot of those guys couldn’t be dominant if they tried – a situation that’s not exactly helped by the fact that pussy is served to them on silver platters, obviating any need to learn actual game.
PA:
“ended up banging Ali Sheedy’s character (the wierdo chick) who turned out to be pretty good looking once Molly Ringwald’s character (the stuck up princess) fixed her hair and make-up a bit.”
—Ally Sheedy young was very cute, and int eh movie, she was cute in a psycho way. Her character probably was into S&M way back in the 80s when no one had heard of blowjobs before.
“I don’t recall what kind of game Estaves’ ran on Sheedy.”
–Absolutely none, unless its sitting in the director’s cut somewhere. She just had a massive crush on him, the popular jock, but was too weird to show it right. I think, comparing the two girls cleaned up and personality wise, Emilio did better than Judd.
At least I figure Sheedy’s character wasn’t too stuck up to go, “A bj? Sure! Should I swallow, or do you want to shoot it on my face?” the afternoon they got let out of detention.
Nelson’s fake rebel act is classic 80s schtick that worked on chicks: bad hair cut, weight lifting globes, cut off sleeves.
I am surprised this article has gone unremarked upon:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/28/nyregion/28daba.html?em
Oh, and then read this:
http://fashionista.com/2009/01/dabas_get_a_book_deal.php
Money quote from the first article:
“It’s not even about a $200 dinner,” Ms. Petrus said. “It’s that he’s an alpha male, he’s aggressive, he’s a go-getter, he doesn’t take no for an answer, he’s confident, people respect him and that creates the whole mystique of who he is.”
Christ, if those women can get a book deal, CH should be able to hook one up no problem. He could even do his own cover art.
i would like to see an accompanying image for this post of you trembling before “the bunny king”, its ears flapping menacingly above you.
also curious as to the effectiveness of “i have a flesh wound/fatal injury” vulnerability game?
I don’t deliberately do this but I would say it’s a definite component of my charm. When I’m tired of talking to a girl rather than struggling to keep talking I will walk away or if I’m with her just kind of get quiet. Noticeably quiet. Usually she’ll ask me if something is wrong. I’ll tell her, not to worry it isn’t her fault I have a habit of retreating within myself to think about things. I’ll say I don’t mean to be rude.
I’m not super concerned about the mechanism at play but with the rest of my personality these little sulks bring out a nurturing aspect in women that has, in the past, tended to cement romantic connections.
A bit contrary here, I think honesty (in a measured dose) works best. When I’m selling a client on some whiz-bang system that he probably doesn’t need, I must remind myself before I meet him how cool the system is, all it’s advantages, why it saves lots of other people money, etc.
Vulnerability here is probably along the lines of: “when my brother was in the hospital, I was so scared.” Or, “when my dog was diagnosed with cancer, I was desperate.”
It works because it’s honest. It is something that everyone feels, but everyone feels it differently, it does not detract from Alpha like say, fear of flying does, it does not come off as a manufactured quote, and you can sell it easily because it is the truth. Just not the whole truth.
It’s also a good way to shut it off — “I don’t want to talk about it any more.” Which puts you in the strong, silent type mode, traditional macho, and closes it down quickly.
I think the best, most natural guys with women reveal aspects of themselves that are NOT fake, but rather real, honest parts of themselves. Just in a very calculated, deliberate way and in a way that does not reveal everything, warts and all.
As far as Sheedy vs. Ringwald, yeah Ringwald was hotter. Still is. That fake rebel stuff, women fall for it every time. Exhibit A: Russell Brand, whom most guys can’t stand but women adore.
“Contrast is King”
Well put. Unpredictability is crucial and particularly in longer-term dalliances difficult to maintain. This is challenging for many men because we tend toward the formulaic. Like you say, if X is good 2X must be twice as good. Hah, not likely.
I agree VMD is beneficial but it must be something that has little practical impact on life. For instance you would never want to express vulnerability or doubt about your career progress or ability to be a good father if you are in a relationship. These things are deal-breakers. I like your idea of petty phobias. What are the odds that you’ll really encounter a free-flying parrot without advanced warning? Slim to none. Gerbils even moreso, though you might want to avoid them for the implication that your fear hearkens back to some misbegotten Richard Gere style incident. Less than alpha, lol.
This vulnerability admission thing makes sense. I recall some social psychology studies I came across in grad school that basically found the same thing: If I can recall it now, people who appear to really have their shit together, who are good-looking, give the image of perfection are hard to for others to identify with. By admitting some fault, embarrassment, or vulnerability, their likability actually goes up. Others can now relate to them. They seem more approachable. …Some of this research might’ve been in the context of public speaking, I forget. A quick Google didn’t turn anything up.
