That’s a definite possibility, I agree. But I find it difficult to believe that ALL of the cops charged with some form of homicide (Murder 2 in one instance) were EACH guilty of some form of homicide, even if it were negligent and/or vehicular homicide, which carry relatively light penalties, as homicides go, in most jurisdictions.

The same Black killer who, without a mostly Black jury, but instead one better reflecting the demographics of the county, and without the benefit of inept prosecutors like Marsha Clark and Chris Darden, not to mention a star-struck and ineffectual trial judge in Lance Ito, was subsequently found liable for both deaths, in a civil trial, and ordered to pay $33.5 million in compensatory and punitive damages to his two victims’ survivors.

That same Black man– i.e., Orenthal James Simpson, not Chris Darden– is today serving a 33-year sentence in Nevada for an armed robbery that he organized and led, on Thursday, September 13, 2007, in Las Vegas; his search for the “real killer” of his ex-wife, Nicole Simpson, and her waiter-friend, Ron Goldman, has yet to reach fruition.

You folk pick your persecuted criminal-justice heroes about as well as you choose your medico-legal experts.

By the way, here is some detailed information on the Simpson criminal jury, in Los Angeles:

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/Simpson/Jurypage.html

Here is some information on his subsequent civil jury:

http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/Simpson/civiljury.html

How many thumps did Kato Kaelin hear on his wall, at about eight minutes before 11 p.m. P.D.T., on Sunday, June 12, 1994, and how did he interpret them?

…And who got acquitted?

“President Clinton and others cite a letter signed by 2600 scientists that global warming will have catastrophic effects on humanity. Thanks to Citizens for a Sound Economy, we know now that fewer than 10% of these ‘scientists’ know anything about climate. Among the signers: a plastic surgeon, two landscape architects, a hotel administrator, a gynecologist, seven sociologists, a linguist, and a practitioner of traditional Chinese medicine.”

Global Warming Treaty is All Pain, No Gain —Malcom Wallop.

How many shots were fired in Dealey Plaza, Zippy, at 12:30 p.m. C.S.T., on Friday, November 22, 1963, and how were they spaced? How many thumps did Kato Kaelin hear on his wall, at about eight minutes before 11 p.m. P.D.T., on Sunday, June 12, 1994, and how did he interpret them? How many of her neighbors heard Catherine ‘Kitty’ Genovese screaming bloody murder, between three and four a.m. E.S.T., on Friday the 13th of March, in 1964, while she was being murdered and sexually assaulted by Winston Moseley, and what did those neighbors do in response?

Sorry… omitted “my” in first line and misspelled “iniquities”…. That was before breakfast in Athens where as is renowned criminal justice is perfect evrn if the taxi driver who contrived to cheat me of $45 isn’t made to pay….

You misunderstand (?mis)understanding! I haven’t drawn the wrong conclusion I have merely observed that the ability to slander defendsnts freely in a way which would make the prosecutor guilty of contempt of court in other jurisdictions may add considerably to the iniquiries of America’s ctiminal justice system(s) which include the use of plea bargains induced by overcharging threats, excessive prison sentences – and the threat of death sentences, elected prosecutors and judges to name just problems on which many American lawyers and judges agree.

You sure can pick your medical experts, though:

I’m as perplexed as anonymous on this one, Bro. He has 27 gilded credentials, just like you do.

So what that he couldn’t see him, Zippy? Was it a ghost making all of that noise– or a stowaway, perhaps?

You don’t hear much about “earwitness” testimony.

Back in the real world

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/05/john-w-whitehead/its-a-cop-culture/

“So if you want a recipe for disaster, this is it: Take police cadets, train them in the ways of war, dress and equip them for battle, teach them to see the people they serve not as human beings but as suspects and enemies, and then indoctrinate them into believing that their main priority is to make it home alive at any cost. While you’re at it, spend more time drilling them on how to use a gun (58 hours) and employ defensive tactics (49 hours) than on how to calm a situation before resorting to force (8 hours).

Then, once they’re hyped up on their own authority and the power of the badge and their gun, throw in a few court rulings suggesting that security takes precedence over individual rights, set it against a backdrop of endless wars and militarized law enforcement, and then add to the mix a populace distracted by entertainment, out of touch with the workings of their government, and more inclined to let a few sorry souls suffer injustice than challenge the status quo or appear unpatriotic.”

