1. fuchsdh

    fuchsdh
    Member

    Well, “The Alternative Factor” is IMO one of the worst episodes of the franchise, so I won’t hold that against you (also the example of where if later Trek is bad, at least it has shorter running times or side plots to distract from the badness.)
     
  2. Cheebo

    Cheebo
    Member

    That is what makes Discovery so refreshing. It's nice to finally after 50+ years to have a lead that isn't a Starfleet Captain.
     
  3. Happenstance

    Happenstance
    Member

    DS9 managed it for a couple of seasons.
     
  4. Lagamorph

    Lagamorph
    Member

    Having just re-watched the Voyager episode "Twisted" I really wish we'd gotten a follow up.
    Just who the hell was behind the distortion? Did any of the novels even go back to that?
     
  5. rjinaz

    rjinaz
    Member

    Yeah I agree, I was mostly just having fun, I like Michael
     
  6. chrominance

    chrominance
    Member

    The first half of BSG is what Voyager should've been, to me. The fourth or fifth episode of the first season deals with a WATER crisis. That's such a fundamental resource to be short on and exactly the sort of thing you'd take for granted until your entire support structure disappears and you have to fend for yourself, and it's the kind of problem Voyager pretty much never deals with. The events that bridge the first two seasons also hint at what could've been for the Maquis/Federation crew conflict.

    Sure, the latter half descends into religious prophesizing and whatnot (though not before my favourite arc of the series, the start of the third season). Voyager was well served not to fall into that pit. But the original premise of "shit everyone is dead and we're on our own, how do we survive" was something BSG committed to, whereas Voyager only hinted at it in alternate universes and what-if scenarios (Year of Hell, Course: Oblivion, Equinox).
     
  7. firehawk12

    firehawk12
    Member

    I was just re-reading the Moore interview where he shits on Voyager and thinking about this and yeah, BSG really does feel like a direct response to Voyager and how he hated his short time there.

    Of course, knowing that it amounted to nothing in hindsight doesn't help. Unless you're cool with harem space-Jesus Gaddafi-esque Baltar.
     
  8. firehawk12

    firehawk12
    Member

    So is this Midnight's Edge channel one of those alt-right youtubers? lol
    Youtube popped one of their up based on some lawsuit with a game creator (which seems insane given that the game is called Tardigrade...).
     
  9. MrKlaw

    MrKlaw
    Member

    started watching Enterprise. For some reason although I'm a fan of ST, I've never seen more than a couple of episodes (same with DS9).

    Just finished the first season, using a guide to skip some episodes. Was... ok I guess. A bit nothingy - humans moaning about Vulcans, Vulcans rolling their eyes in a non-emotional honest guv way. The second part of the season 1 finale was a bit bollocks though - although ST can tend to have great cliffhanger endings and then open the season with overly neat Deus Ex Machina solutions.

    Moving on to season 2 proper now. I've been warned not to watch the very last episode of season 4?
     
  10. MCN

    MCN
    Member

    A big problem (but far from the only problem) with that episode, is you need to have seen a particular episode of The Next Generation for context.
     
  11. Happenstance

    Happenstance
    Member

    I'd still say watch the episode. It's bad but its better to watch it so you actually have context when it comes up in discussions etc. That's kind of the same reason I'm not a fan of people using those guides for Trek shows that only have you watching certain episodes.
     
  12. KSweeley

    KSweeley
    Community Resettler Member OP

    Huh??? This was in EctetERA, why is this in Hangouts now???
     
  13. CommodoreKong

    CommodoreKong
    Member

    It always should have been in hangouts, I assume they moved it during the second maintenance.
     
  14. KSweeley

    KSweeley
    Community Resettler Member OP

    But the major problem with Hangouts is threads die in this part of ERA....
     
  15. CommodoreKong

    CommodoreKong
    Member

    Sounds like something a prominent member would say ;)

    I do agree more could be done to help OTs in hangouts (perhaps 2 spotlight threads at a time) but I imagine most regular posters watch this thread.
     
  16. KSweeley

    KSweeley
    Community Resettler Member OP

    I wish that I was a "Prominent Member" but nope, I wasn't one of the people consulted for this change despite having the "Community Resettler" tag because I helped migrate a lot of former GAF people over to ERA.
     