Go figure… something actually useful from those social psychology and social theory classes! (I did Ph.D. research in a vein similar to Cialdini’s _Influence_. …Now, THAT guy has something to say about game!)
Nelson’s fake rebel act is classic 80s schtick that worked on chicks: bad hair cut, weight lifting globes, cut off sleeves.
I haven’t seen the movie since 1987 or so… but Judd’s character seemed pretty genuine to me. Alcoholic father, prole background, etc.
The characters in the movie were my contemporaries and at the time I watched it I thought Judd’s character was pretty cool but slightly scary. As I remember the ’80s, there were lots of guys like that back then. One such guy kicked my ass something fierce. It was the only fight I’ve ever lost.
Chicks didn’t like them, by the way, except for the ones in their own social class.
(And where are the long-haired heavy metal badass guys today? I think they all turned whigger — droopy pants, dopey half-simian walking gait, shaved head, douchebag line of facial hair along their jawline.)
That fake rebel stuff, women fall for it every time.
Not in my observation, seriously. Guys think rebels are cool, but girls are creeped out by them.
But if by “rebel” you mean a preppie with just the right edge, then yeah.
Been going through the archives for awhile. I love this place. It tells it like it is.
Five years ago I quit.
Back in the day, I used to think my problems on the romantic front could be solved for good. I’m had just gotten an M.S. in chemical engineering. I had no financial woes, debt problems, criminal record, alien abduction stories, horrible family problems, religious hang-ups,
or health worries. I had many friends and a close family. I like snow-shoeing, running, soccer, reading, cooking, hiking, writing, my two big huskies Frosty and Snowball, and lots of other pursuits. I even learned how to dress well without looking like a queer.
But I had apparently had some insurmountable strikes against me. I don’t want children and didn’t have any—especially as a step-father for some long-gone bad boy. Also, I’m short. I’m unattractive.
I had a good life and wanted someone with whom to share it, but after years of trying to stay upbeat and asking dozens of women out, after years of trying to get my friends to set me up only to have them dance around the issue that I was simply impossible to match with even a
moderately attractive woman without a weight problem, after years of platitudes like, “It only takes one” and “There’s somebody for everyone!” and other such, it began to wear mighty thin.
I let rejection roll off me easily. I asked girls out in high school. I used “game” and ASF and wingmen and the whole bit. I asked women out in college. In grad school. In the years after grad school when I was starting work. Most were nice in letting me down. Some weren’t. I wasted thousand of dollars and hundreds of hours. I went to churches. I went to dances alone. I tried working through my network of friends. However, women weren’t and aren’t interested in me because of my looks/height and of those that accept that, none have gotten by the no-kids ever thing. I was stupidly optimistic that I could get by if I just kept trying; I believe that myth of “Someday, you’ll make a great guy for somebody!” Unfortunately, I couldn’t do anything about the looks, the height, the high standards. I look the way I do. I act the way I do. I have the standards I have.
I quit at the age of 32. I realized that I was destined to be single.
Few amongst would admit to not being nice. Well, I’m not all that nice myself anymore. I got used to being alone. I took my hard-earned experience to heart and decided to quit. I quit making a fool of myself. I quit believing that everybody gets somebody they want eventually. I set my life up such that work, physical exercise, reading, looking forward to and planning solo vacations, and my dogs
are my entire world.
I’m a 38-year-old virign and proud of it.
I just wish that I had heard this advice earlier in life; for many years I had humored the illusion that *eventually* I would—evidently by magic—find a partner to share my life with. I did this partly from my own foolish optimism but partly because people always felt the need to patronize me and to say inane things like “there’s someone for
everyone” and “someday you’ll make someone happy” when what I really needed to hear someone say was the following:
“Yes, you are unattractive and short and there is nothing you can do about it. Yes, refusing to father children, or to be a step-father, is a handicap and limits the number of potential mates even further. Finally, the standards you have totally scuttle you. The chances of you finding someone that (1) will accept these facts about you and still want to be with you and (2) to which you are also
attracted to, is ZERO. You will never pair off with someone and you will live your entire life alone. This is inevitable and you should prepare yourself for it.”
Why didn’t anybody ever say this before I went to where pretty lies die? One is profit motive. There is very little money in writing self-help books that say the reader is screwed. Two is this creeping politeness that compels people to lie instead of telling the frank truth.
Enough. CH was right. I was done. And my life moved on to higher, happier plain.
