Most important line of your review:

"If you understand even a hint of the anguish that Thomasina experiences thinking of the burning of the Alexandria library, and what that meant to human culture and knowledge, then "Arcadia" is very much for you."

Which narrows the 'for you' field down to Michael Peterson, his father, and about 72 other people in Fresno, obviously including you.

It's a HUGELY ambitious undertaking, Donald, for this city and it's fickle audiences. It's more than sometimes daunting for this cast...hell, it's daunting for any cast. Give them credit for trying, but good golly, the running time took a great toll on us audience members as well.

I know you like to take it easier on community theatre, but for the ticket price, I'm going to allow you in the future to be a bit rougher where needs-be.

I was thrilled, I must say, to see this M. Justin Red dude. I've never heard of him, and he was absolutely splendid in his role as Septimus. I agree with you on the other casting (especially Jennifer HP), and I'm glad you're making the rounds on all the new theatre facilities in town.

I intend to also, and I hope others follow, but I do so hope each new company finds a detailed mission statement and sticks with it...for the main goal at some point must be to find an audience, a paying audience of more than just friends and other theatre company folk to keep these arts alive.

Arcadia isn't the best starting point, but bless them for trying, and thank goodness they didn't just roll out another version of Annie to lure the folks in.

Having said all this and supporting the theatre arts as I strive to do, is it just me who is actually a bit scared to see Equus on the community theatre scale soon? (and I say this knowing many in the cast). Here's a show that insists, nay, requires! near perfection in parts, and I am anxious for them.

What do you think, Donald?

Congrats ART! I will see you this weekend!
-Janine

with much appreciation for your support, what is it that scares you?

Greg: He's scared we might succeed. Like most people riding their sassyhorses are. But we will succeed!

Donald: Thank you for coming to see the show, and appreciating all the layers involved in the very complex script. But the most important are the human levels, that all people can understand and connect with.

S

Dearest StephEN,

Due to the fact that two of my previous postings in response to yours have been either removed from this blog or never were posted at all, in keeping with their published standards, I shall endeavor to keep my comments from straying into the personally derogatory and I shall strive to simply address your criticisms point by point.

First off, in response to your not very "anonymous" criticism of myself following our Rogue festival presentation of Love's Fire two years ago: I know my wife is a "better actor" than I am, that's part of the reason why I married her. It's helps to be around people who are better at something than oneself; it keeps one modest. I mention this mostly due to the fact that you imply above that Arcadia is somehow A.R.T.'s "starting" production. It is in fact our fourth, beginning with the aformentioned Love's Fire, continuing with One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, which was both a critical and financial success, completely selling out it's closing weekend at the Severance Building (which should be reopening soon, Hoorah for Chris Campbell!!), next came The Tempest, presented to great acclaim during last year's Rogue, and now Arcadia, which although I don't have the final box office numbers just yet, has drawn far more than 74 people into attendance.

Secondly, considering your record of success at producing live theatre in Fresno, I don't think you have a leg to stand on in criticizing others' choices of material. Both A.R.T. and Theatre Ventoux (and I might include Epic as well) are committed to presenting new, challenging, different, and in word, creative theatre projects to the audience of Fresno. If that serves as enough of a "mission statement" for ya, then so be it. As time progresses (and I speak purely of my own organization here), some of these may be more or less successful in terms of theatrical quality and more or less lucrative in terms of financial success, but it is certainly no business of yours to go calling into question the artistic decisions of anyone besides yourself.

Thirdly, in regard to ticket price, didn't you tell me in the hallway after the show, when you finally put down your cell phone for a whole five seconds, that you had squeeked in as a "student"? Given your comments above, just what exactly is it that you are a student of? My box office manager and I personally would like to know.

In the future, please refrain from thinly veiled personal attacks upon my family members. It is neither gentlemanly nor sporting to mock those whose level of intellect differs from ones own.

Penultimately, considering your willingness to publicize your rather low opinion of the intelligence and "fickleness" of Fresno audiences, I'm not sure how that sits with your claim to be "supporting the theatre arts as I strive to do." Insulting those who occupy the seats around you would hardly seem to be a productive way to show "support."

And last, to your credit, at least THIS time you had the courage to append your name to your uninvited comments, rather than taking pot-shots from under the cover of anonymity.

