except
https://www.ft.com/content/fdceb126-5354-11e9-91f9-b6515a54c5b1
I fucking hate the guy, but at least he stood up to China between trade tariffs and this
He is not doing enough for sure, but at least he about the issue
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China accused of genocide in Muslim Camps: forced abortions where pregnant women are cut open and fetuses removed, and rampant sexual torture
- Thread starter RustyNails
- Start date
https://www.ft.com/content/fdceb126-5354-11e9-91f9-b6515a54c5b1
I fucking hate the guy, but at least he stood up to China between trade tariffs and this
He is not doing enough for sure, but at least he about the issue
I know that, but I mean that it won't even be discussed during a meeting.
The mentality of "we need to be as powerful and United as possible to defend ourselves and our race" is litteraly what the CCP and Israel is built on.
The onus is not on the subjugated to stand up to subjugators, it's on the oppressors to not oppress.
You're right that no one would be more likely to stand up for them than a united Muslim nation, but what's happening to the Muslims in China is not something that's expected or destined to happen when nations like that don't exist. The Chinese Government is going out of its way to do this, unprovoked and maliciously. It deserves the entire condemnation.
I think there's plenty of blame to go around. We should be able to discuss the global issues they led to these atrocities while also acknowledging China's fault in all of this.
So yes, objectively, China should be blamed for this, but they're not the only ones, that's for sure.
I hate this logic. You're asking shit people to stop being shit. What's their incentive to do so? I totally understand his post. As much as I'd love for people to respect one another as individuals, sometimes you need either a carrot or a stick to force that. He's saying currently the Muslim leaders aren't offering either to protect their people.
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Muslims did try to stand up and overthrow their governments. It led to complete disaster in Libya, Syria and Egypt. Right now, there is not even a right for Muslims in Saudi Arabia to demonstrate. You know what will happen if they demonstrate? They will be gunned down, locked up and left to rot in prisons for years. It sucks, but this is the reality.
Muslims in US, India and Pakistan do demonstrate against China though.
Nothing can unite the Islamic world, and that's by design. Unity among Muslims is the greatest fear of every autocratic leader in the Middle East and beyond, including in China -- that Chinese Muslims might feel comaradarie with other people instead of being filled with nationalistic zeal. If Saudi citizenry were to feel for their neighbors and co-religionists, the House of Saud would be the targets of the soldiers' weapons, not the Yemenis or Qataris or Iranians or Syrians.
That fear of unity is why any even slightly implied support of pan-Islamism leads to detention, expulsion, or execution across the ME, and feeds directly into "the war on terror" agenda/propaganda worldwide. We saw this play out most blatantly in Egypt these last few years.
Trump only cares so much as it makes China look bad. He wants to use this issue as a bargaining chip, if he can get what he wants, he is willing to let China continue this genocide.
I'm not advocating not doing anything, I'm not even discussing a solution.
You can argue the intent but the original post very litteraly shifted blame away from China to advocate a military strong United Muslim nation by inferring such genocide is inevitable without it.
The problem is that China has all the stick and all the carrot, they have already funneled a lot of money into those countries and can keep funding them (the carrot), or they can take away all of their business at a moment's notice (the stick).
Why aren't sanctions being slapped on them? I wish the US had a president that'd step up to the plate and legitimately do something about this.
Now we know Trump said "something", but lets be honest, it's all a big extortion game to him. Can you ever trust a man that says he will look away in the face of injustice, if you did him a "favor"?
At the end of the day, it's not just Trump, we need the EU to step in and take action here. It's 2019 and this kind of barbarism exists! Disgusting, utterly disgusting.
Now we know Trump said "something", but lets be honest, it's all a big extortion game to him. Can you ever trust a man that says he will look away in the face of injustice, if you did him a "favor"?
At the end of the day, it's not just Trump, we need the EU to step in and take action here. It's 2019 and this kind of barbarism exists! Disgusting, utterly disgusting.
People want to help but they dont want te economy to worsen
Other country will see it as an internal issue, similiar to Israel and Palestine, and Yeman war with the Saudie
And add to that, China is a nuclear power, any military action will just result in mutual destruction, and the people that are being persecuted are not a majority of any major power
There was a peaceful uprising and thousands were murdered.
Worldwide sanctions of extreme severity need to happen, those are Nazi levels of experimentations on human bodies.
Why the fuck the solution for everything is to invade a country?
The US has exactly 0% success rate in regime change, you honestly think you gonna pull that on China?
