Dude you are so fucking weird, Jesus Christ. Cucklin, why does fringe politics attract so many weird people?

Chinks vs T*rks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Come buy your tickets ladies and gentlemen!!!

Best seats in the house!!

Of course not all women only care about aggression in men, they want status too. White men, despite I suspect many here would disagree, still have the highest status in the West and really the world at large…but find high status whites and more aggressive ones at that a winning combination.

You can just say Jewish.

Just out of curiosity: are such textbooks currently available on the internet?

For some reason, the Korean population apparently has a subgroup with more Caucasian features, and I’m not sure why(something I need to research).

I am lactose tolerant, 6’2″ tall, very fair, have double eyelids and “big eyes,” long (for an East Asian) nose, and have reddish body/facial hair. I’m also quite hairy – a lot of people say I am the hairiest Asian they ever met. I can grow a full, red-tinged, beard. Someone on Razib Khan’s blog told me that the red hair is from eastern (Asian) Neanderthal genes.

My wife thinks that the Asian celebrity I most resemble is Takeshi Kaneshiro.

I had my genetic ancestry testing done, and I did come out as 10% shared with modern Mongolians (and 99.9% shared with modern East Asians and 0.1% shared with Native Americans), and something like 4-5 times more likely than average East Asian to have light eyes and light hair. I have caramel eyes and black hair, but have children with green eyes and red/brown/blondish hair (my wife is 99.9% Northwestern European, almost entirely British/Irish, German, and Scandinavian).

Northern Chinese genetics definitely show closer relation with northern groups, though it could be from an ancestor population that no longer exists.

I think it’s VERY likely that both Northern Chinese and Koreans/Japanese had substantial infusion of eastern Siberian gene flow in prehistoric and ancient times. It’s probably more accurate to say that there was gene flow from ancestor populations that no longer exist in their earlier forms. In other words, both Northern Chinese and Koreans/Japanese probably have a good deal of genes from people the ancient Chinese called “Dong Hu.”

You think wrong. The Northern Han have very little steppe ancestry and practically none from Koreans (it is the other way around, Northern Han gene flow into Korea).

I am not a geneticist by any means, but I think Northern Han are much more genetically shifted toward eastern Siberian (not “steppe”)/northern Manchurian genes than Southern Han people. The Han people are, more or less, on a north-south spectrum in their genetic clustering (with some exceptions due to later colonizations, e.g. Sichuan).

Your Han purism is unscientific.

I know, that’s one of your foundation myths, isn’t it

Very much so.

(though one that will unfortunately be lost, I’d suppose, since it can’t mean much to all those “new” Australians)?

That’s probably true, although it’s an issue that still gets an amazing amount of attention in the Australian media.

I think many of these seemingly very old debates have long ago been forgotten, but then revived in some later age, often based on faulty understanding of the issue at hand. People then believe they represent an ancient viewpoint, when in fact probably no one at the time thought like these modern people.

Yes, I think that’s very much the case. Especially in the case of the English Civil War which is all too often interpreted in terms of modern political disputes and ideologies. It’s amazing how often people assume that the Parliamentarians believed in democracy.

Good point – everyone calls them Pathans in Pakistan.

I put “Afghans” in quotes because there’s some ambiguity– for me it means “Pathans” when used as an ethnicity, but it can also mean “people of Afghanistan” in some other contexts.

You’d be amazed how hot under the collar many Englishmen still get about things like the Civil War (mid-17th century). Not long ago I got into a fierce argument over the Glorious Revolution of 1688 and I was accused of being a Jacobite traitor.

I sort of understand…my father’s English, and has at times stated his regret that Britain didn’t have a strong monarchy like on the continent in the 17th/18th centuries, with non-conformists just being burned at the stake (he regards them as partly responsible for later subversive developments)…maybe a bit extreme, but views of that past can still be important for people’s self-conception, even though the actual issues have long since faded into obscurity.

Although I’m still pretty bitter about the British dragging us into the First World War and sending young Australians off to invade the Ottoman Empire.

I know, that’s one of your foundation myths, isn’t it (though one that will unfortunately be lost, I’d suppose, since it can’t mean much to all those “new” Australians)?
Germany just is very different, in public discourse historical memory really has shrunk down to 1933-1945 and little else.

In Hungary some people criticize the first king István for having murdered pagans (including a vast number of his own relatives, real or potential pretenders to the throne), and that goes back a thousand years. Though I think it’s all mostly based on a very popular early 1980s rock opera, so this debate really just goes back a few decades.

I think many of these seemingly very old debates have long ago been forgotten, but then revived in some later age, often based on faulty understanding of the issue at hand. People then believe they represent an ancient viewpoint, when in fact probably no one at the time thought like these modern people.

It’s always interesting to me how contentious aspects of even the somewhat remote past are in many cultures and civilizations, and how people regard it as relevant to the present day, that’s quite the contrast with many (not all) Western countries today

You’d be amazed how hot under the collar many Englishmen still get about things like the Civil War (mid-17th century). Not long ago I got into a fierce argument over the Glorious Revolution of 1688 and I was accused of being a Jacobite traitor. And try suggesting to an Englishman that Elizabeth I was actually a disastrous and incompetent monarch. Or that the execution of Mary Queen of Scots was simple murder.

I’ve even witnessed some extraordinarily nasty arguments over whether Richard III really did murder the Princes in the Tower and that’s going back over 500 years.