He is an urological oncologist. Did Freddie Gray, Jr. flunk a PSA screening, as well as his illicit-drug test, on April 12? Is New York City devoid of physicians who are experts on traumatic spinal injuries? Is it devoid of physicians who could expertly opine on the possible behavioral and medical symptoms of a potential heroin overdose, in conjunction with marijuana ingestion? Am I suppose to believe, as you apparently do, that this doctor’s being an Iranian Jew makes him omniscient on any and all medical issues? Am I suppose to believe that that is true when he is relying upon the claims of an adverse attorney, representing the decedent’s family, rather than on the actual autopsy report, or any public official’s public announcement of what the autopsy revealed? I guess that, as an erstwhile attorney, I am a tad more skeptical than you, about a variety of things.

You’ve jumped to an erroneous conclusion. The free hand prosecutors enjoy in charging has nothing to do with the First Amendment or the U.S. constitution. Instead, state legislatures and state supreme courts craft immunities for prosecutors as a matter of public policy, i.e. balancing of interests.

You sure can pick your medical experts, though:

I’m still trying to understand your criticism. An Iranian Jew medical doctor who is a chief at a top New York hospital. Sounds like the kind of doctor most people are looking for.

Where did you get your medical training D.K.? Nassau County Police Academy?

Which of the policemen obviously used “overforce” on Freddie Gray, Jr.? What officially revealed injuries did they inflict upon him? What was the actual cause of his death, in the hospital, after surgery, a full week after his final arrest? What might have been the effects of the marijuana and heroin that Freddie Gray, Jr. reputedly had in his system, when he was arrested? Might a drug overdose have been in any way responsible for any of Freddie Gray, Jr.’s reputedly violent behavior and his adverse medical symptoms? What injuries might Freddie Gray, Jr. have inflicted upon himself, based upon the reported testimony of the unnamed thirty-eight-year-old prisoner who shared the latter portion of the trip to the police station with him? Why did that fellow prisoner not hear the policemen beating Freddie Gray, Jr. into unconsciousness? If that happened before the other prisoner ever was picked up, how did he hear Freddie Gray, Jr. making any sounds at all? What do you think that you know about Freddie Gray, Jr.’s injuries and medical condition that did not come from his family’s lawyers?

It seems Pat Buchanan is quite fond of defending things he manifestly has no clue about.

Like obvious police overforce, in this case.

So what that he couldn’t see him, Zippy? Was it a ghost making all of that noise– or a stowaway, perhaps? How was Freddie Gray, Jr., making any noise, at all, if his spine had been severed, and his voice box crushed, by then? (The thirty-eight-year-old fellow-traveller was placed in the police van at one of the stops after Freddie Gray, Jr., was, and was delivered to the police station with him.)

You sure can pick your medical experts, though:

***

Dr. Samadi is a board-certified urologic oncologist trained in open and traditional and laparoscopic surgery, and an expert in robotic prostate surgery. He is chairman of urology, chief of robotic surgery at Lenox Hill Hospital and professor of urology at Hofstra North Shore-LIJ School of Medicine. He is a medical correspondent for the Fox News Channel’s Medical A-Team and the chief medical correspondent for am970 in New York City, where he is heard Sundays at 10 a.m.

***

according to a police document quoted by the newspaper. They were separated by a metal partition, and the man did not actually see Gray trying to harm himself.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/doctor-freddie-gray-not-sever-spine-article-1.2205179

Ah, yes, Zippy, those incomparable medico-legal experts at Think Progress! “Paging Doctor Lysenko….”

***

“As authorities dig deeper into the events surrounding Freddie Gray’s arrest and mysterious death, there seem to be more questions than answers, particularly about how exactly the 25-year-old Baltimorean sustained his fatal injuries. Gray’s spine was nearly severed and his voice box was crushed.”

***

Freddie Gray, Jr., died one week after his final arrest, in the hospital, after surgery. Without the autopsy report’s being made public, we do not have a conclusive basis for saying what the immediate or proximate cause of his death was. The quoted claims about his spine and voice box are not sourced. What official source has stated either contention on the public record, Zippy, let alone your false claim (based upon your own chosen source) that Freddie Gray’s spine was, in fact, severed? As far as I am aware, the only source, to date, for either claim, is one of the Gray family’s race-mongering and money-grubbing attorneys.

Unsurprisingly, your chosen left-wing propaganda outlet explicitly lies about who the other prisoner in the van was. The young man cited was the one involved in the open-air transaction that led to the arrest of both him and the decedent. The prisoner in the van who said that the latter had been acting violently, in apparent attempt to injure himself, was a thirty-eight year old man. The reporter cited on his behalf is the lesbian co-conspirator with her prosecutrex-lover.

Once again; I’m not a doctor, but…

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2015/05/01/3653797/how-did-freddie-gray-die/

The justice system has gotten fat off of black folks – cops, courts, and jails.

Then stop committing the majority of crimes and bankrupt them for the rest of society that has to pay for it.

Why not both? Why not killer cops guilty of negligent homicide and a malicious prosecutor over-charging them?