Speaking of ’80s teen movies, “Lucas” from 1990 or so was a pretty good one. A nerdy, wimpy lesser-beta named Lucas lays massive groundwork in wooing a super-hot girl, until a jock classmate (Charlie Sheen) swoops in and whisks her away. What was good about this movie was that the jock was a fully developed and sympathetic character.
The one scene in which Lucas thinks the moment is right, the vibes are tender, and leans in to kiss this girl — and she recoils with unmitigated disgust — is a classic.
The whole Omega Dude thing is a put-on, right?
I have a question, especially for the brothas in here.
Speaking of the term “whigger” (or “wigger”, I don’t think the spelling is set), I was in a bar a few weeks ago chatting up some girl–on election night, no less. Anyway, some dude was all over her, and she was trying to extract herself from him, so I swooped in and began physically blocking the guy from her while she turned away from him and flirted with me.
He left (he was a drunken mess), she thanked me, and we kept going. We talked about him after he left and made jokes, all was well, until I mentioned that the guy was a “whigger” and needed his ass kicked.
Suddenly, she went cold. “I can’t believe you would use a term like that. especially on tonight of all nights.” She looked at me with a disapproving-teacher glance.
I got pissed and immediately stopped talking to her. She tried to goad me into apologizing for it or feeling bad (I was sitting next to her at this point), but I refused to speak to her.
Now, I think whigger is a perfectly acceptable (if NSFW) term for a certain segment of the population–white guys who act like black ghetto jokes. She apparently thinks its a racial slur. I’d like to get people’s opinion on this.
As a follow up, I ignored her and drank and talked to another girl, but 2 hours later, still sitting next to me, she gets up to leave and taps me on the shoulder and goes, “I’d like to say goodbye.”
“Why? You stopped talking to me hours ago.”
“What? You don’t own me! I was being nice.”
“Don’t let the door hit you.”
I like how it ended.
“It’s not even about a $200 dinner,” Ms. Petrus said. “It’s that he’s an alpha male, he’s aggressive, he’s a go-getter, he doesn’t take no for an answer, he’s confident, people respect him and that creates the whole mystique of who he is.”
Social context is very important. DC/New York’s “alpha male” is Chicago’s “arrogant nerd.”
Now, I think whigger is a perfectly acceptable (if NSFW) term for a certain segment of the population–white guys who act like black ghetto jokes. She apparently thinks its a racial slur. I’d like to get people’s opinion on this.
I don’t see anything objectionable about it. Of course it should be used with care, but that doesn’t mean it’s out and out taboo.
Peter
Omega Dude,
“I was simply impossible to match with even a
moderately attractive woman without a weight problem,”
The sad truth is that you have to match with someone within you’re attractiveness zone. If you’re a 2 then you’ll probably find a mate that’s a 2.
You’re options at this point are a.) “settle” for a 2 b.) whack off to 9s and 10s via Internet porn. If option a.) is not desirable (and I don’t blame you if you think so) drop out of the game. Nobody says you have to play it. Focus on your career, friends, hobbies etc. and place value on that instead of females.
Omega,
sorry, re-read your post and saw that you came to these conclusions on your own. Good post.
it can’t it be too weird, though? for example, a fear of ketchup
Agreed, a ridiculous fear that like would make you sound like a lunatic. It has to be a fear that makes sense, but just barely so.
Peter
To the 38 yo old virgin. If you have money, you have no excuse for being a virgin.
And, don’t worry, they’ll love you until the money runs out, just like those gals in the recent NY Times article on wives and girlfriends of down on their luck investment bankers.
You will really enjoy the variety, too.
And, you will be happier in the end, that the association is temporary, not permanent. Don’t fall in love with any of them.
One of my favorite characters was the short fat rich guy in “The Milagro Beanfield War”. He had this aging blond wife/bimbo with him. It was never spelled out, but you got the impression that this guy had had a string of bimbos all his life (short, fat, bald guy, hah hah), and she was just the one he was with when he got too old to bother getting a new one, and just kept her. Two great performances. As a bonus, the bimbo had the most insightful line in the whole movie.
If you stay healthy, which is easier if you are unmarried and don’t have some woman fixing you crappy food all the time and watch what you eat, exercise intelligently, don’t smoke, etc. you will be able to actively enjoy the ladies for many years to come.
Anyhow, just don’t get married if you want to keep your money for yourself. If you got married to a “quality woman” it would likely just be a gold digger.