Australians just don’t have a long enough history to match that. Although I’m still pretty bitter about the British dragging us into the First World War and sending young Australians off to invade the Ottoman Empire.

People who take an intense interest in history do tend to get quite passionate about it.

Being pissed at the British in some form is pretty common

Being pissed at the British in some form is pretty common among lots of people. My grandfather hated the guts of the British until his dying day. As an Australian he fought the Turks on behalf of the British in WW1. He came back to Australia thinking the Turks were pretty OK people but my God he hated the British.

Among Australians of the WW2 generation anti-British hatred was pretty common too.

And even today you think twice about mentioning Winston Churchill to an Australian.

It’s almost as if the aim of British foreign policy for the past couple of centuries has been to make other people hate them.

The fugly strain causes feminism.

There’s no question about that. There’s a very high correlation between fugliness and feminism.

And as several commenters alluded to, there’s a remarkably high correlation between horrible personalities and feminism.

Feminism is for the sorts of women who can’t get decent men. That’s why feminism is so popular with Hollywood actresses. There aren’t any decent men in Hollywood.

Possibly – but they are true Afghans. One must remember that Afghans don’t feel they need to recognize the Durand Line – and I don’t blame them. Either way, whether in Afghanistan or Pakistan, their identity of being Afghan does not change.

Peace.

Don’t forget there are more “Afghans” in Pakistan than there are in Afghanistan.

Its always been rather silly. Both populations have huge influence from an ancestral O-M176 haplogroup, although technically the Japanese have an unique D haplogroup and Koreans bits of the mainland North Chinese O3 and small traces of Mongolian C3.

Overall, Japanese face is generally longer, while the Korean face has a more prominent jaw and higher cheekbones. For some reason, the Korean population apparently has a subgroup with more Caucasian features, and I’m not sure why(something I need to research).

They’re really close to the Japanese, though they probably wouldn’t be fond of thinking about that.

Does this mean that we white eyes are off the hook if we can’t immediately differentiate between Koreans and Japanese?

IIRC there is a single proto-group that is typified by typical East Asian traits(EDAR gene, lactose intolerance, etc) that spread across East Asia including the Korean. The Koreans themselves have added admixture from both northern and southern groups.

http://www.scmp.com/tech/science-research/article/2067820/research-reveals-koreans-genetic-roots

They’re really close to the Japanese, though they probably wouldn’t be fond of thinking about that.

Interesting that the Japanese look to be in between the north Chinese and the Mongolians.

That appears to reflect the Altaic heritage of the aboriginal Japanese. There was migration of that group to the coast down the Amur River and across a land bridge to Japan with the worsening of the late Pleistocene climate. They absorbed the Austronesian group that had migrated by the sea route and gave rise to the Jomon culture. Chinese admixture started around the First Millennium BCE and gave rise to the Yayoi culture. The closest modern analog to the original Altaic migrants are the Ainu on Hokkaido, although it appears they are genetically distinct from the Jomon.

Interesting that the Japanese look to be in between the north Chinese and the Mongolians. Normally these genetic distance maps end up looking (or at least are capable of being portrayed looking) like geography, with physically neighboring groups being closer related, but that’s one I wouldn’t have guessed. Where do the Koreans fit in, Mongolian groups?

And specifically this image:

And where in the image: the Koreans?

Northern Chinese genetics definitely show closer relation with northern groups, though it could be from an ancestor population that no longer exists.

https://www.nature.com/articles/ejhg2011139

Analysis:

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2011/07/how-chinese-genetics-is-like-chinese-food/

And specifically this image:

A very dubious gift. The Han Chinese Ming had powerful armies and excellent commanders at their heydays – defeating even Europeans repeatedly in Portuguese and Dutch conflicts on both land and sea. However, mandarins usually advised against territorial conquest since it was seen as an expensive and bloody venture, and Manchuria was like a lot of lands there: poorly arable and inhospitable and really hard to justify colonizing(on top of a closed off mentality).

To this day, the lands are mostly useless.

The steppe could only support 2-3 million people maximum. While China’s dense farming population was about 50-100 million till the Ming population explosion. I doubt that there would be significant genetic input from the steppe. Minor admixture i would agree.

Manchuria didn’t exist until the 19th century. Rather it conflates two historical separate areas. The Northern sector of Heilongjiang and parts of Jilin were barbarians lands. Southern Manchuria, i.e. Liaoning has been Chinese long before the Manchus showed up.

You think wrong. The Northern Han have very little steppe ancestry and practically none from Koreans (it is the other way around, Northern Han gene flow into Korea).

Hmmm, looks like asian men are thoroughly cucked. At least asian guys can sit on the sidelines and watch as the arabs,pakis,africans cuck white men and slowly take over Europe neighborhood block and schadenfreude as the mestizos reclaim California,Arizona and Texas.

Don’t know how things will turn out in US due to the Trump effect but once the next leftist democrat President gets elected. I hope he/she opens the floodgates again to hyper aggressive,low inhibtion africans,arabs and mestizos!

I wasn’t aware of this history – thank you for explaining it. Fascinating.

Manchuria was a gift of the Manchu emperors to the Han Chinese. The Han Chinese would probably not have been able to conquer it themselves until the Russians showed up (and then it wouldn’t be a part of China). So they should be grateful for it.

If we claim that the Manchurian Qing is foreign then it would have just given credibility to the Japanese imperialist vision of an independent manchuko. It was much better to claim Qing as an Chinese dynasty to put into question the Japanese puppet state of Manchuko.