I'm looking eagerly forward to YOUR next show,

M. Peterson
Teacher / Actor (though some would quibble) / Gardener / Chef / and now I suppose I may add "director" as well

"Wherever you go, there you are"

Regarding Stephen's comment "Having said all this and supporting the theatre arts as I strive to do, is it just me who is actually a bit scared to see Equus on the community theatre scale soon?"

Oh yes, I too am shaking with fear and anger that these ignorant and untalented Fresnans would attempt such an important work as "Equus"!

Dude, how arrogant can you be? Do you really have such a high opinion of yourself? If you TRULY support local theater, you should be excited that someone is going to do "Equus" locally. (Don't you think we deserve to see this?) Instead, you appear ready to stand in judgement of the attempt, as if anything less than perfection would be a failure. Sure, "Equus" is a major work that requires delicate handling to succeed, and whomever attempts it has got a lot to answer for; but to haughtily assume that such a work is beyond the grasp of a local theater group is demeaning to the group and to the Fresno audience.

If you ever wanna be a successful director again, you gotta give your audience a LITTLE credit.

I find it interesting that you would laud ART for attempting "Arcadia" in lieu of another "Annie" in one breath, and scoff at an attempt of "Equus" in the next; it would seem that you yourself don't know what the hell you expect from the local theater companies. ("Annie"=bad/"Equus"=bad?) But for myself, I'll take risky theater any day.

BTW, GCP is currently doing "Fiddler". At least theres no chance of an "Equus"-style screw-up THERE. Bon appetite.

Whoa.

There wasn't anything personal at ALL in my comments. I'm sorry you took them that way.

And I LOVED 'Cuckoo's Nest.'

AND I wasn't insulting the folks who attended Arcadia. I simply noted that lovers of Stoppards type of word-smithing are likely very few. I've never been a fan of Stoppard's, and I mentioned you and your father because you've both long been fans of intriguing word-play. Where most people do the 'man from Nantucket' limericks, you and your father were both known for heavy use of multi-syllabic limericks referring instead to 'decolletage.' Arcadia is of course your cup of tea...just not mine.

My reviews of shows are my opinion, and just that. I'm not required to love every show I see, but in turn, let's not make things personal. I know Arcadia was your baby, but I have nothing personal against you or your efforts. As you can see, I totally applaud your efforts in bringing theatre to Fresno.

As to Greg's query....Oh, Greg, I dunno. Equus is one of those plays I'm really attached to, and it requires such keen finesse and skill that many professional companies are unable to do it justice. VERY unfortunately I was unable to see your last show, but heard raves about it, so I'm sure Equus is a responsible choice for you, but it makes an Equus lover like myself anxious (note: not a lover of horses, mind you! Just of great plays).

I do wish all our local companies the best of success, but as a long-time theatre lover, I'm entitled to my opinions and reviews. Much better than blowing smoke, yes?

(And yes, Michael, my ticket was a student ticket. It was bought for me by a student, and I took advantage. Shameless.)

"From the start, it's been the theatre's business to entertain people." - Bertolt Brecht

Fresno's not a theatre town.
If it was, the Warner and Tower Theatres wouldn't be empty nearly every night of the year, and the most technically lavish shows in town would not be put on by high schools.

With that in mind, running a theatre company in Fresno is an uphill battle already. Why make it more difficult than it already is by performing shows that don't appeal or communicate to a Fresno audience?

I'm not saying you should do Annie, because quite frankly, I don't feel Annie appeals to a Fresno audience. Neither does Fiddler on the Roof. (How many Jews of Russian descent are there in Fresno? 12? Do all of them go to the theatre?)

Do a show about young apathy;
Do a show about being robbed;
Do a show about long hot summers and sweltering nights with nothing to keep you cool but a swamp cooler;
Do a show about not being able to find a job;
Do a show about a community going through a brain drain;
Do a show about people who boomerang back to their hometown;
Do a show about smog and gas prices and no effective public transportation;

Do a show that speaks to Fresno, the Fresno condition, and to the people likely to attend theatre here.

Only then might you be able to make this a theatre town, and in the process, your theatre company will succeed.

If you agree with Brecht, then it is not theatre's business to be edgy, unless the audience finds that edge entertaining.

Brecht was edgy, sure, but would anyone know who he was if he hadn't had an audience?

Right on, KJ, thanks for using your words better than I ever could have hoped.