@Joel: women don’t sleep with short guys even if they have money. i’ve realized this myself.
this is a good post…although isn’t this pretty much pushing us to do the obvious (that is, to be honest)?
also 38yo virgin, your life seems like hell. how long will you take solo vacations? your story keeps reminding me why i hate women.
Once again, for men :
Height trumps Race
Wealth trumps Height*
Game trumps all
The good news is, Game is something you CAN do something about, unlike race or height. Game also takes less effort than wealth creation.
*depending on how much wealth vs. how large a deficiency in height.
– I hate to break it to you, bro’:
You neither need to be tall nor good looking nor wanting kids to score a hot chick.
The truth is that women do not care about your exterior as long as you are the highest status guy in their little world.
But whining about women and how poorly people treated you or the unfairness of life in general is neither helpful towards that goal, nor is it close to anything of what ch is after in his writings.
“If you let a girl lead the conversation, the highs and lows will disappear in favor of a monotonic conversational plateau. Kiss that vagina goodbye.”
=== But first make sure it’s clean, not a disgusting pelt. Except Peter, of course.
Days of Broken Arrows “The whole Omega Dude thing is a put-on, right?”
=== Jesus Christ, I hope so. One David Alexander is more than enough.
I quit at the age of 32. I realized that I was destined to be single.
That’s interesting. You should have seen the shock on my mother’s face when I told her that I “quit” at 25…
how long will you take solo vacations?
As a railfan, I’ll be taking solo vacations for the next twenty years with the possible exception of one female railfan friend.
Game is something you CAN do something about, unlike race
They do sell skin lightening creams at some beauty shops…
“They do sell skin lightening creams at some beauty shops…”
1) Those are for women
2) Those only make a small difference. Michael Jackson did not use these creams to lose all the shades he lost.
3) You would rather use cream rather than learn Game, even though Race is the least crucial factor among the 4 mentioned?
“Except Peter, of course.”
I suspect Peter has some latent bestial proclivities.
In fact, I know the perfect woman for Peter :
*She is highly educated (a scientist)
*She is very compassionate, yet strong
*She has a sense of humor
*She has kissed a white man, who is a supreme alpha (Charlton Heston)
The woman of Peter’s dreams :
http://philippe.heurtel.info/ImagesSinges/F3Zira.jpg
What’s GNP?
11 minutes:
‘The truth is that women do not care about your exterior as long as you are the highest status guy in their little world.’
why is everyone so interested in outliers?
from article you cited:
“In the time we were together we made love only six times as I would always find excuses for why I couldn’t do it,” she said.
she goes on to say how she thought the sex was the least attractive part of their relationship even though she wanted to be his ‘girlfriend.’ even this ugly, short outlier has some problems with it.
height augments game.
looks augment game.
money augments game.
race augments game (for same race chicks).
none of which, btw, disprove the basic concept that game is still necessary to get anywhere with women.
Losing weight helps your game tremendously. Find me an unattractively overweight PUA coach that has a good reputation and people have seen pull women in the field. Can anyone think of one?
Are the advantages of high T worth it?
—
“High testosterone individuals are more likely to drink more, smoke more and get in accidents and fights … Many of them are unemployed.”
Humans may have evolved with testosterone because the hormone is useful in conflict situations. Booth has shown that levels of it rise in chess players, wrestlers and tennis players before a match. Studies have shown that women with high levels of testosterone might choose male-dominated occupations more than other women.
In men, high levels of testosterone are also associated with better health. High-T men are less likely to be obese, for example, and generally have a stronger cardiovascular system.
But in men, who produce about seven times more testosterone than women, too much of the hormone can cause antisocial and risky behavior. High-T men are more likely to commit a crime, according to past studies.
“Men with high levels of testosterone are more likely to be unfaithful, abusive and less close in relationships with their wives,” Booth said. They’re more likely to divorce. Some high-T men aren’t good marriage partners.”
Fathers with high levels of testosterone often don’t have good relationships with their kids…
We’re concerned that the reason some high-T people are antisocial is because of the way they were treated as youths.”
- http://bbh.hhdev.psu.edu/labs/behavioral%20endo%20lab/penn_state_researchers_study_lin.htm
11minutes – dude, what the fuck happened to your WordPress blog?
I’ve only seen very, very few blogs be deleted/censored by WordPress and only then under rather extreme circumstances. And even then I’m pretty sure there is a way to recover your previous posts there, to transfer them over to another blog site somehow. It would be a shame if you lost all of your good past posts.
You think a group of feminazis reported you all at once claiming they were ‘offended’ to try to bring your blog down? Or New York Times copyright infringement or something?
What’s GNP?
The most wonderful, magical, delicious part of a woman, unfortunately one that’s heading toward extinction.