But this is because history is written in retrospect. Most southern Han during the time were anti Qing and viewed the Manchus as barbarians.

And if you want to speak of ancestral blood, my family was able to hold official titles for hundreds of years, through two dynasties; we had buried bones in Pudong for so long that it even held grave goods and treasures that we had family lore to excavate “in the event of emergency.” Now the Communists have put an airport directly over our ancestral graves, so much for the ghosts. Do you realize how many generations of imperial examinations we must have aced, and struggled through including the centuries under active anti-Han Qing administration?

Yet I am essentially one of the last branches of my family. It wasn’t the Manchus that eradicated us, no, but other Han(and some help from Japanese) thanks to our solid support of the KMT. Should I hold a particular grudge for other Han now because the Communists targeted us for being “landowners?” That actually took the effort to try to wipe out an entire family tree?

You speak of blood, we died at Shanghai against the Imperial Japanese, we died against the Communists on the mainland, we died to protect the Taiwanese and Lord Chiang(or rather, his ambitions) on Kinmen. In the end, my grandfather was the only survivor of an entire clan.

And look at how grateful Taiwanese are now for the sacrifices of the KMT. I particularly loved the one who wanted to explain how Taiwan should be Japanese, so much did he hate being Chinese/Han.

I identify as a 14 Words White Nationalist today, but in my younger days was a “right leaning libertarian” and actually mostly believed in racial equalitarianism.

Back in my 20s I preferred and was moderately successful in hooking up with Japanese girls. I had sex with quite a few of them, as well as a Chinese or two, one Korean, one Iranian, and a couple of “light mestizas”. I very seriously doubt I fathered any children with any of them-I always used rubbers and ever had one break, for one thing.

When I decided this race-doesn’t-matter thing was bogus I ceased and desisted from such behavior permanently. I regret having done it now. I think of those girls’ fathers.

Mutts are usually healthier than most commonly available purebred dogs, but most are worthless if you are buying the animal to actually do anything, i.e., a hunting dog, sheep herding dog, whatever.

I don’t know about crosses of closely related working or hunting breeds-if you cross a labrador dog to a golden retriever bitch, both of which retrieve really well, will the pups be less inclined to be effective retrievers than had you found the “correct” sire or dam?

Also, the popular on-purpose crosses commercially available, like the labradoodle, peek-a-poo, et al, are often made by breeding a sire and dam (or at least the dam) of lesser quality than would be used to breed purebred dogs, because there is no consideration of quality by a kennel club or knowledgeable buyers. Such dogs can be great pets or worthless. But if you just want a pet you should not be going to a breeder, you should get a rescue or pound dog or get a pup from the neighbors whose Dixibelle got knocked up when she got out the gate while in heat.

Pretty much exactly this. Northern Chinese have considerable input from early Han, Mongols, Koreans, etc. Southern Chinese were the traditional rice cultivators including the Yue kingdom. This has further been complicated by the power centers(and population) shifting from north to south during the Song, and then back north by the Ming.

http://www.pnas.org/content/95/20/11763.full

You need to get out more.

Thanks. It’s nice to meet someone who knows more about Chinese history than the Opium war on an internet site.

The laughable policy of favoring incompetent Manchu officials at all levels over more qualified Han Chinese, the farther up the ranks you go the more systemic it became. They “claimed” they represented China, but every single policy was aimed at weakening the social cohesion of the Han race and privileging Manchu’s at their expense.

Of course. The Manchu had seen what had happened to the Yuan and likewise were not in any capability to actually rule a large nation, so they practiced brutal oppression of the majority. Nonetheless, Chinese territory expanded significantly beneath the Qin dynasty.

Its not really like the Han-run Ming Dynasty made brilliant decisions, starting with isolating themselves from the world. Corruption was rife and constant factional struggles led eventually to Wei Zhongxian to destroy capable officials as brilliantly as any northern barbarian. Toward the end, the bankrupt nation wasn’t even paying soldiers on time.

Ultimately, it was internal weakness that invited invaders – literally, with the Manchu.

Did you know that some of the California Chinese are descended from Taiping rebels who fled when the Imperial troops conquered them. They came in the 1830s & 40s before the Gold Rush, but not to San Francisco mostly Monterey.

I guess from the point of Han trying to get their country back, the Opium war Taiping rebellion and retard Emperors was great. Not so good for everybody else.

Whites get credit for that invention – greatest sport ever!

Until chessboxing arrived on the scene.

It came from Indians (feather not dot): http://manataka.org/page2773.html

Bandy may look like a gym teacher’s mad crossing of soccer and ice hockey, but it predates the creation of either, and was played throughout a more frigid England before global warming arrived in the Victorian era.

Or at least that’s what they told us when we hosted the Bandy World Cup here back in the ’90s.

manpower

Specifically a lot of young people and less of these dudes:

http://neoskosmos.com/news/en/migration-and-low-birth-rate-take-toll-on-Greek-population%20

Especially if you want to take on someone 8 times your size. But hey, those old Greek guys might just surprise us all!

Peace.

White Nationals progress to Asian women because blacks take take the white woman. Pretty simple.

It’s assortive mating. A good fraction of Eurasian children of WMAF are the children of socially maladjusted white men and women looking for a green card…

AMWF general come from an entirely oppositional dynamic where their socio-economic status in their respective communities tend to be significantly higher than their reverse gendered pairings.