  17. KSweeley

    KSweeley
    Community Resettler Member OP

  18. Watching Riker on the Klingon ship is like watching someone trying to fit into prison.
     
  19. StallionDan

    StallionDan
    Member

    Because among other things it kinda BS for Voyager to go through that and not have senior officers die.

    Unrelated...

    I just got done on a Voyager S1-7 rewatch (skipping episodes here and there). In S4/5/6 they really did some travelling. I'm pretty sure they should have been in the Beta Quadrant by then (though in 'message in a bottle' the adjacent quadrant to Delta is Alpha???).

    Looking at the travelling...

    S4 - The Gift - 10 years/10kLY jump from Kes
    S4 - Hope and Fear - 300LY (about 3 months)
    S5 - Night - 2.5kLY/2.5 years
    S5 - Timeless - 10kLY/10 years
    S5/ - Dark Frontier - 20kLY/20 years (though Janeway states 20k/15 years for some reason).
    Plus 5 years of travel at warp by S5 end.

    So at this point they are just shy of 48kLY home. This well over half their journey and should be out of the Delta Quadrant by then. In S6 they use a catapult to travel another 3kLY. Plus the S6/7 travel bring the total by Endgame to shy of 53kLY. (Maybe a bit less as they wouldn't travel quite 1kLY a year).

    Apparently for the next 23 years they found no more shortcuts.
     
  20. I mean if any crew has an expendable senior staff...it's voyager.
     
  21. butalala

    butalala
    Member

    The answer to most things that don't make sense in Voyager is simply "bad writing."
     
  22. firehawk12

    firehawk12
    Member

    https://scifi.stackexchange.com/que...n-the-delta-quadrant-at-the-end-of-the-series

    This is one of those things people talk about all the time. lol
     
  23. Happenstance

    Happenstance
    Member

    The actual answer is that Tom Paris never really knew where he was going and was too embarrassed to say anything.
     
  24. MCN

    MCN
    Member

    I only watched that episode yesterday! It's a decent episode.
     
  25. JonnyDBrit

    JonnyDBrit
    Member

    The only way I ever makes sense of it is that they got flung to the far side of the Delta quadrant, and assuming that Voyager then went at something at a sharp angle towards the Federation's general area around the Alpha-Beta border, but I'm probably forgetting possible instances where they pinned its location more precisely which then make no sense.

    But even then that ends up a bit iffy. Because the Delta Quadrant can only be ~50k light years out from the galactic core, so the examples from the discussion linked above should still have gotten them to the Beta quadrant by some point. Of course, that would compromise the whole 'lost in the delta quadrant' tagline.
     
  26. Cheerilee

    Cheerilee
    Member

    IIRC, one of the Voyager producers said at some point that they didn't want to confuse the audience by switching from saying the words "Delta Quadrant" on an almost weekly basis to saying some new "Beta Quadrant" words. They didn't want the audience to be burdened with reading a map. They didn't want the audience thinking that some sort of change to the status quo had happened, when it was business as usual for the show (Voyager specifically did not want to have continuity, because they wanted casual viewers to wander in or leave at any time, or watch rerun episodes out of order, and not feel like they missed anything).
     
  27. Lagamorph

    Lagamorph
    Member

    Janeway does mention at one point that they added 2 years to the trip purely from avoiding The Borg, so it's entirely possible that time got added for other issues like having to go around anomalies and hostile species.
     
  28. MCN

    MCN
    Member

    Or looking in nebulae for coffee. Or evolving into salamanders.
     
  29. Sephzilla

    Sephzilla
    Member

    I still maintain that the end of Voyager's 6th season should have ended with them crossing into the Alpha Quadrant, but on some wrong side where they have to cross through the space of an old foe like the Romulans or something. And then the last season is a super tense cat and mouse season where everyone is super on edge because they're almost home but now have to be super careful about not getting caught.
     
  30. Happenstance

    Happenstance
    Member

    Nah they should have made it as far as Mars then the second Caretaker, still mad at them flings them back to Ocampa.
     
  31. Lagamorph

    Lagamorph
    Member

    You've also got the issue that Voyager won't have been at High Warp constantly and constantly on a heading for home. I think the 1,000 light years in 1 year thing comes from Voyager maintaining high warp speed.
    But you've got issues of having to lower speed to rest the engines, drop out of Warp entirely to perform maintenance, divert to locate fuel, obtain said fuel, make stops for trading for supplies, diverting to do general exploration, etc.
    All of that is going to add a lot of time when it all adds up.
     