Specifically, GNP stands for Glorious Natural Pelt. Also known as a thick, rich, luxuriant bush.
Peter
If you stay healthy, which is easier if you are unmarried and don’t have some woman fixing you crappy food all the time and watch what you eat
Single guys are less healthy overall, especially when past their early 30s. They eat like shit, usually fast food and frozen meals, gas station snacks, with pizza and chinese delivery to round things out.
The whole O m e g a Dude thing is a put-on, right?
I know there are guys like that out there. Individual specifics aside, he sounds exactly like my almost-40-years-old o m e g a friend “Ace.”
So Omega Dude, seemingly a 2/3, realizes that he can’t the 9/10 he longs for, who don’t mind dating an ugly short guy, and who also have to give up any idea of children, and this is somehow women’s fault? There are plenty of 2/3 women who are out there, and very gettable for a man in his position. If he was willing to be more flexible about the children, he might even get a 4/5. But in America, only the best will do, for everyone, even when the best is not realistically attainable for everyone.
But other commenters are right. He has no excuse for being a virgin. If he wants a 9/10, he can hire one temporarily, just to see what it is like. My guess is that Omega Dude probably just has a low sex drive, because most men would still go for the omega girls in their 20′s if no one else would have them. The high standards thing is just an excuse.
On a different note, that “support group” for the (hideously materialistic) girlfriends of now-financially stressed investment bankers, which got all sorts of publicity earlier this week, appears to be a hoax.
Peter
The high standards thing is just an excuse.
Not necessarily. Sex with a woman below one’s threshold of attractiveness is no longer a consolation prize, but a hassle; and lower still, it becomes something that is more repulsive than it is pleasurable.
RF Interference:
“. Find me an unattractively overweight PUA coach that has a good reputation and people have seen pull women in the field. Can anyone think of one?”
—Paul Blart, Mall Cop.
Seriously, though, The King Of Queens has more female admirers than you would think.
Sadly, so does that talentless fat lard of annoyance, Jack Black.
But speaking of o m e g a males, I don’t think that sex is the biggest thing they’re missing out on by being lonely.
Humans, at lease heterosexual ones, need to have the presence of someone of the opposite sex. It’s probably something on the subconscious, olfactory/hormonal level: a chamical need to be around the “scent” of the opposite sex, without which we go crazy. Like oddball ageing bachelors and spinster cat ladies.
This probably explains why David Alexander is indifferent to sex, but loves getting hugs from girls.
Also, this explains why single guys prize the GFE (“girlfriend experience”) in professionals. In other words, they are acting out on their need to feel a woman’s touch, to smell her neck as her hair falls on his face, etc.
Less so the need for PSE (“pron star experience”) which is something that emotionally satisfied men in LTRs are more after when they stray.
freak show -
why is everyone so interested in outliers?
Well, if I’d be able to show you a single talking pig, you would not be able to claim anymore that pigs can’t speak, would you?
But there is another interesting twist to what you say:
It is women who go for outliers (i.e. alphas).
This guy is a celebrity, which gives him social status beyond anything of what most of us will be able to reach in our lives.
If you read the article carefully, you will also see that it is not just the prestige, but also how he acts that made her “fall for him”. Status is not something you have, it is something you do.
- He had the balls to ask for her number
- He did not seem to care about his unfortunate condition
- He did not buy her a dinner or something for their date, but they “just watched American Idol and played video games”
- He was not needy – it was her going for more: “I just leaned over and kissed him”
- “he ordered her around “like a slave”.” and made her “buy his groceries and carry them home and cook dinner, although most days all Verne would eat would be a blueberry muffin and then he’d be full. And not once did I get a thank-you.”
- after she moved in he made her work “as a waitress in a fast-food restaurant between acting jobs, to pay half of the rent.”
- she says the sex was bad (just like any other ex-girlfriend does), yet they made a video that circulates on the internet and it doesn’t look like she doesn’t enjoy it
and here is the kicker:
I caught him cheating numerous times!!!
That guy is a true alpha.
Why?
height augments game.
looks augment game.
money augments game.
race augments game (for same race chicks).
Maybe (depends on what you define as “game”).
But the truth of the matter is
Social Status trumps everything.
If your mindset is to supplicate (I need to be tall, rich, white, handsome, hung like a horse and able to shoot laser rays out of my left nostril), you won’t get anywhere in life.
Also, this explains why single guys prize the GFE (”girlfriend experience”) in professionals … Less so the need for PSE (”porn star experience”) which is something that emotionally satisfied men in LTRs are more after when they stray.