You are right, of course. The white male and Asian female pairings, especially among the older generations, include a large fraction of poorly matched couples of disparate backgrounds. Many of those were products of the American military presence in Asia.

Today, however, even WMAF pairings are typically of the middle class variety between American-born partners. There is really a pretty noticeable generational difference in these pairings.

As you pointed out, Asian male and white female couples, on the other hand, have been more “assortative” even in the past. My wife and I have been married a quarter century now, and even back then, our friends, families, and relatives all thought we were a very good match (same university, both high level athletes, both with doctorates, a very similar sense of absurdist humor, and both from highly traditional, Christian families).

tons of Mexicans

That doesn’t translate to a large number of individuals. Modern Mexicans are notoriously obese.

Hey Duke,

I fully support any Greek maximalist who want to reclaim their Anatolian holdings and booting those invaders off Cyprus too.

Would love to see that; “We comin’ for Constantinople baby!” First they need to work on getting their population out of free fall though – just one of those things you need when you go to war – manpower.

I fully support getting China out of its dismal fertility rate too – you guys produce really cute babies.

And also pandas, because…pandas.

Peace.

That defective white + defective asian = defective hapa proves nothing about miscegenation.

Yes. Or it could just be that one guy is just mentally ill despite “normal” genes. Either way, it proves nothing.

My children (half-white/half-East Asian) are all around 80-95 percentile in height for their respective ages, based on the white American chart. It shouldn’t surprise anyone, then, that I am around 6’2″ and my wife is 5’10″.

It doesn’t mean all Hapas are tall, of course… just the ones with tall parents/genes + good nutrition.

I don’t like anyone who lived north of the Ordos loop circa 200 BC. But to give a less flip answer, basically any people descendant from the barbarians that emerged from Eurasian steppe in antiquity.

I think northern Chinese “Han” people have had considerable genetic input from “northern and eastern barbarians.”

I love those Chinese historical movies The very best is a TV series 3 Kingdoms. It’s like a Chinese Game Thrones but it’s true history.

The Emperor dies and his 3 sons start a 3 way civil war that goes on for years.

It’s great wish I had the DVD

And in any case you are a race traitor and miscegenationist so go to hell.

Ever so classy.

Besides, treason as such requires a legal body, e.g. the United States of America, to which I have pledged loyalty previously. Since there is no requirement for loyalty to a “race” – however it is defined – the whole concept of a “race traitor” collapses (except in the mind of a person such as you).

While race is a very useful scientific and social concept, legal transgressions such as treason requires violation of discrete boundaries, which race – good or bad – does not have.

As for hell, only my God knows. If I did, unfortunately and tragically, go to hell, I reckon it won’t be for “miscegenation,” but enjoying and not regretting the killings of America’s foreign enemies too much.

I don’t like anyone who lived north of the Ordos loop circa 200 BC. But to give a less flip answer, basically any people descendant from the barbarians that emerged from Eurasian steppe in antiquity. Huns, Avars, Alans included. These bastards ruin civilization wherever they go and they still do. I fully support any Greek maximalist who want to reclaim their Anatolian holdings and booting those invaders off Cyprus too.

Qin was a fiefdom, one of those granted by the Kings of Zhou, the first Chinese polity, to the Ying clan. A descendant of whom became the first emperor. Think of a European title like the Duke of Anjou. If a descendant of that Duke became emperor, he would rename the entire state the Empire of Anjou. That is where Chinese Dynastic state names tend to get their origin from, a practice that remained in effect until around 1280. Another tradition ruined by barbarians.

Some of the Chinese history books have the same viewpoint as you. I remember reading that some of the Manchu families had not worked in 200 years but lived on government subsidizes just for being Manchu.

My views are definitely spreading. Chinese Communist historiography and ethnic policy basically aped that established by Lenin. It also aped the Manchu Qing’s own false conception of their own history. Leftist views always benefit the barbarian savage and tend to underplay nativist nationalist sentiments.

The late Austro-Hungarian empire’s military difficulties were exacerbated by the lack of elan among it’s multiethnic soldiers. Many of whom were not particularly keen on fighting too hard for what was at heart a German monarchy within which they played second fiddle. However, their people did enjoy a fair degree of representation even if not to the degree their numbers warranted and their Hapsburg Emperor was their still their rightful King by blood. The Han people, 95% of the empire’s population, made up maybe 5% of the Qing’s senior officials and their Qing Emperor’s had the blood usurpers. Is it any wonder that the Qing army proved so useless in resisting European incursions.

Qin , that’s a famous name going way, way back. Aren’t they the founders of China as China? Duke of Qin is familiar to me. Were they some warlords who became Emperors?

So you don’t like the Mongolians , central Asians and Turks who continually invaded China?

Or is it some other group, Manchurians? Do tell, I’m interested

This is just wrong. The Manchu barbarians were never Sinicized, they were only ever loyal to their barbarian usurper selves. For example, the requirement of appointing Manchu officers for the new model army. The concentration of loyalist banner forces around Beijing. The laughable policy of favoring incompetent Manchu officials at all levels over more qualified Han Chinese, the farther up the ranks you go the more systemic it became. They “claimed” they represented China, but every single policy was aimed at weakening the social cohesion of the Han race and privileging Manchu’s at their expense. As the dysfunctional foreign regime became more dysfunctional it also became even more manchufied until it ended up being entirely governed by a coterie of useless imperial princes. Do you even realize that the entire banner forces had essentially become a giant welfare program by the 18th century and because government revenue was so low, that they began kicking Chinese en mass out of the banner force so more gimmes could be paid to Mongols and Manchus? They obviously weren’t Sinicized enough to not join up with the Japanese to found a Manchukuo puppet state.