What is the official source for your claim that his spine was severed, Zippy? The autopsy has not been released publicly; nor am I aware of any public official’s having officially declared to the public that the decedent’s spine was severed.

and the decedent may well have been responsible for his own injuries.

That’s funny Sheepskin, I don’t remember any of those 44 degrees you listed being an M.D., but maybe my memory is faulty. A man handcuffed in the back of an automobile severs his own spine, how, again?

http://legalinsurrection.com/2015/05/was-freddie-grays-arrest-lawful-almost-certainly/

Were you there? Someone who is truly skeptical of law enforcement should be skeptical of the DA as well as the cops. Also, a Terry stop is not an arrest, often there is a Terry stop based on reasonable suspicion, which facilitates the discovery of evidence of a crime, which in turn leads to an arrest. Use of words like “filth” and “moron” is not an adequate substitute for rational argument.

http://legalinsurrection.com/2015/05/confirmed-freddie-grays-knife-was-illegal/

They saw a convicted felon and known drug dealer, with two other outstanding criminal charges still open against him, as that Sunday morning dawned, make a hand exchange for cash, reasonably assumed to be yet another drug deal, at which point both he and his buyer took off running, in separate directions, after making eye contact with the policemen on their bicycles. They pursued the suspect and arrested him. They found the knife on his person, and that what the charge that they registered against him. Since the actual filing charged him with “selling” such a weapon, however, no knife need have been found on his person, at all!

While he was not found to be carrying drugs, when apprehended, he reportedly tested positive for both marijuana and heroin– which might well have been the result of his having deliberately swallowed his stash, while running away from the scene. If so, his ingesting a significant quantity of both marijuana and heroin might well have something to do with his appearance and behavior, both during the arrest, as recorded on video, and during his transportation to the police station, as related by the fellow prisoner in the police van.

(By the way, in an apparent conspiracy between an assistant prosecutor and a local television reporter, who are lesbian lovers, the buyer who fled the scene was later put on camera and purported to be the one who was in the van with the decedent, denying that he had acted as previously reported. In fact, the buyer was arrested later, and was not the prisoner in the van who has been quoted about the decedent’s violent behavior in the van.)

In other words, the arrest appears to have been quite legal, proper and reasonable, and the decedent may well have been responsible for his own injuries.

So the filth are now psychic?
Even if your apologia for the police state is true, they arrested him before they found the knife, moron

The always excellent William Norm Grigg perfectly skewers the Police State Lick-spittle fascists like Buchanan here

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2015/04/nickel-rides-houdini-suicides-and.html

And the Left wing equivalent here

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2014/12/law-and-order-leninism.html

To an outsider to the extraordinary spectacle of American criminal justice Pat Buchanan’s piece comes over as a criticism of what the First Amendment tempts prosecutors to do and allows them to get away with. My recollection of the tort of malicious prosecution is that it requires acquittal or dropping of charges before damages can be awarded but what about getting in early with a writ seeking an injunction against what is alleged to be an obvious malicious prosecution together perhaps as a claim for damages for defamation as well as malicious prosecution and false imprisonment? Discovery or even the comments of a judge saying it was premature might make it interesting.

Very important point: according to Mosby’s own task force, the knife was in fact illegal, and hence the arrest was proper:

“While Mosby said Friday that the officers had made an illegal arrest because a knife Gray was carrying was not a “switchblade,” a violation of state law, the police task force studied the knife and determined it was “spring-assisted,” which does violate a Baltimore code.”

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/gunshot-at-scene-of-protests-underscores-tension-in-baltimore/ar-BBjbrMC

As pointed out by the Conservative Treehouse:

http://theconservativetreehouse.com/2015/05/05/it-begins-the-knife-baltimore-prosecutor-mosby-said-wasnt-illegal-is-actually-illegal/

Given Mosby’s precedent (that is, assuming it is not institutionally repudiated and forever remembered as a total failure of government), exactly why couldn’t ethnic group X demand a number of young ladies from ethnic group Y as a condition to stop rioting? If they have credibility they can avoid the actual rioting.

The simple fact is that young black gang connected males are responsible for roughly half the murders.

Brutal policing doesn’t create the urban gang culture; the urban gang culture creates brutal policing.

If you want to fix the police then fix that.

.

The Washington Post reported that the second prisoner said that on the final leg of the trip to the police station, Freddie was thrashing around, possibly injuring himself.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they gave him a “rough ride” and if he was an informant then rough treatment in front of witnesses might even have been done to give him cover.

However if you’ve ever been in the back of a van like that although you do get bounced around a lot unless you are braced anyone conscious – even handcuffed – can brace themselves enough to avoid anything except a few bruises. If it wasn’t mostly risk-free the cops wouldn’t do it because people would be dying every day.