Now, if I were going to hire a “professional,” I’d insist on a GNPE.
Which might be a very difficult request to have fulfilled :(
Peter
Another example of lonely guys needing the chemical effects that come by merely being close to a woman, rather than sex itself:
Think of a typical leser-Beta, and how he gets crushes on any girl that will talk to him. She doesn’t need to be hot. He doesn’t necessarily even want to bang her. Make out with her, get naked with her, hug her, go to bed with her. But not sex itself as a primary need in this situation.
This describes any puppydog needy guy out there: a chemically-deprived poor soul who feels he’s profoundly off balance, not due to lack of sex — after all, he’s got two good hands and broadband — sbut due to an unsatisfied need for a woman’ stouch and smell alone.
Which is why when a marginally cute girls shows something he interprets as interest (as in, she says “hi” to him) he’s liable to get obsessed over her.
And that’s probably why women avoid needy guys. Their chemical radars pick up on his lonesome chemical unbalance.
PA: so what do guys like him do? i think people naturally need someone of the opposite gender around to stay perfectly sane. women are more repulsed by neediness because it indicates that you don’t have anyone else, not because it shows that you have some permanent trait of “being needy.”
“So Omega Dude, seemingly a 2/3, realizes that he can’t the 9/10 he longs for, who don’t mind dating an ugly short guy, and who also have to give up any idea of children, and this is somehow women’s fault? There are plenty of 2/3 women who are out there, and very gettable for a man in his position. If he was willing to be more flexible about the children, he might even get a 4/5. But in America, only the best will do, for everyone, even when the best is not realistically attainable for everyone.”
well part of it is because 2/3 women bring it upon themselves, whereas short guys don’t. really, unless they are in the bottom 5% of the facial hideousness distribution, women are 2/3′s because they are fat. that is a big character flaw. being short isn’t. so yeah, it does say something about women.
and why should he saddle someone else’s kids just so that he can get a 4/5? he obviously made the tradeoff and figured a lifetime of responsibility for two bastard children wasn’t worth sex with a 4/5. and don’t make this an american thing you ass.
funny thing is, guys like omega dude usually have normal personalities…women who are 2/3′s don’t.
I am afraid of hamsters. They are vicious animals that WILL draw blood from the nearest digit. I’ve seen fingers mutilated by the beasts. The absolute worst breed is the Russian dwarf hamster.
so what do guys like him do
I have two o m e g a male friends, and I’ve described them at length (while respecting their anonymity) in earlier threads. Both are my age, ie. approaching fourty.
What’s interesting is that one of them, “Mike” has set out on a course of radical self-improvement. At my suggestion he joined my gym and in the course of six months lost his excess weight and is starting to get muscular bulk; he quit smoking pot (heavy pot smoking fuels loserish traits in guys) and is now studying game, going out for happy hour with people from his work, talking to girls, and so on. I suspect that he just might turn things around for himself.
The other guy, “Ace,” gave up. He’s physically deteriorating (gaining weight from inactivity and junk food), plays video games and goes strip-clubbing with his Alpha friends, and visits professionals.
“The whole Omega Dude thing is a put-on, right?”
You guys say this all the time, usually about DA.
For you guys, relationships are as easy as eating dinner.
It comes naturally. Not so, for a sizeable segment of the
male population. A whole ton of guys will see at least
parts of themselves in Omega Man’s story.
The vast majority of women want children. So by eliminating almost all women, Omega Dude has put himself into a very small corner. Those who don’t want children, and are very hot to boot are in extremely high demand, so why should they be with a loser guy? He could punch above his weight and get with a 4/5, and have his own kids with her. Or barring that, since he is 38, he could also get with someone his own age, a divorcee who started early, and whose kids are basically grown, so he doesn’t have to deal with them, and she isn’t pestering him to have more. I would say he could frequent cancer survivor sites, as chemotherapy often makes women infertile, but many of those women would probably still want to adopt. For his purposes, I think option #2 is best and easiest. But despite being a 2/3, he feels he deserves a 9/10, which ain’t gonna happen, as he recognizes.
This probably explains why David Alexander is indifferent to sex, but loves getting hugs from girls.
If I’m awful at sex, and she’s not going to orgasm from my crappy little beta penis and it’s weak stamina, and I’ll keep ranking her below porn stars, then sex seems like a waste of time. I might as well concentrate on the emotional benefits, and I can squeeze that out of a platonic relationship for the fraction of a cost of a real relationship. So why bother when sex when I really need the hug, the one thing that she can do right*?