Let me give you another example of how treacherous these nomads are. The Xibe were a tribe, one of the last ones incorporated into the Manchu banners and in the 18th century they were basically sent out to Xinjiang as a garrison force. Their entire raison d’etre was to defend the frontiers of the Chinese state and keep the Turks in line. Now these nomadic scum, despite speaking Chinese, mouthing Confucian pieties, practicing Buddhism, etc not only failed to justify their very purpose, but turned traitor. End of WW2, Stalin started plotting as Stalin was wont to do and instigated a revolt in northern Xinjiang. The Uyghurs now claim this as their independent state of East Turkestan and Western journalists too stupid to ask questions repeat this claim. The Uyghurs who overwhelmingly inhabited the South remained loyal to the RoC. What it was, was a Soviet backed putsch by Kazakhs. A particular tribe of Kazakh scum who had only arrived in Xinjiang the 1920′s after being given refuge from the Soviet collectivization by the Chinese (Germans take note that Muslim refugee ingratitude is a historically established pattern). They were lead by Russian officers, commands were issued in Russian and weapons were delivered by the Soviets and only replaced with captured Chinese weapons when it came time for plausible deniability. After it became clear that the Nationalists were losing the Civil War and Chinese Communist forces were winning, the Soviets disarmed them, and Stalin subsequently had their useful idiot leaders shot by firing squad after their usefulness came to an end. I meander a bit, but back to the Xibe who were supposed to have defended the Chinese state for 200 years actually ended up joining the Kazakh rebellion. Naturally the progression of rebel forces meant the rape, murder, and dispossession of Chinese communities in their path as is the standard operating mode of Turk looting bands. That is how loyal and sinicized the Manchu’s were. They abandoned oaths of loyalty to defend Chinese interests to join their stupid steppe cousins to terrorize Han Chinese when the opportunity arose. To call them acculturated is to spit on the blood of my ancestors that they shed.

he also regarded the Qing basically as foreign tyrants, humiliating the Han by dress restrictions, enforced wearing of pigtails etc.; iirc he also had a fairly negative view of some earlier foreign dynasties, like the Jurchen…

All true. The fate of the defeated is never pleasant.

Arrogance and a willingness to embrace stagnation is what leads to that weakness.

“slam zipper pussy when it’s available”in your dreams nerd boy.Asian women can smell your blonde bad immune system ass and laugh in your face.

And his American children are Jews. His wife, Evelyn Rich worked for the ADL for years and has a PHD in Evil White Nationalist Studies from Tulane.

Just to clarify, I don’t really have an opinion of myself on the rights or wrongs of Chinese rule in Tibet, Xinjiang etc., these aren’t issues I can judge for myself, and I’m not a pretentious Westerner meddling in issues that are none of my concern.
Regarding the Qing, I obviously have no idea how common this view is in China, but I’ve seen pretty much the same argument being made in a German weekly by a young Chinese guy…he also regarded the Qing basically as foreign tyrants, humiliating the Han by dress restrictions, enforced wearing of pigtails etc.; iirc he also had a fairly negative view of some earlier foreign dynasties, like the Jurchen (?) in the 12th century (he claimed they basically forced Chinese women into state-run brothels and regarded that as an example for what happens to peoples who neglect military virtues…). So maybe such views are spreading in China?

Who knows, maybe that will still happen when China rules the world Given how rotten Western civ has become, it might not even be the worst thing.

A sufficiently cynical view might be that widespread surveillance and soft authoritarianism that’s spreading across the West is an inspiration from how well the Party manages to do the same thing.

However, they were basically sinicized for all practical purposes as seems to be fate of people who invade China.

This is the same that happens to every invader into Persia – at least as far as cultural and civilizational influence – happened to practically all of the various Turkic groups. Hell even the Greeks were impressed, definitely the Arabs (the Abbassids were basically a Persian foundation with an Arab veneer).

Peace.

Such things are especially a risk, as Tibet is an excellent example, of foreigners(often the British) using the cause of ethnic minorities to promote separatism and strife even when the the “independent culture” is little more than an atavism.

At any rate, the notion that the Qing themselves used the notion of the Mandate of Heaven, so even though they were foreign and did indeed practice rather abusive misrule to put it lightly, its hard to say that they did not embrace the culture in a significant form. Duke’s view, as he noted himself, is pretty rare and extreme even from the KMT perspective(which I was originally from).

As per Wiki:

The Manchu people became the rulers during the Qing dynasty. The “orthodox” historical view emphasized the power of Han Chinese to “sinicize” their conquerors, although more recent research such as the New Qing History school revealed Manchu rulers were savvy in their manipulation of their subjects and from the 1630s through at least the 18th century, the emperors developed a sense of Manchu identity and used Central Asian models of rule as much as Confucian ones. There is however evidence of sinicization. For example, Manchus originally had their own separate style of naming from the Han Chinese, but eventually adopted Han Chinese naming practices.

That the West did not suffer the same cultural fate after their victory was exceptional.

Who knows, maybe that will still happen when China rules the world Given how rotten Western civ has become, it might not even be the worst thing.