For me, Childrens' Musical Theatre doing 'Into the Woods' and 'Tommy' was edgy, but entertaining, really well done, and therefore succesful (and drew an audience).

Arcadia is a long reach, and I would have loved to see ART do Arcadia in 5 years to their established large loyal crowd.

Equus, Nate, SHOULD be seen in Fresno, but Shaffer's work shouldn't be toyed with...and I see from the casting that Greg is playing the lead (and directing?) role of Dysart.

Whew. That's a huge huge undertaking. I want to see Equus, but I don't want ANY of our new companies to not succeed, and Equus along with Arcadia are challenging starts to try to lure in loyal and constantly growing audience members.

I give EPIC credit for doing absolutely new and unknown shows, and I wish I could write about them but I've seen just one EPIC show so far.

And Nate/Michael - This isn't about me. Nor is it about my "career" as a director. It SO much isn't about me since I haven't done a theatre show in 4 years! But it is about the city I love, and like it or not I've got a little teeny bit of experience here, so I continue to write, albeit as a supporter of the arts rather than IN the arts.

Finally, God Bless Good Company for doing Fiddler. For popular musicals is what they do, selling seats and dinner and drinks to stay alive. They cannot be judged harshly for their choices...they feel art doesn't sell in Fresno.

I'm counting on Greg, Chris, and Janine to add to Marcel and Joel Dyer's legacy in proving them wrong!

Go forth and create!

Thank you for your clarifications StephEN,

As a theatre company, those of us who started A.R.T. did so basically because we wanted to do the shows we wanted to do in the way we wanted to do them. That's a bit redundantly repetitive, but what it means to me is that artistic integrity trumps marketing concerns every time. We certainly don't want to be losing money on our shows, but the spark that ignites what we do isn't out there in the community; it's inside OUR hearts and souls and minds where something begins to burn and WE do the work to create a little smoldering mess of short one acts or a big conflagration of complicated cacophony. (Ooh.. there I go with the multisyllabic words again, and in alliteration, no less.) In any case, we absolutely hope that people will be interested to come see what we do, but that's not what drives our decisions about what sort of fire to build. (Is it OK to use a fire metaphor in a theatre blog?)

KJ, What play is it that would address the themes you describe? Is there one out there somewhere which I haven't heard of? The Sign in Sidney Brustein's Window is about disaffected young politicos in a big sweltering city, but we did that years ago at Theatre3, Streetcar Named Desire is pretty steamy and lackadaisical, but they did that one at City College just a while back, Cat on a Hot Tin Roof was done at the Laundromat way back when... (Actually, maybe it's time to think about that one again... oops, me and my big mouth!) But seriously, if you've got a suggestion we're open to it. Come talk to us.

Finally in closing, the limerick you mentioned goes like this:

There once was girl from Bryn Mawr,
Who committed a terrible faux pas,
She loosened a stay
On her decolleté
Exposing her je ne sais quois!

Thanks for remembering it.

Donald Munro responds: I haven't weighed in so far with a comment on this thread because, frankly, I've been so crazy busy. (Out of town guests, along with a full theater and movie lineup, will do that to you.) I've already had a chance in my "Arcadia" review to have my say on the production, and I won't add to that except to say: I genuinely liked the show. I know that some folks wish I'd be harder on community theater, and that's a completely subjective call, but I will say that for me, the strengths of this "Arcadia" far outweighed any weaknesses. StepheN, you grant me permission to "be a bit rougher where needs be" when it comes to community theater, but I think what you were really saying is that you wanted me to be rougher on this play. It's your perogative to feel that way, of course, just as it's mine to think differently.

A couple of other points:

1) I don't think a theater company has a "responsibility" to be successful, either financially or artistically, any more than a painter has to make works that sell. The art (which in itself is in the eye of the beholder) is in the creative process. With that said, it's nice if a theater company does manage to pull in audiences and become self-sustaining because it is, in essence a collaborative art form that requires a certain amount of infrastructure, and it's sad when they fail and then we're left with no theater at all. And if you're an investor in a show, or even a financial supporter of a non-profit, I suppose there's another sense of responsibility involved. But a bunch of people who form their own company and stage what they want? They don't owe anyone anything. If they put on dreck, then no one will come. Including me.

2. Audience numbers aren't the only criteria for success. I saw some incredible theater in New York at off-off-off-off-Broadway venues, and I remember once at a tiny theater on 42nd Street being one of only five in the audience.