If you want to help prosecuted people there one very simple thing that the US can do, and that give them asylum.
But the US obviously doesn't want to do that, fuck, it put a ton of Uyghur groups in the terror watch list after 9/11, probably because some intern googled "angry muslims" and they're still there.
People always talk about China in terms of the holocaust, but there is one lesson of the holocaust that the US refuses to learn - Jews were trying to escape eastern Europe for about a 100 years before WW2, and US tighten and tighten its immigration policies specifically to ban them from coming.
The US don't give a flying fuck about Uyghurs, they never gave a fuck about them even under Obama, the US has never had any official policy about XInjian outside shouting about it as a way to pressure China into unrelated economic concessions.
BTW, if the US let some of those people in the country ya'll might learn a thing or two about who they are and what they want (which believe you me, does not involved getting bombed by US drones), but the US only care about Muslims as would be martyrs to justify another fun military adventures.
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What is going on is despicable but nuclear war not being waged is sad? Like what is this take?
After WW2 everyone said we would never let those atrocities happen again, and yet here we are, turning a blind eye because china is throwing money at everyone.
China is not bribing the US to not let those people get asylum.
The west is turning a blind eye because the west don't give a shit about Muslims, at most they use their suffering to justifying foreign policies that they know would be hard to sell to the public otherwise.
The war-boner Americans have is frankly disgusting and ignorant of the legacies of tragedy that are the previous World Wars.
I'm not American. I'm not routing for a war. All I'm saying is that the rest of the world will stand by and do nothing. Like absolutely nothing, and will leave these people to rot while continuing doing business with China. We go to war when our own countries might personally suffer or if there's something to gain, but not over man's inhumanity to man.
This shit needs more attention. Global Sanctions. Sanction. Sanction. Sanction.
Our economy would suffer, but it would be worth it.
Our economy would suffer, but it would be worth it.
Neither world war was fought over genocide. Also, war would is far more “sad� than a lack of one.
Someone close to me said "but things are getting better over there."
Like fuck they are. This is so abhorrent. It makes me sick.
Like fuck they are. This is so abhorrent. It makes me sick.
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It was always that bad. Some of the stories cited, like forced abortions, are from 2017. We are hearing about these now.
Because everyone else does it. How are you going to be competitive in capitalism without cheap labor?
There are other countries with cheaper labor, its also about how big the chinese market is
it's not the 20th century anymore. I know it's hard to visualize a non military solution but that's the most viable option. come to terms with the fact that the US, despite all that you've seen and been told throughout your life (americans) is not capable, regardless of their willingness, to invade and liberate the people of China. the US military is not god-tier, is not a force for good, is not capable of fighting and defeating China within Chinese borders.
You work something out with all the other countries not committing genocide. You can exploit one of the other many countries that have slave wages. You can just eat the hit and not support genocide just so your pack of pens doesn't cost a dollar more.
When China gets tired of Japan, India, or South Korea do we just throw our hands up and say "it's easy in the short term though."
This is basically the same argument of why people don't want to help the climate. We have the smartest economist, scientists, strategists in the world. We can solve these problems. But it just seems like everyone is hoping they die before things get bad.
You expect these companies to develop a conscience? They don't give a shit, it's all about profit. They're not gonna move all their infrastructure out of China into another country over this. They would let the planet burn to a crisp before letting their stocks drop.
Let's not forget the American companies that invested in Nazi Germany. This is nothing new.
Nail. Head. Etc etc. As a brown person I’ve seen first hand how Saudis treat brown Muslims. They are treated as untouchable and sub human. These are Chinese Muslims...Saudis don’t care about them.
China has been investing in lots of countries around their as part of their belt & road initiative.
They can pressure many countries to keep silent due to their leverage.
To be fair I don't think it's those countries that would make a difference here.
Economically weak or underdeveloped countries aren't going to be the ones that need to apply pressure to China to force change.
It's China's big trading partners that need to do something. I don't think it's that they're cowards, but that their primary directive is always going to be to protect their own people before protecting the Uighurs, and raising the ire of China is bound to have economic consequences domestically. It's really a shame that TPP got tanked. The world needs to reduce its reliance on China.
What options are left for the international community? Nobody wants to go against China because...money? So I guess a other Holocaust is okay.
The conditions allowing the international community to stand on the sidelines whilst genocide is committed have existed long before the CCP were ever geopolitically relevant.
China is just the latest incarnation.