Its hard not to see the Manchu as invaders because, well, they were. Much as the Mongols were. However, they were basically sinicized for all practical purposes as seems to be fate of people who invade China. That has been seen as a kind of pride – that victory at arms never is followed by cultural victory, and therefore is seen as the sign of superior culture in spite of inferior force of arms(though of course, the latter is significantly more complicated due to internal chaos, etc, which were taken advantage of by the barbarians).

That the West did not suffer the same cultural fate after their victory was exceptional.

but after they inherited the Qing dynasty they had to play down the anti manchu sentiment if they did not the country might disintergrate

If I understand correctly that relates to the traditionally non-Han areas like Xinjiang and Tibet that were brought under control/suzerainty by the Qing (also Manchuria of course), because for keeping them it was advantageous to regard the Qing as a genuinely Chinese dynasty?
It’s always interesting to me how contentious aspects of even the somewhat remote past are in many cultures and civilizations, and how people regard it as relevant to the present day, that’s quite the contrast with many (not all) Western countries today (my own country being an extreme example, there is no history here anymore except 1933-45).

Women like cads.

Too simplistic. Women like men who are socially and economically functional in the society in which they live. The dominating, sperm-donating “alpha” of PUA legend is often not socially functional or a good life partner. They know how to get women to latch onto them as a boost for their self-esteem, but their relationship skills are wanting. There are in actuality very few situations in which alpha traits mean social success – the top of the corporate food chain, sports, various ego-driven enterprises – but for most in the working world the most functional traits are those good for teamwork, social relationships, and gaining the favor of those further up in various hierarchies. Women know that.

He didn’t answer the secret. 5th column bio-weapons thing though…gasp!

Chinese taqiyyah??!!

Early Chinese nationalism was very anti manchu and pro han, but after they inherited the Qing dynasty they had to play down the anti manchu sentiment if they did not the country might disintergrate. Early traid society (proto nationalism) was about overthrowing the Qing and restoring the Ming.

Since we talking about Chinese history, anyone looking forward to 3 Kingdoms total war ? I need to buy a new PC, love total war, been playing since rome 1.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=6&v=s4D42vMUSIM

Ah, I understand, you regard the Qing as usurpers and foreign tyrants. That’s a bit of a controversial subject in China if I understand correctly…with the official view being that they were just another Chinese dynasty, whereas many Chinese nationalists view things rather differently (and probably have always done so, weren’t there anti-Qing secret societies even back in the 17th/18th centuries?). I’m surprised you view the Taiping rising positively…frankly, they’ve always seemed like nutty cultists to me, also in thrall to foreign influences with their pseudo-Christianity; but then I’m not Chinese, so my understanding of the issues is limited.
Thanks for your reply, that was very interesting.

My righteous grudge is natural. It is the cause of justice, of civilized sedentary farming peoples everywhere to enjoy the fruits of their productive labour free from the looting and despoiling nature of the people of the steppes whose principal occupation for the past several millennia has been nothing more than banditry and parasitism, the success of which was based on nothing but the speed and number of their horses. Their cultures are dirt, their civilizations are dirt, their people are dirty thieves, and all they have to offer even today is more dirt.

As to the Japanese, I don’t care about them as they are presently an American satrapy and incapable of independent action. The Japanese made their go at empire, they failed and are a subject people now as a result of it. That they can’t readily admit it because of their stiff pride is not my problem. Though I cant fault their pride as that would be pretty hypocritical.

If by sentiments you mean getting back at Whitey? Then yes, among a certain sector of nationalist sentiment, however this isn’t exactly what I meant or perhaps more accurately isn’t entirely what I meant.

The opium wars as I said were a farce and inconsequential, the boxer rebellion even more so. A mere superstitious peasant rebellion driven by drought and hatred of Christian converts thought to have caused it that disappeared the day the rains arrived and their Christians neighbors burnt out. My enmity for the sassanachs stems from their assistance render to the Qing government during the Taiping Rebellion.

In cannonical Chinese story as tought by both the Communists and West is that the opium wars are the beginning China’s so-called century of humiliation. This Whig history (read nonsense) simply isn’t true. China’s century of humiliation began much earlier and it was actually already two centuries. The problem was China simply wasn’t sovereign at the time, the Qing government being an illegitimate regime of scheming barbarian scavengers who had by circumstance and race treason seized the throne for themselves and enslaved the Chinese race, the Han race (This is literally true as the institution of slavery was reintroduced by the Qing and Qing courtiers had to refer to themselves in the presence of their dog emperor as “Your slave” rather than “Your minister”).

There are many similarities between the simultaneous collapse of the Ming and the Thirty Years war, chiefly that the main beneficiaries of the internal warfare, economic collapse, and crazed anaptists, both happened to be foreigners. Sweden primarily in Germany’s case and the Manchu scum in the case of China. In both cases, basically the fighting had rather than leading to decisive advantage lead to general chaos and an intense merciless power struggle between many competing groups. A more cohesive new force joined the fighting at an opportune time and was able to act as a loadstone to gather to it otherwise disorganized forces around and eventually press their advantage. This was basically how tiny Sweden managed to become overlord of half of Germany and built a sizable empire (until she lost to the Russians) and how the Manchu were able to attract and coalesce various Ming remnant forces after rebels had sacked Beijing leaving the legitimate emperor dead.