3. Re ticket prices: I don't think $15 (or $12 in advance) is high for a live performance at the community-theater level. It's a couple of dollars more than what you pay for a movie. And it's certainly not in the $40-$50 range that professional theater companies charge -- and for which you should rightly expect a professional experience.

4. I wouldn't worry too much about the upcoming "Equus." If it doesn't work, then it doesn't work. If Theatre Ventoux wants to tackle such an ambitious work, more power to them. They aren't forcing anyone to go.

5. I assume that KJ was being facetious in his or her comments regarding the viability of "Fiddler on the Roof" in this market. Why do you think Good Company keeps bringing it back?

6. One last thought: It's nice to see so much passion out there about local theater. Thanks, everyone, for reading. And don't hesitate to let me know what you think. What I like so much about this grand new world of Internet journalism (other than the fact that writers are getting laid off by the bunch, at least at other papers) is that it allows a much more collaborative interactive process with readers, especially when it comes to criticism.

Thank you for your thoughtful response Donald, you hit the nail on the head!

It's also nice to know that you follow up on these threads to keep tabs on what's happening. I/we look forward to your commentary in the future.

Many years ago I sat in a theater seat next to a Jewish friend who looked around herself in amazement, at a full theater, and said "Look at all these good Christians coming to see a show about a bunch of Jews".

I am actually really involved in theater in Fresno. Deeply involved and have seen the good and bad of theater. And I am not talking about the show on stage. Besides all the arrogance and egos every theater has here, theater companies have to deal with limited exposure of the Fresno audience. Since this article was about "Arcadia" and I saw and read "Arcadia", I will use it as reference. "Arcadia" is a good example, as with other theater companies, of how Fresno theater is trying to grow. "Arcadia" is a very smart play and requires strong actors . The ART company wasn't bad, they were actually good, but I would not say they were great. This play is an acting challenge but Fresno actors do not get a chance to do a play this challenging with a lot of dialouge about eighteenth century gardens. Actors in Fresno need challenging plays to become better. I hope the actors involved in this show and all actors in any show learn more about their craft and use any praise and CRITICISM as a tool to analyze their work. Truth is everyone in anything can become better if one is willing to stop patting one's own back. This happens a lot in the Fresno communtiy.

The Fresno audience needs to see more challenging plays. Audiences have become lazy. A play is supposed to make you feel involved-- the interaction between the audience and the actors on stage is what makes theater beautiful. It is hard to do that in Fresno when Fresno only wants to see want classic but overdone shows such as Fiddler or South Pacific, but after they ask for these type of shows, they don't come out to see them. Greg doing Equus is ballsy but Greg is ballsy. It might not be a great production or have Harry Potter, but how many chances is Fresno going to have to see "Equus" or actors perform "Equus". The same thing with Janine doing "Marisol" and Mike with "Arcadia". These new companies are bringing more challenging theater that would not normally be done in Fresno. They are giving actors more opportunities to perform. I am still a student, but I am always glad to see roles meant for a forty-something played by one. Fresno State is great and has some talented students, but Fresno audiences should not be limited to just challenging college theater and even State feels the limitations in material. The actors and technicians there should not be limited to just school productions as an outlet since they will not be students forever. And GCP has been pillar in Fresno theater, but it alone can't keep it up. They try to bring in shows like "Miss Saigon" but Fresno audiences didn't want to see that type of show involving the sadness and brutality of war. GCP has produced numerous shows that were well executed and no one saw them. Then they put on shows that are not really good at all but the audience loves it. Then they will do one that the audience asks for but no on wants to see it. Even a company of 35+ years doesn't always have the audience figured out.

The audience and the company need to challenge each other. That is how Fresno theater will grow and any theater to become really profitable.

anonymous: thanks for your perspective. i happen to think you're spot on...but that could have something to do with the fact that you echo my thoughts on the matter.

one point of clarification, though: lisa chose and is heading up the "equus" production...but that's ok...she's ballsy, too!

etonne-moi!

Just a note to Stephen: I appreciated chattin' with you recently at Veni. Man, you really know how to take a 'punch'. I respect you for it.

That evening, you made a great a point in just a few words, and that was to note that a healthy dialogue -- however fiery -- can only help to stimulate artistic growth. And, as you wrote above, it need never become personal. I hope I didn't insult you in print.

Cheers, bro. ~Nate