  32. MCN

    MCN
    Member

    But with astrometrics, surely they would avoid entering Romulan territory in the first place. That would be incredibly bad writing.
     
  33. Sephzilla

    Sephzilla
    Member

    ...so par for the course?

    I mean, they could work around that by saying Voyager found some wormhole to the alpha quadrant but then surprise the wormhole wasn't entirely stable and it actually shot them out somewhere else in the alpha quadrant.
     
  34. Teiresias

    Teiresias
    Member

    I think it works if Endgame is a Season 6 finale where they pop out of the now decimated transwarp conduit system like Sephzilla is saying in a bad location in the Alpha or Beta quadrant, rather than just popping out right there at Earth (but not in a borg sphere). I mean, they already tried to fake the audience out with whether they'd gotten home due to needing to adust heading while in the transwarp system anyway.

    I'm not sure how to make this work for a season though since starships frequently go between Romulan and Klingon territory and back to Federation space within single episodes in the other shows. There would have to be some overarching reason for it to be as perilous as it would need to be.
     
  35. butalala

    butalala
    Member

    If the Voyager writers/producers didn't want to do a show with continuity, they shouldn't have picked a premise that is so premise-heavy. They should have picked something more conducive to TNG-Lite storytelling. Honestly, something like Disco's Spore Jumps would have worked well for a post-TNG, TNG-Lite series.
     
  36. firehawk12

    firehawk12
    Member

    I imagine their feeling is that since DS9 "took" the Gamma Quadrant, they had to find a reason to use the Delta Quadrant and came up with the dumb premise. lol
     
  37. Hellwarden

    Hellwarden
    Member

    Been rewatching TNG.

    Man, I forgot how much the Enterprise gets attacked by ghosts and ghost like aliens.
     
  38. I just watched the one where there was a murder in the nacelles and Tori gets haunted by the bones of the victim or something. And they had to add the Worf/Tori subplot to it.
     
  39. Emily

    Emily
    Administrator

    Since this thread is about the entire history of the Star Trek franchise, we've decided that it belongs in Hangouts.

    This isn't a seasonal thread like other television OTs in Etcetera (Example: Better Call Saul S4). This is an on-going thread.

    Apologies for any inconveniences and confusion.
     
  40. Sephzilla

    Sephzilla
    Member

    How can you do this to us!? I'm furious beyond belief

    Just kidding, obviously. Surprised this didn't get moved to Hangouts sooner
     
  41. JonnyDBrit

    JonnyDBrit
    Member

    Which then gets weird because of course DS9 also drummed up the importance of the Alpha Quadrant and portrayed the likes of the Federation, Romulans, and Klingons as 'Alpha Quadrant' powers... leaving the Beta Quadrant as now like, the most unexplored area of the galaxy in terms of onscreen material. I mean, yeah, technically supporting material tends to portray the same three powers as being primarily located in the Beta Quadrant, but purely in terms of television material, it is now the least defined of the bunch. There's no knowledge of major regional powers, particular quirks or oddities it may have, it's just... one big question mark. Right next door.
     
  42. StallionDan

    StallionDan
    Member

    Is there a canon Trek galaxy map, all the ones I see put Earth on the exact border of Alpha/Beta Quadrant, with Alpha the bottom left, Beta bottom right, Gamma top left and Delta top right.

    But like JonnyDbrit said DS9 it's all Alpha quadrant with no Beta mention, despite Klingon and Romulans being 'Beta' races according to any maps, and Voyager's Message in a Bottle episode literally has the Beta quadrant being referred to as Alpha with a big map on screen showing it, which would make better sense and fit with DS9.
     
  43. firehawk12

    firehawk12
    Member

    Beta is basically the Romulan/Orion stuff, so DS9 went there sometimes. It feels like it's supposed to be the "wild west" of Star Trek, but of course they don't really get into it that much either.
     
  44. fuchsdh

    fuchsdh
    Member

    Even in the 24th century large swaths of the Alpha Quadrant are unexplored to the Federation, and the maps always don't represent that the Milky Way is still a huge 3D object, not a totally flat plane.