Rather than the standard history of China having stagnated, it was regressed. The standard of living declined dramatically from the mid 17th century to the mid 19th century when the century of humiliation had began. In terms of per capita grain availabily, land, wages, etc Manchu misrule of China had cut incomes by a third. Even worse than the loss of wealth was the loss of purpose as the Manchu’s in order to justify their heathen barbarian rule did irreparable damage to Chinese society via their literary inquisitions. 19th century China had been scarred like the areas of Southeastern Europe that had fallen to barbarian Ottoman Islamic rule and most Europeans should be familiar with how those nations faired compared to those that had safely been kept safe under the Austrian Catholic aegis. The damage that the Qing Manchu barbarians inflicted on China vastly overshadows what little the British let alone what the French and Germans had done (Basically nothing except inflate Wilhelm’s vainglorious pretentions at home in Europe). The Great Sin of the British however was their support of the Qing court during the Taiping rebellion which was on course to topple Manchu rule. Instead British support aided the barbarian usurpers and let the decrepit Qing survive long past its smell date and it’s rotting and clinging presence set up China’s political troubles during the early Republic by fragmenting authority to regional elites.

But of course all of this is generally not the standard interpretation of the period and instead Whig history prevails both in China and abroad so popular resentment is incorrectly directed at the British in particular (thoroughly deserved) and Westerners in general instead of at the illegitimate barbarians misrulers of China herself. Chinese history as it was understood during the Republican period actually more closely mirrors my understanding but the Communists marxist interpretation of history has washed all that away.

“I married an Asian because she was hot, young, and loves me for laying down the bacon and slapping her ass every time she’s close enough to swat.”

Unless you have a photograph of you and her, along with her confirming how you essentially “dominate” her, it is safe to assume you are trying to curry favor among the fine posters here by making a big boast. In other words, put up or shut up.

As far as “white women being too feminist”, that’s more along the lines of Fake News.

Yes, the three pictured are indeed white. Iranians are from Aryan people. They are considered white because they are Caucasians.

Hell, we recently sent them a letter asking them to do it again.

Really?

http://www.birthplaceofhockey.com/origin/overview/

Hmmmm…I mean, I got nothing against Native Americans inventing it – I’m sure plenty of people from Northern climates had some kind of rudimentary games to play on the ice.

Peace.

Whites get credit for that invention – greatest sport ever!

Also, no lack of aggressive White males either. You remember when Konstantinov or Stevens would flip a guy in the air with a clean center-Ice check? Beautiful!

Peace.

It came from Indians (feather not dot): http://manataka.org/page2773.html

Couldn’t have said it better myself. Thank you.

Definitely interesting to watch. I will say this – if half the stuff they are posting about Sunnis was accurate, I’d have been a Shiah long ago. Which makes me wonder – is that what some Shiahs actually believe about Sunni positions?

I’ve known enough Shiahs before, like the brothers at UCLA, to know plenty are far more nuanced in their positions…and approach to the subject.

Did your family migrate at the partition?

Afterwards – they weren’t part of the crazy blood-letting where Muslims and Hindus were slaughtered trying to get to their respective sides.

Peace.

You will have an interesting perspective.

You see all the Islamic related “comments” from commenters who don’t know Shia from Shinola and now you have comments from some that presumably do know the difference.

Mutazilite stuff

And all this time I thought Baptists were the world leaders in schismatic behavior.

Did your family migrate at the time of the partition?

Well you know Twinx, I’ve never really heard anyone say their kids were ugly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsingtao_Brewery

It was founded in 1903 by German settlers and now claims about 15% of domestic market share

Seems pretty much German, though with Anglo investment as well.

Well, my wife is white and French – but I think Jaakko Raipala may be correct that there is some outbreeding depression. Its not impossible and certainly shouldn’t be treated as forbidden from discussion.

At the same time, I’m pretty dubious of the idea that it doesn’t ever introduce positive alleles on a permanent basis. If outbreeding always led to a reduction in fitness, for example, beefalo wouldn’t be more successful than pure bison and non-Africans would be a fitness disadvantage due to outbreeding with Neanderthals.

Natural selection – or cultural selection in human society – works its magic over time.

like Americans forgave them for burning down a bunch of Washington DC

Just like the Brits, never around when you really need them.

You’re right that it’s cherry picking. You could easily find a lot more examples of self-loathing and mentally defective and deranged whites, especially white SJWs, on the internet. Reddit, Tumblr, Twitter, etc., are full of them.

I don’t see any indication that hapas are less successful or more maladjusted than whites, especially considering that whites these days are increasingly afflicted with opiate and other drug and alcohol problems, rising mortality rates, declining economic prospects, etc. In my experience, hapas seem to be better off than the white mean. I don’t think this is due to anything special about the white-Asian pairing, but probably just due to assortative mating. Most white-Asian pairings are between middle/upper-middle class people who meet in college and professional environments. The GI-war bride pairing is much less common these days.

The white-Asian pairing is the most common interracial pairing, so naturally racialists have an incentive to portray them negatively. That’s understandable, but that doesn’t make what they say about them true.

Also – off-topic – but I have no idea what I did to bring the heat on me on that other thread. I am definitely not going to debate things in deference to instructions by my teachers, but I did notice a couple of things…
1) The articulation of Sunni positions is grossly inaccurate (which I think most people can tell just by the tone) which leads to 2…
2) If they have such a questionable grasp on Sunni positions, I don’t even know whether I can assume the Shiah positions they are positing are even accurate. I haven’t studied Shiah theology/jurisprudence much so I simply don’t know, but much of what’s being stated – from a creedal perspective – sounds a lot like recycled and modified old-school Mutazilite stuff.