*Actually, some girls are awful at hugs too. Wellesley Queen gave the best hugs, while my former mistress gave so-so hugs. Non-date gives some decent hugs, but it could be better. The sixteen year old girl who wanted me when I was 19, OTOH, gave some awful hugs…
O m e g a Dude – I too agree that sometimes –rarely– there is nothing a person can do to make themselves attractive to the people they find attractive. In other times, there were organization like monasteries that allowed celibates to receive social prestige, but it is unfortunate our culture has developed the crushing doctrine of “mating or meaninglessness”. There is also some subtext that states that ever giving up on one’s dream is an act of cowardice.
Meh. I say it is just as likely one of courage and maturity. It takes a Kipling’s “If” kind of man to face the world when what would have been valued the most has been rendered inaccessible. One may choose to live life in a futile struggle against a fate, like Sisyphus and his boulder, but that is not necessarily a better way to live.
O m e g a Dude, I hope you will give yourself credit for having a mind independent enough to resist conformity, the self-help mantras, the blasted feminists who say you’re morally obligated to settle for some one you don’t want, the assholes who try to showered with condolences and platitudes, and the unsympathetic optimists’ obstructions as you try to scavenge whatever happiness you can reasonably expect from life.
For years I too was spurned by every girl I ever liked–dozens of them–and lived in a state of perpetual heartache and misery over the pains of deprived love. The only one I ever even kissed without me paying her by the hour was crazy and drunk and told me she regretted it the next day. Despite many talents and kindnesses, I was loathed. I realized that this was not my fault, but that, being 5’5″ I suffer from a deformity called congenital short stature. I am also unattractive. It’s not whining or a sign of low self-esteem to state these facts. I hold some resentment toward those who feigned interest to exploit me, but I never wanted a woman less than a 6 and held no malice toward those who rejected me on the same grounds.
Like he says, below some level of attractiveness, your junk simply will not respond. The only women I can pull –no matter what I do—are below that number. That’s just the way it goes and no “just try harder” bromides will change that. What others think means little to me now. Their esteem of most would be poor consolation indeed if I had to take the 2s and 3s fate has saddled me with.
Since I will never father a family and have no further need to impress anyone, I am freed from the rat-race of the stress to success. Despite having a technical college degree, I just work as few and relaxed of hours in the easiest and most enjoyable job I can find, and fill my free time with personal interests and distractions. I relish friends and have many of both gender. Friends and family and church keep me grounded and surrounded, as I like to say, and prevent me from falling into the trap of unhealthy bachelor life. I also take time to appreciate the beauty of small things others don’t even bother to notice, and enjoy the entertainments provided by modern technology, DVD’s, games, porn, etc. Life isn’t nearly as bad as I used to think it would be.
Unfortunately, message board types like David Alexander, of which I long ago was, are either looking for false hope or extra toppings of pity and may not well receive messages from perspectives like ours. Most wouldn’t linger here if they wanted to move on from those issues and consider other things to do like I did.
Goodbye all,
Brad
Unfortunately, message board types like David Alexander
Admittedly, a part of me does have some hope that I’ll find somebody, but as I’ve noted, I passed the quarter of a century mark, which for all intents and purposes makes a man into a de facto spinster. At this point, the best course of action is to probably go about my life and finish school, find a decent job, and enjoy my hobbies, porn, friends, and of course, my niece and nephews.
“the blasted feminists who say you’re morally obligated to settle for some one you don’t want”
Who are the feminists who say this, pray tell?
Someone or other said: “More men need to learn the art of the segue, and more women need to stop pretending they actually give a shit.”
Ya, the seque. Tempo. Verse, chorus, bridge. Timing is everything. The bass player gets it as much as does the lead.
No Self Strong enough to own a Name said: “the blasted feminists who say you’re morally obligated to settle for some one you don’t want” .. Who are the feminists who say this, pray tell?
The ones who say you are morally obligated to marry if you infect a female with a baby parasite.
Mr. Written Rules said: ” “If you let a girl lead the conversation, the highs and lows will disappear in favor of a monotonic conversational plateau.” . So true. Girls can rip the life, blood and guts out of a story like no other.
Not quite. Some girls are entrancing and expertly. The point of seeing that 90% of all female interaction is crap, isn’t that female interaction is crap. 90% of everything is crap. It’s to point out that the man holds the responsibility to change the frame, to manipulate the discourse, to turn the water into wine.
Someone fucking girls his own age said: “Still got him laid, though. Although I never thought Ringwald was any prize.”