So if the other witness says he heard Gray thrashing around i.e. making more noise than someone with experience of those vans would expect, then either he was deliberately trying to hurt himself (unlikely imo) or he was unconscious or impaired in some way.

So, was he ODing from swallowing his stash before being put in the van?

Well said Welch, Police training in many areas of our country includes the “nickel ride” or “rough ride”. Accountability for police conduct is long over due. While it may be easy for many whites to say “it is just those law breaking blacks getting what they deserve” they don’t realize that those chickens will come home to roost. When it is the blacks on the receiving end it is easy to dismiss the abuse. The fact of the matter is the police are not our friends. That is not to say all cops are bad but until we hold law enforcement people to the same standard as everyone else they will literally get by with murder. John Whitehead has written extensively about our police state and is well worth reading to gain further incite into our decline. Pat has to get over his dislike for blacks as we are all in the same boat. Today they are coming for the blacks, tomorrow it will be us.

Pat I find your defense of the police reprehensible. They forgot to put him in a seat belt? I’ll bet you dollars to doughnuts the police had theirs on. It is called”a nickel ride”. Perhaps one day you will awaken to not just the brutality of the police, but also your own retorical brutality to people of color who have lived and died through centuries of oppression at the hands of the exceptional white man and woman.

I hate all cops, but real reform requires systemic changes, not the occasional scapegoating of junior officers who have used excessive violence. Mosby’s indictments are a calculated political play with the goals of immediate pacification, her own self-aggrandizement, and ultimately, defense of the status quo.

“If people knew the stuff police get away with, or the level and extent of misconduct that is tolerated by the police departments (police unions) and especially courts, the hue and cry from the public for change would be deafening.”

Just like all the ‘stuff’ blacks get away with. Blacks have cost whites trillions of dollars and the hue and cry from the public is….oh wait never mind.

I agree with Ronald Thomas West. My previous job allowed me to look into internal affairs files as part of background investigations for the USG (even then most PDs said f-off and nothing would be done even though it’s federal law). If people knew the stuff police get away with, or the level and extent of misconduct that is tolerated by the police departments (police unions) and especially courts, the hue and cry from the public for change would be deafening.

In the Rodney King case, where there was film of his extended beating with billy clubs, a Simi Valley jury refused to convict any of the four cops.

In Ferguson, Michael Brown sustained half a dozen gunshot wounds. Yet officer Darren Wilson was not indicted.

On Staten Island, 350-pound Eric Garner was seen on film being taken down by five cops in an arrest that led to his death, but none of the cops was indicted.

And there is far less visible evidence of any police crime in the case of Freddie Gray than in any of those three incidents.

Pat, he went into van uninjured and came out with fatal injury, in the custody of cops. The (very few, of too many to count) precedents you quote make a case for police impunity. Why not focus on the nation-wide police impunity contributing to the Black community anger instead of making a case because cops have killed irresponsibly previously and gotten away with it, they should get away with it again?

Top ten google results for “cases of usa police impunity”

http://dollarvigilante.com/blog/2014/12/8/why-us-cops-can-kill-americans-with-impunity.html-0

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2014/12/05/UN-concerned-Michael-Brown-Eric-Garner-cases-reflect-pattern-of-police-impunity/2561417794302/

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/focus/20150503/baltimore-iceberg-tip-us-police-impunity

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/current-law-gives-police-wide-latitude-to-use-deadly-force/2014/08/28/768090c4-2d64-11e4-994d-202962a9150c_story.html

http://www.thenation.com/article/190937/why-its-impossible-indict-cop

http://www.guyanatimesgy.com/2014/12/12/police-officers-in-us-killing-black-men-with-impunity-has-become-pervasive/

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/cifamerica/2010/aug/16/police-usa-civil-liberties

http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-impunity-for-killer-cops-at-home-and-legal-immunity-for-military-personnel-overseas/5419330

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/police-kill-citizens-70-times-rate-first-world-nations/

http://lastresistance.com/8907/eric-garner-police-impunity/

So, what’s your purpose Pat, using rhetoric to contribute to and/or incite a race war?

Why not have a look at fixing the ‘us versus them’ mentality instead…

http://ronaldthomaswest.com/2014/12/09/metadata-panorama/

…because when the Jesus you profess stated ‘blessed are the peace-makers’ Colt revolvers hadn’t been invented yet -

This is not about black and white – it is about blacks and police.

The justice system has gotten fat off of black folks – cops, courts, and jails.

Will these cops in Baltimore pay the price for all those past injustices – could be?

Remember O.J. went free because of black sentiment about the justice system