I’m going to keep my head down and just watch the fireworks fly…

Peace.

I’m assuming it’s a knockoff of a Czech beer, right?

My favorite manga is “Kingdom”, it’s about the Qin unification of China and the Xiongnu are present there as well. The fact that there is a real person commenting here with the nickname “Duke of Qin” who carries thousands of years old grudges against the Xiongnu is absolutely fascinating and awesome to me.

Duke of Qin, have you read it by any chance and what do you think of it? I will be interested to hear your opinion. It’s by a Japanese guy obviously, but I think it’s a pretty awesome interpretation of the events and has some historicity too (nothing contradicts the Records of the Grand Historian and all events there are depicted in the manga with the accompanying direct quotes, although the author gets quite creative with the surrounding circumstances).

Also do you carry grudges towards the Japanese as well, because of WW2? I hope not, the East Asian master race – Chinese, Koreans, Japanese – must work together to take human civilization to new heights (just as Russia and Germany working together is one of the most important conditions for the European part of civilization to survive and be revitalized).

Hey neutral,

Depends on what you mean. My passport says USA – so that is obviously my nationality – as in “what nation state do you belong to”. If you mean origin, then yes, my origin is from the nation of Pakistan – but I am no longer Pakistani because I do not belong to that nation state any more.

My ethnic origin is as described – muhajir from the Hindustani people – so that does not change any more than one of my neighbors who is Irish.

Peace.

Hey Greasy,

They both told me that nobody in Pakistan gives a shit about the ethnic divisions in the country. Are you saying they were wrong?

In general this is true, but just because you don’t care about it doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. The whole raison detre for Pakistan is that a bunch of various majority-Muslim ethnic groups decided that a religious national identity meant more than their various ethno-linguistic identities.

So for instance, I have learned quite a bit from Islamic scholars and teachers from Pakistan that are Punjabi – but they are Punjabi and I am not.

Another example are how various groups wear their headdress; the Balochis wear their turban a specific way:

https://www.google.com/search?q=balochi+turban&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj5j86Cj87YAhULyWMKHQ-zDl0QsAQIKA&biw=1344&bih=774

And the Sindhis like to wear their caps, but which are distinct from everyone else:

https://www.google.com/search?biw=1344&bih=774&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=wmdWWv8rjNyPA4zvvqAG&q=sindhi+cap&oq=sindhi+cap&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0l7j0i30k1l2j0i24k1.102941.104741.0.105108.10.9.0.1.1.0.155.1150.0j9.9.0….0…1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.10.1157…0i67k1.0.z5LAVy77OAc

The point is to enjoy the differences (especially the various foods) and not make a big deal out of them. So mostly people don’t care about differences, and a lot of intermarriage occurs – my family married into Afghans and Punjabis and many people are bi-lingual or more. But sometimes ethnic divisions due come up if one group feels unfairly marginalized or if their is nepotism, etc. There has been a low-level insurgency in Balochistan for a while now. Same old, same old.

Peace.

Just because you consider yourself something does not make you that. If you are from Pakistan, that makes you a Pakistani.

Long story but last year a Pakistani couple lived at my house for a few months. The wife could be kind of a cunt but made up for it with her Pakistani cooking.

They both told me that nobody in Pakistan gives a shit about the ethnic divisions in the country. Are you saying they were wrong?

Hey iffen,

Are you a member of the Ummah?

Yes – anyone who is Muslim is a member of the Ummah (Ahl al-Qiblah, etc.) – includes all the various nationalities; Libyans, Moroccans, Syrians, Malaysians, etc.

what’s your ethnicity?

I’m a muhajir – we moved from India. In India, our family are generic mutts from all over the place*, but with a pedigree since we are Syeds (descended from the Prophetic line). And now my kids are all mixed up, but they get to keep the Syed pedigree. Apparently, their Swedish side consists of original Germans that settled in Norway then moved into Sweden – their family was historically warriors and mercenaries.

Peace.

*Note: Original family hails from Uttar Pradesh which is home to the Hindustani folk in the Gangetic plain; which is about as generic as one can get:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindustani_people

Nathan Adrian’s father is white and his mother is Asian. There doesn’t seem to be a general pattern at all. Other successful male hapa athletes with white fathers and Asian mothers include MLB players Tim Lincecum and Johnny Damon, and former NBA player Rex Walters. But they tend to go unnoticed as hapas because they have European surnames. If anything, there seem to be more successful male hapas with white fathers/Asian mothers if only because their population is larger than male hapas with Asian fathers/white mothers.

Britain seems to be quite unpopular in some parts of the world

I was struck by the book Tai-Pan written by Englishman James Clavell (1966). In this novel, the main positive hero – Victorian English Superman drug dealer who sells opium to the Chinese, and organizes the opium war. All this (according to the novel) is a blessing for the Chinese people and is done in order to bring to the China freedom and prosperity. (in the novel it is stated in plain text). This book is an absolute champion at the complete lack of shame among all known to me books.

Hey G_R,

Britain seems to be quite unpopular in some parts of the world

It’ll eventually pass with time – I mean who really has a beef with Mongols (other than Mongolian Beef) nowadays?

The Brits just had the latest in a long string of massive empires. I mean they literally rolled it back within living memory of some of my relatives. Eventually it’ll go away just like Americans forgave them for burning down a bunch of Washington DC.

Peace.