You judge based on relative hotness within a subset. Older guys judge based on relative hotness. She was in her prime, and needn’t have a face that would last the years. Just perfectly excellent for an older guy.
Someone who likes to quote without insightful commentary quoted: ““It’s not even about a $200 dinner,” Ms. Petrus said. “It’s that he’s an alpha male, he’s aggressive, he’s a go-getter, he doesn’t take no for an answer, he’s confident, people respect him and that creates the whole mystique of who he is.””
That’s probably as close as a women can get to understanding her own motivations. Not bad. But it still barely touches on her vulnerabilities to being puppeted or the meta-underying-big-picture situation of which she is embedded. She wants such a man… why? Because he is like that?
“The ones who say you are morally obligated to marry if you infect a female with a baby parasite.”
Anyone who makes that demand is no feminist. A shrewish, grasping harpy, sure, but that is not what actual feminism is about.
A real feminist would take responsibility for getting knocked up, not a) attempt to foist it off on someone else, or b) look to a guy to rescue her. (This is not to say that a man isn’t half-responsible for the child he co-creates, but that certainly doesn’t require marrying the mother — or doing anything for her. Obligation to the child? Absolutely. Obligation to the woman? Not at all.)
Equality means that if you want the perks, you also take the lumps. Anyone who wants something for nothing is not a feminist.
@PA,
I very much agree with your comments re: the need for men to touch women. Agree with your comments on hugs, GFE, and simple touch. I think men will readily ask for ‘sex” (ex.: Craigslist) , when they simply need to be touched. Men without touch develop ticks and general weirdness.
I disagree that women need men’s touch: they benefit from men’s touch, but it is less essential. Women touch babies, patients, children, and each other. Widowed and divorced women get along fine without men’s touch because they have other opportunities.
I disagree that women need men’s touch:
what women need is rock hard cock driving into their pussies up to the hilt, crashing into their wombs with the ferocity of a beast unleashed, and making them feel delightfully small, weak and submissive.
Well, what men *really* need is to be teased: to be tied up, feathered down the back, warm breath behind the ears, wispy touches to the thighs, nibbles to the chin, and then left alone, making them feel frustrated.
Anony, feathers???
No, if you want a real thrill, try vampire gloves very gently grazed over the thighs.
…followed by a paintbrush with ginger juice.
Both men and women enjoy surrender. The problem is getting with someone who one can trust that much.
…but like it or not, the mechanical reality of sex is that men are built to be penetrators and women, penetrated. For the multiorgasmic woman with fit pelvic muscles especially, there is nothing like long (as in time), strong penetration to get the job done.
Some women don’t like sex. I can respect that. Some women don’t like men. I can respect that too. Those of us who do like sex and like men though, do feel that we need them around, and this includes normal everyday touches. Being hugged by a man is special. One of the things I enjoy the most about being a strong woman is the ability to take a full force “our team won” squeeze. Nothing like it in the world.
I won’t even get into bruise making horny grabs. Don’t want to put that detailed of a mental image out there for the anti warpig circle. ;)
Some male touches are, in my opinion, quite important for social reasons as well. My male friends or relatives who have no designs on getting into my pants, sometimes do “guiding touches” or “gatekeeping” that lets other guys in an area know that I’m like, protected. It’s not an overtly territorial thing like a boyfriend would do, but more of a “this lady is treasured” kind of thing.
Maybe too many women are convinced they don’t need these things because they haven’t really been open enough to get them. I suppose if you never know what you’re missing, you don’t miss it…but if you can, try it. Let guys be gentlemen towards you without punishing them for it, and they will.
Anonymous typed “But despite being a 2/3, he feels he deserves a 9/10, which ain’t gonna happen, as he recognizes.”
I in no way feel entitled nor deserving of a 9/10. It’s not that losers have any trouble finding other losers to have sex with. It’s that it can take two losers a really long time to come to terms with having to settle for each other.
There are poor people who fall in love with their shitbox cars, too. But don’t pretend they’d be driving their shitboxes for long if they could easily afford any car in the world. To imagine that they would is condescension of the same sort as the slave owners who insisted that black people were happiest taking orders from white people.
SpinelessName said: “Anyone who makes that demand is no feminist.”
Ya. And the sky is blue. And I have a big toe. You sound like a retard, stating the obvious.
O mega-man shared: “I in no way feel entitled nor deserving of a 9/10.”
It’s always a trade off. Chances are you could date a woman with a 9/10 body and face. She’ll be from some bumfuck nowhere village and be useless for anything except sex and cookery. I recommend it.
Don’t forget – even Indiana motherfucking Jones was afraid of snakes.